I dont understand how ppl say Ive is weak internationally

honestly idkk, personally it think it might have to do with the fandom size or just that they don't do as well as other ggs comparatively but still do REALLY WELL. i would def not say ive is weak internationally tho

They are popular but their fandom is really weak, they rely almost completely on casuals.

The day they release a song iFans do not like they will tank hard, Kistch has only 50 million streams, this is a huge downgrade from After Like

People here say (desonestly and unfailry) Aespa streams sucks, but every track in My World EP (average of over 150k streams a day) will soon outstream every track in I Am (average 30k streams a day). That's because Aespa has a true core audience to stream them

Kpop fans always exaggerate and think that only nr 1 is relevant

majority of loud ifans are company stans and that what IVE is lacking

Starship is trying some family concerts and stuff, maybe they can foster their own brand of company stans?

Another smart idea would have been to stick them with SM groups and do some joint promos since they are under Kakao umbrella.

You should go into the other threads and read line by line what has been posted.

It is mainly their growth has slowed down a lot in comparison with other groups which are still growing at the very quick rate. All groups have already peaked or almost peaked in Korea, so it means that they are not growing as fast for whatever reason(s) globally as the other groups. Who really knows what the exact reasons are, and its most probably multiple reasons.

Also 1 great stan attractor is good, but 4+ good stans attractors is better. BP is all elite. Twice is all elite. You can say that about the other groups too.

Based on my observation of music show votings the core fandom has grown massively. Love Dive was the turning point and now most recently in I AM era the voting has been on a new level. IVE would get utterly destroyed last year in votings that didn't heavily bias Korean votes (eg. MCountdown) but this time around it was quite different.

The votes that are completely online and not restricted to Koreans depend heavily in international core fandom size. While Spotify charting also depends on that there are quite a lot of other factors. For example, what core fandom did Fifty Fifty have? Same can be said for Love Dive last year, there was no core fandom worth mentioning at the time and it did super well long term on Spotify.

Full album streaming is a valid point I guess since that would mostly be streamed by core fans. I have a ton of streams for Aespas album though because I always listen to the full album as it's only 5 songs. For IVE I'm rarely listening to all 11 songs in one go

There's also the whole playlisting and pay-for-autoplay that we simply don't know the real impact of but it's undeniable at this point that companies are resorting to both - which I can't fault them for, it's effective marketing.

To be honest I think they should focus on promotion in Asia for now and let things run their course. They could increase fandom size and sales in SEA/China in my opinion and I guess that's why they are doing a SEA tour next. I'm usually not a fan of these 'forced' US promotions, it makes sense once the demand is already there, eg. NewJeans.

give it a time, ive is doing good, ppl say they need to promote more in int, but is it really easy to do that? starship is almost have zero presence in int(public int) , except prob monsta x(even this i'm not sure), like it or not the diff betwen big 4 and other is the foundation they build, nowdays everything need connection, even to be in good playlist you need connection, the only exemption prob if you have viral song like fifty fifty

Quote from Icaro_Ribeiro

They are popular but their fandom is really weak, they rely almost completely on casuals.

The day they release a song iFans do not like they will tank hard, Kistch has only 50 million streams, this is a huge downgrade from After Like

People here say (desonestly and unfailry) Aespa streams sucks, but every track in My World EP (average of over 150k streams a day) will soon outstream every track in I Am (average 30k streams a day). That's because Aespa has a true core audience to stream them

I think aespa is bad comparison, because aespa released some kind of music video by every track they have on the album. IVE did not promote that much their b sides.

Quote from purepalette

Aespa streams do suck for their title tracks, they’ve got a fanbase but their title tracks are nugu level. They peaked with savage and declined since I fear

Having just casuals isn’t even a drag tbh when at this pace it’s only a matter of time that ive grows a bigger fandom then aespa anyways.

In my opinion having a big fandom is much more important than having casuals. Aespa streams don't suck, their streams are good actually and better than Ive's, title track is not the only bing that matters

I'm not sure about Ive growing bigger fandom than Aespa, Aespa last album sold more and also grewn more too. Aespa charted more song on Melon and got better streams for their b-sides. They have a big and healthy fandom, and mind you Aespa came from a bunch of flop title tracks, Ive came from a smash hit

Quote from kirishiki

I think aespa is bad comparison, because aespa released some kind of music video by every track they have on the album. IVE did not promote that much their b sides.

Savage EP have great streams and the songs have no MV. Aespa b-sides get MVs because the company see value in them, not the other way around

people see a downward trend and assume its going to continue forever, same reason people pick the stock market so inaccurately, they assume a trend is permanent

Quote from catzi

So 1.5m casuals bought their full album?

Interesting. All of these ggs sell around the same number and Ive is the only one with weak fandom?

Streams on Spotify come mostly from western fans and SEA fans, generally speaking when people say internationally I'm inclined to understand "western" if you're including China, Japan and SEA on internationally then I agree the claims about Ive been weak are unfounded, they are strong internationally

people think u are not from big 3/4 you can't have big intl fandom

Quote from Icaro_Ribeiro

Savage EP have great streams and the songs have no MV. Aespa b-sides get MVs because the company see value in them, not the other way around

aespa barely got any music during savage episode so a lot of casuals listen to their music during that era. If you look at Girls episode, only songs that got music video or got some kind of special promotion reach over 10m streams.

