RE: what do you think happened with itzy

    There are many reasons. Without all of them playing a hand, a group crowned "4th gen queens" doesn't decrease its popularity while we are in era when 4th gen groups are doing better than most of 3rd gen.


    1. JYP's creative direction- With every comeback, not only is their song getting more watered down and somewhat immature. Frankly, they just look/feel too old for their concept

    2. The group- The members don't portray the songs being given to them well to the audience and do them justice with their vocals.

    3. Visual direction/MV- I'll keep this short. Everything is subpar. It looks like a nugu group mv. Uninspired in everything.

    4. JYP's strategy and itzy's assigned role that doesn't fit them- What JYP needed to do with itzy was even if korean charting wasn't very great, they only needed to stick to their plan satisfying global fans which they were doing really well. Even forget korea to focus on global. Yet this was practised by jyp on another group Twice and developed a strategy for itzy to focus on more korea which led to songs to appease koreans which don't even fit the group.

    5. Nmixx- It's no secret this group's debut is hindering itzy from fulfilling their potential which many groups were able to unlike itzy.

    6. Oversaturation of market- "Better ggs with better songs with more success to enjoy. Hell yeah".

    7. Previous comebacks- It hurts a group's image if it's been a while since they have shown something good. And all year it's only huge misses. Maybe they should have considered aespa strategy to think more about what to show. The biggest rule in kpop that needs to be followed is don't comeback twice in a year that u underperformed if your product is nothing short of amazing. Sneakers and Boys Like You were exactly not that. One two knockout punch for itzy.

    Quote from chilltime

    Previous comebacks- It hurts a group's image if it's been a while since they have shown something good. And all year it's only huge misses. Maybe they should have considered aespa strategy to think more about what to show. The biggest rule in kpop is don't comeback twice in a year that u underperformed if your product is not amazing. Sneakers and Boys Like You were exactly that. One two knockout punch for itzy.

    I feel that strategy works (and worked) for Blackpink when there was not much competition debuting. If we're looking at the GG landscape right now, the top groups consist of a 2016 debut, a 2018 debut, a 2019 debut, a (late) 2020 debut, a (late) 2021 debut and then 2 2022 debuts.


    For years the "let's just have long period between CBs to build up hype" worked if there was only a group that made it big debuting once a year, but in the last 12 months we've had 3, with at least 2 others making some sort of noise due to survival show or label.


    I don't think the wait approach will work out. Even Aespa may find headwinds next cb, if it's not top tier, and their in a similar position to Itzy, where they are wedded to a sound, which will cause problems, just like Itzy's sound has, down the road.


    I mean look at IVE. No fuss about some "concept", just releasing whatever song will land well in the market. That means they can pivot to any sound as the market changes and still be there.


    Don't think in the current landscape people can afford to do the BP strategy anymore, or play hard into a specific concept sound.

    Girl group digital performance are carried general public. Personally the song (Chesire) is itzy's top 5 for me so I don't really see the problem with the song. Even I'd say this song is more easy listening than Girls so I guessing this might be because the emergence of new top groups. Honestly the market ( general public) has limited scope for growth. So in a way, if new groups gain lots of listeners because of their song, other may suffer a loss because GP attention is shifted unto new direction. This is a turnaround point and if they want to take the attention back, the company that managed them must find a way to make the GP have interest in them again. This is a task for JYP and they have failed to do the homework in this comeback.


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    itzy already has millions of album sales and idk how much seats they sold in the tour (must be good numbers too) but they still worried about the reaction for their song. I believe this is not only itzy that felt this way but every top girl groups too. The difference maybe they are just too afraid to voiced it out.


    Quote from chilltime

    Maybe they should have considered aespa strategy to think more about what to show.

    No they shouldn't. With 5 new songs in a whole year and minimal appearances isn't sustainable for keeping the interest high. Bubble is the only platform they've keeping up with fans not until the confirmation of their reality show in Wavve ( restricted content only ). Is this good strategy?

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    How many times does aespa members have to say sorry. SM management of aespa is a mess too.

    they always come off as so sweet in these interviews, I hope with music shows Cheshire rises and the girls can feel good about switching their sound

    - their tts are either a hit or a miss and in some their vocals/rap didn't match that much the songs.

    - their style, specially 20/21 were always "ok/bad" like they had really weird outfits sometimes which helped them in nothing while the others top ggs were all with super pretty or at least normal outfits and in kpop visual matters....

    - at one point JYPE marketing and overall strategy towards them screamed and still screams nugu and like I think people just started not caring bc if the company doesn't care enough to treat them like a top group and give them the spotlight they deserve its super extremely difficult that GP will be their saviour, specially for a big4 group.



