i don't think aespa should have been four members

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    this perf popped up in my recs by chance since i've been watching some recent performances and idk if its mostly the choreo's fault, but these four members do not fill up a stage when they dance. i know they've gotten a lot of critique for their dancing before, but i honestly think if two stronger dancers had been added to the lineup the lackluster visual aspect of their performances wouldn't be as obvious. all i can think of is groups like secret and sistar who were also four members but were able to command the stage during group performance. aespa would be better off with similar energy. it will be interesting to see if they improve in the years to come

  • AllKill VIP

    its the choreographer


    SM needs to let go of some of the useless people they are working with

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  • AllKill VIP

    God save agencies with debuting more groups with just 4 members

    one scandal kick-out, one long term injury, one anxiety hiatus

    and it might be a multiple months pause for whole group or straight game over

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    I disagree because even if dancing is not their main strenght, there is no filler member in the group. They are talented and they all have their own fanbase to support them even Giselle who seems to be the least popular member has a solid fandom behing her and she is becoming more popular these days.


    Too much girl would not be a great idea for their "We saved Kwangya so were are the chosen ones" concept let alone the expensive cost for eah girl's ae.

  • AllKill VIP
    Quote from aclassyteaparty

    all i can think of is groups like secret and sistar who were also four members but were able to command the stage during group performance.

    maybe because beside 3-4 performances secret and sistar were always performing with Backup dancer '-'


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    and i can go on and on


    and they weren't using back up dancers, they used to put a lot of things in the background to make the scene smaller, so it looks less big when theey were just 4 of them performing


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    ...aespa also had backup dancers in the perf in the op and it was still lackluster, so? their stage presence is also not rlly that great to me. you don't have to agree with my opinion. if its the choreo its the choreo but i just think their perfs would look better with more than four members. thats it.

  • AllKill VIP

    But i can agree that it's something i notice in pretty much all their choregraphy, i don't know who's their choregrapher, but he seems to often make more "confine" formation for aespa and not make a lot of open formation i don't know how to explain

    but in most of their formation they seems really close to each other in contrary of trying to espace themselves to use the whole stage in their choregraphy


    since we were talking about Secret and sistar let me take some example


    for example there Secret and Aespa are using the same formation but because there's a lot more space between each member of Secret it looks like filling up the stage more than aespa


    Screenshot 2023-01-03 18.52.59.pngScreenshot 2023-01-03 18.52.45.png


    or here in contrary of giving them a formation in line in the chorus to make it look like the stage is more full their choregrapher tend to always go for a diamond shape formation (and it's not the first time i notice it he was doing the same for next level )

    the problem is that with the diamond shape formation you just see 3 members on a big stage so it suddenly look more empty than it is in contrary of Sistar who used to do the line formation where they were all standing in a line so it make the stage look fuller than it is


    Screenshot 2023-01-03 18.58.24.pngScreenshot 2023-01-03 19.01.15.pngScreenshot 2023-01-03 19.01.01.png

    For some reason, this reminds me of the whole fiasco that aespa was going to have more members added to their group.


    I'm so glad they didn't. Some people might've wanted it but we've seen or heard about how much undeserved hate Yeri got when she was added to the group after Red Velvet's debut. I'd hate to see that happen again even though it's so rare in the KPOP industry.

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  • AllKill VIP
    Quote from aclassyteaparty

    ...aespa also had backup dancers in the perf in the op and it was still lackluster, so? their stage presence is also not rlly that great to me. you don't have to agree with my opinion. if its the choreo its the choreo but i just think their perfs would look better with more than four members. thats it.

    well we clearly don't see the same performance, because in 99% of the performance you don't even see the back up dancer considering that the cameraman is doing some close shot on the girls

    and when doing full shot try his best to not show the back up dancer


    in comparison of their other performances with backup dancer on Girls, and if you tell me it looks empty on this performance i clearly don't see your point at all


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  • AllKill VIP

    I do agree that Sistar uses a lot of backup dancers for most of their stages.


    So I think maybe we can use this example with no backup dancers for a fairer comparison. It's their reunion stage in 2022, and they haven't perform as a group for 5 years since 2017. But then again Sistar is a way way way more senior group


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    I kinda agree with your point a bit about the formation. It's not just aespa but 4th gen as a whole, their dances focus a lot on formations whereas a lot of 2nd gen dances are more linear? 4th gen dances plays with the camera a lot so a lot of dances tend to focus on that? And this is especially true for Girls

    The choreographer should change and the 4 members should be kept in line. I didn't like that a member was left behind since debut.


    I think the only risky part of being a 4 member is that if one member gets sick, the performance as a group will be cancelled. Or the foreign member wants to return to her country. Then the group may have to disband. Plus member is always advantageous in my opinion.

  • AllKill VIP

    Everyone blaming Aespa or the choreographers is wrong.


    The problem is their discography is not conducive to performances. How do you "command" a stage to songs like BM, NL and Savage? They're slow ass rap songs with belting vocal bridges. I think only the choruses of Black Mamba and Girls allow idols to flex their stage presence, the rest of the parts for all four songs are not conducive to performing. You could take any four members of BTS, Ateez, Itzy, or Lesserafim and none of them would make those songs stand out.

  • AllKill VIP

    They just need stage presence. I think they take their concept and fierceness to mean cold, but you can still be entertaining while being fierce. Giselle is the best performer imo because it seems like the doesn't take the group that seriously period (not in a shady way) she's just there to have fun.


    Better dancers would just make the performance gap all the more apparent

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  • AllKill VIP
  • AllKill VIP

    i think one of the reason the choreo looked so cramp because SM like to add ae to the dance performance?