Quote from kirishiki

aespa barely got any music during savage episode so a lot of casuals listen to their music during that era. If you look at Girls episode, only songs that got music video or got some kind of special promotion reach over 10m streams.

True. Still Aespa last album has more streams on Spotify than YT, I'm sure most of people who listened to their last album didn't even watched the MVs (I personally didn't). The fact they can keep a stable influx on streams for their b-sides implies they have a stable and big fandom

Quote from catzi

IVE was the first 4th gen gg to chart in US.

With what song? Curious because I genuinely had no idea

Their last album only reached 57 in top album sales chart. Sure they lack US distribution, but still pretty weak

I think they have many casual listeners in Japan and west, but not a big fandom. They have a very big fandom in Korea and China. They might have a big fandom in SEA, I don't follow their stats there

AL had way more hype so it did better initially but I AM is showing good longevity so far. Aside from NJ, no 4th gen group really does well internationally.

Quote from vzal

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AL had way more hype so it did better initially but I AM is showing good longevity so far. Aside from NJ, no 4th gen group really does well internationally.

That's wrong though lesserafim antifragile really do great on Spotify the song charted more than 100 days on global Spotify that makes them the fifth group done this feat and unforgiven still charting on Spotify too.

How dare they not pull 500 million daily spotify streams! That's definitely your main way of making money cause we all know how well spotify pays the artists!

Quote from One-and-only

That's wrong though lesserafim antifragile really do great on Spotify the song charted more than 100 days on global Spotify that makes them the fifth group done this feat and unforgiven still charting on Spotify too.

Antifragile did really well, yeah but Unforgiven isn't. I AM is doing better than it on Spotify. Here are their streams 3 weeks after release.

Even if you compare I AM current numbers(1.2M), Unforgiven is only ahead by 100k streams which isn't that big of a difference considering I AM was released weeks before it.

Quote from catzi

I dont remember, but I do remember a thread on akp about it. As you can see in these stats, they have strong interest in the west and these are just examples.

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I mean no offense, but the problem is people like you that don't even bother searching and verifying the truth before spreading misinformation based on "me thinks".

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All those stats are about singles and title tracks. I still see no evidence they have big fandom outside Korea and China.

Take Les Serafim, they have nothing bigger than Love Dive or After Like, but Unforgiven album debuted with streams 57% higher than Ive full album. That's because LSRF has a very strong fandom too, just like Aespa

Quote from vzal

Antifragile did really well, yeah but Unforgiven isn't. I AM is doing better than it on Spotify. Here are their streams 3 weeks after release.

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Even if you compare I AM current numbers(1.2M), Unforgiven is only ahead by 100k streams which isn't that big of a difference considering I AM was released weeks before it.

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Unforgiven was badly received. Just that. LSRF have a big fandom, look at Antifragile and Fearless b-sides, they are really strong. Of course nothing on NJ level, but they are showijg very promising signs nonetheless

Quote from Icaro_Ribeiro

All those stats are about singles and title tracks. I still see no evidence they have big fandom outside Korea and China.

Take Les Serafim, they have nothing bigger than Love Dive or After Like, but Unforgiven album debuted with streams 57% higher than Ive full album. That's because LSRF has a very strong fandom too, just like Aespa

no, lesserafim's streams mostly come from hybe stans, just like nj's streams. those groups don't have strong fandoms of their own, only company stans, bc they come from hybe, duh

Quote from whisk

no, lesserafim's streams mostly come from hybe stans, just like nj's streams. those groups don't have strong fandoms of their own, only company stans, bc they come from hybe, duh

Seems indeed like the narrative Dives are strongly trying push here

Enhypen debut was really good too, and so was Seventeen's, so they might think they have a point

Fortunetly Boy Next Door will bomb hard time and will dismantle this idea

Feel bad for the guys because I loved their first song. Rest assure BND, your sacrifice won't be in vain

Quote from whisk

no, lesserafim's streams mostly come from hybe stans, just like nj's streams. those groups don't have strong fandoms of their own, only company stans, bc they come from hybe, duh

So? That doesn’t change anything. Yes being in a bigger company gives you a bigger fandom. The point is a fandom is someone who will give you streams across the album instead of just the TT. This is actually not a wrong assessment.

Personally I don’t know IVE’s exact stats so I won’t comment on it. But the assessment of itself is not a wrong/incorrect metric.

Quote from Icaro_Ribeiro

Seems indeed like the narrative Dives are strongly trying push here

Enhypen debut was really good too, and so was Seventeen's, so they might think they have a point

Fortunetly Boy Next Door will bomb hard time and will dismantle this idea

Feel bad for the guys because I loved their first song. Rest assure BND, your sacrifice won't be in vain

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These two things need not be mutually exclusive tbh. A good song released from HYBE will receive higher streams than a good song released by someone else. Doesn’t mean that every single HYBE release and group is going to be great and all perform the same.