    I think these could be the "main" reasons.

  • AllKill VIP

    I'm gonna be honest to me what hurts Itzy is that they are a generic with generic sound


    Let me explain myself


    Their love myself lyrics and teen crush sound made them stand out at their debut with dalla dalla,icy etc ... No other group were doing teen crush and girl crush wasn't as big than it is right now

    So it helped them to stand out to go for something that not everybody was doing


    The thing is that with the years this type of message in lyrics and teen crush concept and girl crush concept become bigger so it was harder to stand out doung this type of sound so at the end what used to make itzy stand out in 2019 end up being the thing who made of itzy a generic gg in 2022


    If we look at girl groups doing well and being trendy right now you can see that they all use something tonstand out while still doing girl crush :


    Aespa = a lot of people criticize them for their gimmicky concept but this gimmick is what makes a lot of people stay around and keep an eye on them to see how it'll evolve + they are going for a more hyper pop sound with cyberpunk aesthetic in their mv and we don't have a female warrior gg so they stand out


    Idle = they were flopping and every people thought it was the end for them with Soojin departure

    But they were smart enough to see that POP rock was doing good in this moment with Gayle song blowing up and their was a need in korea for Pop rock sound because Gayle was even bale to chart in Melon

    So they were smart to comeback with a pop rock sound when nobody was doing it

    Now that they were able to catch again the attention of the public they can do more things they want


    New Jean = they stand out with their Y2k aesthetic and sound


    People no longer see gg with just good songs they had enough of these through the years

    Now they want good songs and girl group who feel fresh by giving them something new in concept or sound

    Because when you have been listening to kpop for years it can quickly become repetitive to see the gg always trying the same formula


    And the problem with JYP is that he thought that the girl next door image of itzy with some good songs and teen crush will help them to reach the top and stay relevant

    But he didn't expect that in 3 years the interest pf the GP would shift and they would ask for more innovation, more freshness


    And i guess he kinda understand it right now considering how he try to go for something more gimmicky with NMIXX than going for the generic gg formula he had with Itzy

    But it's just that in Nmixx case it just sound like he's doing half of the job


    And tbh i think for itzy to be able to gain back momentum they would have to be able to do something fresh while still being able to keep their image

    Or wait for every GGG to go cute again so they can stand out again with their teen crush image and sound

    ✩We Born with the X-Gene✩

    #aespa from Chill Kill #aespa from Chill Kill

    Quote from SooYoung

    they were flopping and every people thought it was the end for them with Soojin departure

    But they were smart enough to see that POP rock was doing good in this moment with Gayle song blowing up and their was a need in korea for Pop rock sound because Gayle was even bale to chart in Melon

    So they were smart to comeback with a pop rock sound when nobody was doing it

    Now that they were able to catch again the attention of the public they can do more things they want

    Tomboy was written before ABCDEFU was released


    Soyeon finished the demo of it in Mid 2021, she mentioned as much. She started writing it as soon as Soojin was put on Hiatus.


    By the time ABCDEFU hit Melon top 100 recording for I never Die was completely finished (they worked on them separated beginning Mid 2021, and finished recording around Dec 2021).

  • AllKill VIP
    Quote from Disevidence

    Tomboy was written before ABCDEFU was released


    Soyeon finished the demo of it in Mid 2021, she mentioned as much. She started writing it as soon as Soojin was put on Hiatus.

    I used gayle but it's just an example among the other


    It's not the only pop rock song who did very well recently Good for 4 u by olivia rodrigo was released earlier

    Midnight sky by miley cyrus etc...


    They were a lot of artist who tried pop rock sound in 2020-2021 and had a very good reception


    So i wouldn't be surprise that soyeon was in fact influence by them

    ✩We Born with the X-Gene✩

    #aespa from Chill Kill #aespa from Chill Kill

    Quote from Disevidence

    Tomboy was written before ABCDEFU was released


    mo of it in Mid 2021, she mentioned as much. She started writing it as soon as Soojin was put on Hiatus.


    By the time ABCDEFU hit Melon top 100 recording for I never Die was completely finished (they worked on them separated beginning Mid 2021, and finished recording around Dec 2021).

    Gidle's rise this year has something to do with Soyeon being a genius composer. She not only writes their songs, but also chooses Gidle concepts and styles. I think Soyeon figured out what kind of songs people like now. Also, Soyeon has always been making good music since their debut. I don't think we'll see a drop from Gidle as long as Soyeon does maked their songs. Because Soyeon is very creative and understands how to develop her music. :thumbup:

  • Moderator

    Moved the thread from forum KPOP to forum KPOP.

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