Posts by onwards

Low key funny how reddit is still silent about this, they can't even pretend not to be biased

Quote from Tru-Multistan

These are very good points. I guess thats why the other user mentioned the age of the groups, makes sense. I was not looking at is as them trying to replace, but just intentionally using NJs style to initially draw attention to Illit. But I would agree from your perspective.

Even if you think its just to draw attention, its the worst way to do it for everyone involved. The most attention is on a group at their debut, they essentially relegated Illit to forever be associated with being copies, if they are lucky it'll only follow the group, but it could end up following the members in their individual careers too. Everything they do, people will always look for the 'original' and that also makes the general audience disengage.

It also destabilised newjeans' fanbase with all the infighting about copies and lead to people leaving their fangroup to follow illit.

Theres a limited amount of fans and this is during an economic recession which means they are being more selective in their purchases. Hybe actively put them in competition with each other to build fanbases from the same target group. Not only does it make the sound age faster so limits long term profits, but it also makes it harder to predict demand for both groups because you never know which fans will engage with more.

Groups with simular concepts always limit each others growth or strangles the success of the other, its why companies are always desperate to differentiate every group and one of the reasons why companies alternate between BG and GG's, Hybe is so desperate for quick cash they are acting short sighted.

Cute song,not my vibe but cute. Also, is it just me or was momo singing the majority of the song???? love that for her but so unexpected!

Quote from patrik-k

Not sure if I reading this correctly, but is over 40 % of the buyers of IVE albums women in the 40ies? that cant be right?

It is, its mothers buying for their underage kids (mostly daughters).

Quote from Tatiana1820

that's pretty concerning for illit... men (in general) aren't known to be the most loyal fans . they're very fickle.

Whats more concerning is the age range of their male fans, 43% being in their 30's or 50's. Not trying to portray them all as predators but considering the discourse around their clothing its weird. The 30's are probs in the military but the 50's?

Quote from littlemissnoname

I don't care about her dating life but I do hate Zios so it is quite hard to support Lisa.. However, been a BLINK since their debut and considering all the Zio brand deals the Pinks have, I'm not gonna support any of them with real money so yeah. But other than that, kpoppies hate on Lisa dating Fred because she's Thai. If any other Kpop Idol dated him, the hate would be much less

I honestly don't think it has anything to do with her being Thai or that any other idol would get less hate. I think the main reason they hate him so much is he isn't handsome in the traditional sense and despite him having bags of money, they don't think he is famous enough for her so they are using the zionist thing as an excuse. Lets be real here, if he was handsome, they'd have been boasting since day 1 and showing off at how awesome Lisa or any female idol is at picking a BF. They don't so they can't use him to win fanwars or as a her show pony they way they thought Jennies fans did with her exes etc (don't forget that taxi driver gambit about Kai) and to some extent how they likely saw Jisoo coming out as dating her BF. Even non blinks, if they found him hot, they'd be annoyed but at some level would understand (like with Jennie and Karina), this vitriol is simply based on them thinking he doesn't look good enough to be seen with her so she must be selling herself for money. It's can't simply be thats her taste in men or she got to know him and fell for him. Even when she did that burlesque show in France, we all knew she chose to do it but people started rumours it was some kind of initiation for her trying to get into the upper classes and thats why his family went to support her. He's 'ugly' so she must be forcing herself for some greater benefit.

Not to mention, she's out of YG now, they can't blame everything bad on them anymore so they need a convenient strawman to be in 'control' of her actions to blame if and when she does something they don't like, all the better if he is associated with zionist and mega rich, he MUST be holding her hostage somehow, why else would she be with such an 'ugly' guy.

Quote from reverie1

Ador did paid Source ~2 billion won as trainee fee btw.

I know, just pointing out that even if they didn't, it should have made Source want to renew with gfriend even more, not less. They were just once again trying to use fans to fight their battles.

Just saw people once again blaming MHJ for gfriend disbanding thanks to the reunion news and something just occured to me that should have long ago.