    Aespa choreo only worm with close-up camera work. They are not meant for stage. Like many of u pointed out, the stage looks so empty. Actually this problem also faced by BP in some tracks BUT yg choregrapher like to use the 'walk around', 'bounce around' or even the sweeping floor movement LOL


    So that's the difference. People see BP as more energetic but aespa as more "boring" but the real problem is the type of choreo

    Quote from Daisy_Queen

    They just need stage presence. I think they take their concept and fierceness to mean cold, but you can still be entertaining while being fierce. Giselle is the best performer imo because it seems like the doesn't take the group that seriously period (not in a shady way) she's just there to have fun.


    Better dancers would just make the performance gap all the more apparent

    Ningning, karina and winter are all decent dancer to be honest (stage presence is debatable). So it is really not THAT BAD as people like to perceive them as.

    Here we go again with Masters of stage presenciology

    we need to let go aespa stage presence discourse in 2022


    aespa with only 4 members takes a long time for comeback, I can't imagine if they have more members probably needs even more time to comeback because of the ae concept.


    The reason = bad choreos (78364 choreographers but couldn't put up decent choreo) + SM inability to putting ae-aespa to perform with aespa on stage. Their title tracks are talking about their universe ofc you non fans couldn't relate and find it lacking.

    It would have been perfect if SM able to putting ae-aespa and aespa together on stage but oh well....

    Quote from kingkook

    I'm guessing you never felt this way with NewJeans even though their stage presence isn't the best either. This thread reeks hypocrisy.

    i don't think i've ever made a thread about new jeans performances either way for you to call me a hypocrite for an opinion i've...never shared. maybe stop throwing around buzzwords that don't even fit a situation? i actually thought a few of newjeans earlier performances were a bit awkward. but their dances are fun and they don't look bad if the members aren't in sync because of how they are choreographed. and newjeans do fill up a stage


    yes, this is a better perf to me than the girls perf in the op. same set up, only the members on stage, not the craziest camerawork. and danielle and hanni have a LOT of stage presence actually, and are praised a lot for it. if you can't see it idk what to tell you.

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    Quote from aclassyteaparty

    i don't think i've ever made a thread about new jeans performances either way for you to call me a hypocrite for an opinion i've...never shared. maybe stop throwing around buzzwords that don't even fit a situation? i actually thought a few of newjeans earlier performances were a bit awkward. but their dances are fun and they don't look bad if the members aren't in sync because of how they are choreographed. and newjeans do fill up a stage


    yes, this is a better perf to me than the girls perf in the op. same set up, only the members on stage, not the craziest camerawork. and danielle and hanni have a LOT of stage presence actually, and are praised a lot for it. if you can't see it idk what to tell you.

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    Well I did expect you to say NewJeans are better performances than Aespa, even though the main reason you think they look better is because of the choreography. Also not at you being biased and saying Danielle and Hanni have a "LOT" of stage presence for dancing precisely and being expressive on stage. Even Aespa does that.


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    Quote from kingkook

    Well I did expect you to say NewJeans are better performances than Aespa, even though the main reason you think they look better is because of the choreography. Also not at you being biased and saying Danielle and Hanni have a "LOT" of stage presence for dancing precisely and being expressive on stage. Even Aespa does that.


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    what are you even trying to argue here? i didn't even say new jeans are "better performers". i said i think the new jeans perf i posted is better than the perf in the op. thats it. i don't watch enough aespa perfs to have a fully informed opinion of each individual member's stage presence. the context of the op is solely the perf in the op and my general opinion based on it and some clips ive seen of their other perfs. i just generally had the the thought that their group perfs would look better to me if they had 1or 2 extra members that could carry their dances. none of that says "aespa are bad performers that cant dance". thats what you and others in this thread inferred. and you're the one that brought new jeans into it...like? obviously i see something special in them bc i stan them?

  • AllKill VIP
    Quote from aclassyteaparty

    what are you even trying to argue here? i didn't even say new jeans are "better performers". i said i think the new jeans perf i posted is better than the perf in the op. thats it. i don't watch enough aespa perfs to have a fully informed opinion of each individual member's stage presence. the context of the op is solely the perf in the op and my general opinion based on it and some clips ive seen of their other perfs. i just generally had the the thought that their group perfs would look better to me if they had 1or 2 extra members that could carry their dances. none of that says "aespa are bad performers that cant dance". thats what you and others in this thread inferred. and you're the one that brought new jeans into it...like? obviously i see something special in them bc i stan them?

    Tbh the performance you linked in the OP isn't even their best one. I don't understand why you keep bringing up the free SM concert performance you linked when others here have linked much better recent performances of theirs. It's a popular opinion even among fans that the Girl's choreo isn't good. Adding two back up dancer idols wouldn't solve this problem.

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    Quote from kingkook

    Tbh the performance you linked in the OP isn't even their best one. I don't understand why you keep bringing up the free SM concert performance you linked when others here have linked much better recent performances of theirs. It's a popular opinion even among fans that the Girl's choreo isn't good. Adding two back up dancer idols wouldn't solve this problem.

    bruh...what? because that was the perf that came into my recs and the perf the op is about?? like the op says? y'all really don't be reading ops and just come in guns blazing based on assumptions :huuh: can we not make threads just because anymore? none of my friends care about aespa so I shared a random thought. it is not that deep. i have seen stuff from other aespa perfs and i didn't like it. spamming me with other perfs isn't going to magically change my opinion.


    and you could have just said you don't agree with adding other members is the problem instead of goading me into a pointless convo by bringing up newjeans. js. i even said in the op "idk if its just the choreo". and plenty of people said "yeah its just the choreo".

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