Biggest kpop companies after big 3/BH labels?

1st Official Post

    since the top 4 is already clear, which company is the next biggest one?


    If we go by legacy and current success wouldn't it be between Starship and cube? I think digitally and when it comes to impact, cube has the upper hand, but all of Starship active groups have surpassed the 100k+ mark, while from cube, 3 out of their 4 groups can.


    Monsta x and cravity outsell all cube bgs physically, while btob outsells them digitally by a lot. Pentagon had a hit song too

    For ggs it's G-Idle>>wjsn>>>>>CLC

    Idk how their current soloists are doing now but K.Will/Soyu used to be digital monsters and we all know Hyuna legacy.


    Both companies are also planning to debut new ggs and I think the group with Wonyoung and Yujin has a more promising future, but I could be wrong


    Taking all of that into account I still can't decide which one is bigger, probably their variety/actors department can make the difference.


    And there's also RBW and WM, companies with a very bright future that already have top ggs and growing bgs.

    FNC and Woollim used to be big during 3rd gen but both decreased a lot in terms of sales and impact

  • AllKill VIP
    • Official Post

    I used to think CUBE, but they don't have Hyuna anymore, and we don't know what's in store for GIDLE after Soojin's scandal.


    I'm going to say WM, they have Oh My Girl who are basically a top girl group, ONF who have a growing and dedicated domestic fanbase in Korea after RTK, and B1A4 who have Sandeul who has a hit in Korea with Slightly Tipsy.


    I guess Starship could count too if we want to put more emphasis on fandom, Cravity and Monsta X are doing relatively well. WJSN rises up the charts every year with As You Wish + their physicals are pretty stable.

  • AllKill VIP
    • Official Post
    Quote from itiswhatitisss

    I used to think CUBE, but they don't have Hyuna anymore, and we don't know what's in store for GIDLE after Soojin's scandal.


    I'm going to say WM, they have Oh My Girl who are basically a top girl group, ONF who have a growing and dedicated domestic fanbase in Korea after RTK, and B1A4 who have Sandeul who has a hit in Korea with Slightly Tipsy.


    I guess Starship could count too if we want to put more emphasis on fandom, Cravity and Monsta X are doing relatively well. WJSN rises up the charts every year with As You Wish + their physicals are pretty stable.

    Wait we're talking overall success? CUBE by far.

    • Official Post

    I think a lot of people wrote off Starship after Sistar disbanded. Monsta X have been slowly and steadily building up an extremely loyal fanbase. I don't know about their numbers last year, but I believe in 2019 the sales for both their album releases that year were almost identical. Their sales are steady as well which imo is just as impressive as big gains. They've locked in their fanbase. They aren't as flashy on the international market like your BTS or your Blackpink, but they have put in the work.


    MX is definitely about to go on hiatus though because Shownu will have to enlist soon so it's still up in the air imo.

    I think cube would win easily if it wasn't for their latest controversies which put btob and g-idle (their most popular acts) into problems with the korean public (their main market). Monsta x went thru the same but their focus is ifandom so they wont suffer if the koreans turn their back to them as much as btob/g-idle. And their future gg is more promising thanks to Izone fandom


    Then again, with monsta x enlisting soon it's going to be difficult to gain as much money as before since they are the breadwinners rn. Wjsn isn't growing that much either


    Taking all of that into consideration maybe the WM/RBW partnership is the strongest non-big 4 ? Since they show a very promising future thanks to their top ggs and growing bgs that wouldn't have to enlist soon (?

    Cube and Starship are the more traditional mid tier companies, but after BH and big3 wouldn't it be CJ ENM/Stone Music? Stone Music has performed way better than these two more traditional names. It may not have the same legacy, but number wise is way higher than these two to even consider the legacy argument. Dunno why not mention that. We could argue Big 5 with them than saying Cube and Starship are after the big 3.


    If we make a tier list, it would go BH > Big 3 > CJ/Stone Music > the rest. Then we can judge on how to rank the rest.


    After CJ maybe Cube judging by numbers and legacy. Starship and FNC are pretty similar. Starship by itself is actually smaller than expected. More close to Woolim judging numbers. FNC seems like fading, but numbers and performance don't tell that history. It has as much legacy as these two. I guess I'd go with Cube, FNC, and Starship. If ignore size and legacy, maybe Woolim, RBW, and WM should also be considered. Even KQ can enter the conversation soon.


    Dunno how to place Pledis. Maybe people just are bundling it with BH. However, in this case Kakao M should be considered as we talk about Starship? Although it will be a cluster fuck because they have ties with other companies.

    Stone is Izone/Fromis company? I agree they did amazing with Izone but they disbanded already, if not, then w1's company should be considered big 5 due to all the achievements of their temporary bg. The difference is that Cube, FNC, etc have more than 1 famous group, and successful female and male acts. They have a proven legacy with their 2nd gen idols and have continued to produce successful groups until now. That's why I considered them and not produce groups companies.


    Also I think Starship have already surpassed FNC in terms of producing successful groups, tho FNC have the bigger old acts and actors/entertainers .

    Monsta x sells better than sf9 (but rowoon is probably more famous in Korea), AOA is now dead, wjsn sells much better than cherry bullet, cravity sells much better than their new bg. N.flying can chart well but it doesn't compare to the numbers monsta x pull with their concerts and albums. Oh and Jung Sewoon is doing good by himself.


    FNC saving grace is Yonghwa/CnBlue but they aren't really promoting as idols actually

    I get that, but looking at the numbers of Stone Music, it's not even close. I can ignore the legacy/history part because of that. This is the same case as BH and Big 3 argument. At very least CJ is clearly number 4. Now you may not consider them the same as any of these company. Still just Stone Music did way better than Cube and Starship combined multiple times over. With Izone gone, I could not consider them a contender anymore, but the money they made is more than enough to sustain a bad year compared to Cube's and Starship's good years. And CJ support shouldn't be ignored. That's why I named CJ/Stone Music over these two. Their financials are way too good just like BH financials blow big 3 away.


    I'm not using just my opinion on that. Articles and business people will rank them among Cube and Starship as well and they will rank them higher than both of them. They are a company in the same vein of Cube and Starship, so you should judge them as such.


    Now on Starship part I'm kinda surprised because I would think they would be bigger number wise. I'm with you on this case. But when looking at their size and numbers they are kinda in between FNC and Woolim in size. FNC is declining and their 2020 was pretty bad and probably 2021 won't be great, so Starship can surpass them no problem. Starship is part of Kakao M which I should factor in.


    However, even with their artists doing well, it just doesn't translate it that well when talking about size of company. That's why I put FNC ahead of Starship even thou Starship is a better company at the moment. FNC past legacy was enough to carry them till now even with their diminishing influence. However, it's kinda give or take between these two. Cube > Starship > FNC, sure. 2020 numbers just showed FNC were still slightly bigger than Starship even with their losses in 2020 and Starship way better 2020. After 2021 pass, yeah probably Starship will be in a way better position than FNC.


    I'm not in disagreement with Starship case. However, on CJ/Stone Music I think they shouldn't be ignored and they are closer to big 3 size than Cube size even with their lack of legacy. Their bank is really hard to ignore.

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