If we believe MHJ took the members after training in source and didn't pay source back so what? Isn't that what being a subsidiary is for in times like that? have the parent company fill the hole just like they are doing for every other hybe subsidiary. And even if they didn't, why is your response to being in debt getting rid of the only source of income you got? How does that make any sense? 'I owe money on my credit card so let me refuse this job offer', that is legit the logic Hybe shooters are going with.

The only thing that makes sense is they were planning to shut down (but somehow didn't loose a single employee apart from gfriend and the manager who went with them), they didn't want to split their attention on two groups (which again is dumb) or gfriend whilst profitable, wasn't as profitable as their projected new GG and they wouldn't have to give them a better income split.

Quote from Popper-of-Ks

We need clarification on her plans, because as we've seen in the past, members leaving SM could very easily throw RV into hiatus, and that's assuming she even wants to stay in the group. Why is she looking for an acting agency specifically?

Well she has been in multiple TV series and web dramas, most recently in 2022 so looks like she wants to change to the acting route.

Quote from YamaChwan

It's not about sustaining momentum. Twice already did that at their peak. I'm just curious if they can ever get a big hit song in Korea again.

I feel like they can, if only they promote it properly but they don't seem willing to and honestly can't blame them. TTT did well but part of that was Nayeon going viral for 'professionalism' when she was fixing her top but immediately was in perfect synch when the music started, also those pics of her in the black jumpsuit. They didn't even promote that era in Korea apart from a week of music shows.

Since M&M (and probs before actually) Twice hasn't really promoted in Korea so I always see loads of posts saying they are shocked because they didn't even realise Twice had a CB, especially since they now promote for a week and then dip, they haven't been trying to appeal to the GP in years. Only time they promote a song is when its a solo debut, and even that seems very limited. If they went ham on tv show appearances, yt shows and followed it up with a catch song (even as a pre-release), I'm sure they'd do great. But all pre-releases have been English, promoted in the US and they haven't promoted a b-side since up no more in 2020.

Quote from foreveraespaaa

I agree I think it’s been a lot worse / drastic than the more and more scandal and it doesn’t help HYBE is on fire right now for all the wrong reasons

I didn’t know ILLIT were dragged for vocals or maybe I forgot I think they’re just overshadowed by all the HYBE drama overall. Even their achievements to me don’t feel as grand as they are because HYBE’s drama was always out trending

Honestly they've always been overshadowed by some drama or another. First it was with the programme the debuted under, then it was with the debut concept, I honestly don't know the name of a single member because Hybe hasn't even tried to market them properly.

They were dragged for their costumes alot more than their vocals so maybe you'll remember that. They did get dragged into the vocal convo, but that quickly descended into 'look no Hybe made group can sing apart from newjeans'. Then coachella happened and they were more of a footnote than the main story. I think a member got injured and Hybe started using her for sympathy (plus that video of one of them seeing mean comments which again got hybe dragged from one end of the internet to the other). So many issues but nothing big enough to get them recognisably, solo buzz or even attention for any member. Reminds me of pre-lawsuit 5050 without as big of a hit song which is wild considering how deep Hybes pockets are.

Quote from foreveraespaaa

This is why I was very confused! I thought it couldn’t be HYBE drama because ILLIT is still doing well but then have ILLIT had a recent comeback I don’t follow them and I don’t recall seeing this to finalise this I think the singing scandals did a lot of damage more than people realise right now.

Not to drag twice into this but I think it’s very similar to the more and more scandals and some people report Twice digitals going down after that I think LSF is more drastic though? I guess we can find out next comeback if it’s just the type of songs or people supporting less because of the scandals

Honestly in a way its worse than the Twice issue. For Twice specific members were the target, mainly, momo for her mistakes despite being in her 5th year since debut and if memory serves it also coincided with a chatroom full of anti's doing everything to make the girls miserable from starting rumours to being the driving force behind multiple hate campaigns. ICSM had momo rapping and nahyo singing the bulk then with AF alot of the members were redeemed with the lives, it was just a little too little too late.

LSF was a national embarrassment reported on the news. They were already being dragged for encore vocals long before they were meant to do coachella, so k-netz were already concerned that they'd embarress Korea there, and people expected them to spend time preparing to prove people wrong. Week 1 didn't go well, their responses wasn't what k-netz expected then week 2 didn't go any better. Frankly JYP kept their mouth shut whilst Hybe and Source have been trying media play after media play which only made people more hard hearted towards LSF.

I swear Illit also got dragged for vocals, but it seems to have blown over for them.

Quote from NekoMencer

I frankly don't think they have their independent throught process after all the things they have said and done. I feel they are still under heavy influence of min heejin.

But then the followup question should be - what has Hybe or the new CEO done to form a new connection with them, show they can trust them and de-programme them? From the news we see nothing. From the moment she took charge she's been dismantling the groups content and this is after years of Hybe itself ignoring them. Do they have any reason to believe anyone not MHJ at this point? Has anything Hybe done given them any reason to distrust her or believe Hybe actually wants to protect them and allow them to continue as a group? Hybe hasn't done anything showing they should trust them so why wouldn't they be influenced by her, or more to the point, want back what they had.

Quote from NmiXXSupremacist

A lawsuit for mistreatment without real evidence? Mmm, good luck with that.

I mean they could try for irreconcilable differences, breach of trust or failure to adhere to the contract maybe? (if they knew when signing MHJ would be in charge of them for a certain amount of time and signed based on that)

Quote from NekoMencer

It makes them look unprofessional and lacking as an artist because they are not willing to discuss it privately and also publically refusing to work with new leadership who haven't said anything about nj(negative) in public.

I mean if you read their statement its pretty clear they don't feel like they can trust the new leadership. Not only hiding things from them but directly telling them to ignore hurtful things from ADULTS around them. We have no idea as yet how hard they've tried to work with the new team, but it's not even been a month since the new management came in and they are already at this point. Even looking at whats going on with the dolphiners, fighting over old content despite agreements and if you believe them, its revenge for refusing to work with other Hybe groups. That is far more unprofessional IMO. Especially coming from grown adults not teenagers.

Quote from Anpanromane

best take from the latest reactions

IMO there's still no good side to take. Hybe is shitty at handling njs since MHJ's removal but is mhj really needed as a CEO? What she brought was on the creative and marketing side. It's obvious their relationship (MHJ and njs) make NJ feels like it's the only situation that'll go well for them. And of COURSE hybe's shitty ways just strengthened that impression.

Again the two sides are going extreme with their pov of MHJ. The villainization went too far but the coddling too like she's a relative for someone that is higher in the hierarchy and have known them when they were quite young.

Best solution would be for all to take their sh*t together and for bpd, mhj and the likes to put their egos aside but at that point, it's not realistic

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Honestly tho it makes sense. If we believe the timeline, they trained with the idea of debuting in her group for years, only for Hybe to come a nix it, MHJ fought for them to the point of getting a whole ass company made for their debut. At every level she's involved their parents, they see how other trainees get treated and the apartments they live in then look at what they get. They see their bank balance booming whilst others are drowing in debt and she even made sure they have writing credits on TT's from debut, accepting their ideas on the debut style and when their parents bring up an issue, she handles it even at the risk of arguing with Hybe.

Even if they know she's not all sunshine and rainbows, there must be a level of guilt or dependence seeing someone go that far for you, then they are hit with the stark contrast within weeks. Being ignored, not being believed, no set plan for their future, their content, personal videos and family being take advantage of, used and even their concept stolen all by the same company. I'd side with her too with all that going on. Especially since Hybe seems intent on not protecting them at all.

Best case scenario at this point is for the contract to be broken under irreconcilable differences. Even if they stay and MHJ is reinstated, I think the bad blood would be far too much and it would circle right back,. Especially since we all know Bang is heavily involved with every group but that one and people prioritise that connection. It may be a situation of them getting blackballed in the industry JYJ style, but the situation is far different than it was back then. Even if they can't go on TV to promote, theres YT and with MHJ's creativity, she's sure to find promo strategies that would get around that issue. Only major card Hybe has is BTS and who knows if they'll renew again or even allow their name to be used like that for Bang's pettiness.

As much as it pains me to say, flop.

Don't really like the song and her voice isn't doing it any favours. Love her, but she isn't soloist material to me, she's either smiling or has that bored/confused look and her voice is the same. No emotion is coming through, its almost monotone and that makes the song sound worse than it is. I wanted her to be more of a Sunmi but she isn't expressive enough so she's more like Jisoo but better at singing and dancing (judging from her tour solo).

Came across this which is interesting - so any future Twice solo timings are dependent on who asks first, so Jeongyeon stans your once again out of luck.

Quote from Tatiana1820

what's your source of that in the first place. the sa accusations from b were proven false. factually and by the rh department.

but what i'm potentially seeing is a clear famlash against bang and his creepy make friends and hybe higher ups

The confusion over the SA allegations, Hybe reopening the case under the new CEO and the consistent posts by the supposed victims and them going to the police. I haven't seen anything since MHJ originally clarified it was bullying not SA, but since Hybe has been running with that headline and with the current climate, and her supposedly being abandoned by the feminists, I gather they are working on that angle and may have somewhat succeeded.

Quote from Tatiana1820

'and the woman being mistreated by a male dominated workplace angle seemed to have made alot of korean women leave the fandom.'

i agree with this part onwards .

I actually wonder how much the recent deepfake situ also hurt them. Thanks to this mess people think LSF = Bangs product and Bang = corrupt/sleazy male ceo who likely reminds them of their boss.

Women may not want to support MHJ anymore, but they want to support men like Bang even less so I think they also lost alot of passerby and people aren't even interested in seeing if their skills improve or hate watching anymore.

Quote from StanGIDLE

I am confused why there is such a big drop off. It doesn't make sense for Coachella drama to make them have this big of a drop off.

I think its a mix of things but the main blame is with Hybe and Bang. The coachella and just general singing thing, their response to it, lots of claims of them trend hopping not forming their own sound (at least in TT's), fans buying less due to the recession, multi's being more selective were bad but if they'd stayed silent, stayed away for a while and came back with a more vocal focused song they would have been fine, problem is Hybe is Hybe.

Bang had multiple scandals this year, and since he is heavily involved with them, as more has come out about the management in charge of them, people have become more uncomfortable with their concept and supporting them. Especially since Hybe initially tried to use them as a weapon against MHJ over the source mess, then came the news of source stealing newjeans deal for LSF and then came the income statements where we saw how much more profitable newjeans was despite not going on a tour like LSF. All of this whilst they were getting lashed for their singing skills, responses to it and later source editing their live singing in a video. They got compared alot and the skill difference really hurt them. Whilst she is now disliked by korean feminists, the initial comparison would have been 'newjeans made by a woman for women vs LSF made by men for women but really being for men' and at that point, the difference in treatment by Hybe despite the income (including Bang ignoring newjeans, not remembering their faces compared to taking pics with LSF and his personal messages to MHJ) made things worse. Then MHJ said newjeans almost didn't debut because of Hybes interference and wanting sakura to debut ASAP (which only made the mess worse since her singing is the worst in the group currently and people hated her response the most) and the woman being mistreated by a male dominated workplace angle seemed to have made alot of korean women leave the fandom.

Then KOL got popular right when they were at their lowest and being hidden. They got praised for their skills and not only are KOL all of age but they have chosen to go with a more sexy concept (even giving ideas for some of the more racy scenes) which drew in western female fans and drew a starker comparison. Fact is they lost alot of their female korean and western fans, and apparently, this was pretty clear from their concerts.