? 71
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Red velvet is in the same top S tier as BP, Twice, SNSD (10) 14%
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Red Velvet is a tier below that (61) 86%
Do you agree that Red Velvet is a tier below S Tier containing groups like Blackpink, Twice and even their seniors like SNSD?
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Idk like they were always popular but something about them just screamed second tier. Any gg can get hits that's not something to base on success for K-pop.
Their album sales were nothing great, the data was there for a gp loved group but even then they couldn't make their flop songs do well.
Twice and bp flop songs did well. Umpah umpha big flop. Really bad boy etc they weren't trendy enough either. I always felt like rv were outside of the top tier and on par with other ggs underneath even.
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IMO. RV is above Twice and BP. Their discography is better and they are better singers. And thats all i care.
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They are B tier. Not even A tier. Literally what have they achieved that everyone is calling them top/high tier?? Like let's see. Weak touring, album sales and international charting. The only thing they had was Korean digitals and they have been flopping domestically for the past 2 years as well.
S tier - BP, TWICE, SNSD
B tier - RV and the rest
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suddenly so many rv threads
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They are B tier. Not even A tier. Literally what have they achieved that everyone is calling them top/high tier?? Like let's see. Weak touring, album sales and international charting. The only thing they had was Korean digitals and they have been flopping domestically for the past 2 years as well.
S tier - BP, TWICE, SNSD
B tier - RV and the rest
You're so right, NewJeans definitely tour better than RV. That last tour of theirs was amazing. What was it called? I forget.
Feel My Rythm was a flop? Someone should inform Korea.
At least TRY to use stable logic.
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That is not the formal definition of "mid." It is literally a shortened form of "middle." RV were never in the middle of Kpop's heirarchy. Anyone saying otherwise is lying.
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That is not the formal definition of "mid." It is literally a shortened form of "middle." RV were never in the middle of Kpop's heirarchy. Anyone saying otherwise is lying.
Formally, mid basically means average. But in K-pop, I consider groups that are in the middle to be doing quite well given how saturated the market is. That's why I consider it good. You've got to have some kind of longevity and stability to be average in K-pop.
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fame wise they are not definitely
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NewJeans don't need touring to be A tier. In fact, the only reason why they are not S tier is because of touring.
And? All of their releases after that flopped. Dk why y'all cling onto that one song when they have released multiple songs after it and none of them took off in Korea and internationally.
Anyway, I only replied since you finally mustered the courage to quote me instead of facepalming but I won't be replying again cuz I am in Twice lockdown now!
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That's nice and all, but now you're completely misusing the word "average." Red Velvet's success and longevity aren't average for a Kpop group by any stretch of the imagination. They're one of only a small handful of girl groups in Kpop history to escape the 7 year curse, to say nothing of the countless groups who don't even last that long, and have arguably the best longevity of any 3rd gen girl group, both in terms of the raw length of their career and also how late into their career they had their most recent hit.
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That's nice and all, but now you're completely misusing the word "average." Red Velvet's success and longevity aren't average for a Kpop group by any stretch of the imagination. They're one of only a small handful of girl groups in Kpop history to escape the 7 year curse, to say nothing of the countless groups who don't even last that long, and have arguably the best longevity of any 3rd gen girl group, both in terms of the raw length of their career and also how late into their career they had their most recent hit.
Did you read the second part of what I said? You're saying the same thing I said.
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Yes, I read what you said. You're candy coating it by saying you need to be successful and have longevity to be "average," but that betrays the actual meaning of the word. If they were an average Kpop group, they would be a lot less succesful than they are and would have already disbanded several years ago.
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Yes, I read what you said. You're candy coating it by saying you need to be successful and have longevity to be "average," but that betrays the actual meaning of the word. If they were an average Kpop group, they would be a lot less succesful than they are and would have already disbanded several years ago.
I see what you mean now. Again, this is all semantics.
I know where I stand on this. I think it's silly to rank groups and put them in different tiers because everyone's scale is different. Some more generous than others. Ranking by tiers (top, mid, bottom, S-tier, A-tier, B-tier, etc.) instead of numbered rankings (#1, #2, #3) is iffy. But for the sake of discussion, I guess that's what people do.
I think Blackpink, Twice, and Red Velvet are the top three girl groups of 3rd gen, so there's no disagreement there. There might be a gap between Red Velvet and the other two, but that's still very impressive with all things considered.
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Yes, I read what you said. You're candy coating it by saying you need to be successful and have longevity to be "average," but that betrays the actual meaning of the word. If they were an average Kpop group, they would be a lot less succesful than they are and would have already disbanded several years ago.
Honestly, for 3rd-gen girl groups...
S-tier: Blackpink, Twice
A-tier: Red Velvet
That's a way better ranking system than top/mid/low. I think that's where most people would put it, too. There's just way too much subjectivity about what mid, average, or middle actually means.
I'm just trying to show that we have common ground, bud.
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I TOLD yama that but he won’t let me live
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Red Velvet is A tier but the top of a-tier with slight spillage into S-tier at times. That is my final answer
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All this is just silly..... all depends how you many levels you dived the top and bottom in. If we them in three groups top (tier 1), middle (tier 2) and "the rest" (tier 3) we have lot of tier 1 groups.
They are groups like Girls' Generation, Kara, Wonder Girls, 2NE1, T-ara, BP, Red Velvet, Twice and so on.
Than we have tier 2 groups like Apink, Oh my girl, StayC and so on.
But we could also dived it top 5 "tiers" and in that case maybe only 4-5 groups would be in tier 1.
And what group belong in what "tier" is of cource not always easy and people have different opinion about it.
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You're right. I refuse to boost the engagement and activity of a rival thread. I'm manifesting a flop thread for ISaidISaid
I already feel filthy giving Ripia a minor hit thread (we call that Baddie energy)
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Red velvet is A tier. They are in a tier below Twice and BP
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Honestly, for 3rd-gen girl groups...
S-tier: Blackpink, Twice
A-tier: Red Velvet
That's a way better ranking system than top/mid/low. I think that's where most people would put it, too. There's just way too much subjectivity about what mid, average, or middle actually means.
I'm just trying to show that we have common ground, bud.
Yes, the universally used ranking system everywhere else in the world, except among literally 2 users here who refuse to use it.
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ISaidISaid before starting this thread:
For the record, this WHOLE conversation about who's A Tier, who's S Tier etc is meaningless, because it's not even about stats or talent, it's purely about who people like more or which group is more hyped. IF we make a list based on TALENT and not HYPE, groups like Blackpink, TWICE, NewJeans and many others wouldn't even be in the B tier!
This would be the REAL list, based on TALENTS for GIRL GROUPS. The order isn't important, just the tier list!
S tier: MAMAMOO, Red Velvet, SNSD, Wonder Girls, Nmixx, Kiss of Life
A tier: 2NE1, Fin.K.L, Apink, Brown Eyed Girls, f(x), Kara, AOA, EXID, GFriend, Momoland, Oh My Girl, (G)I-dle, Aespa, Le Sserafim, STAYC
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ISaidISaid before starting this thread:
For the record, this WHOLE conversation about who's A Tier, who's S Tier etc is meaningless, because it's not even about stats or talent, it's purely about who people like more or which group is more hyped. IF we make a list based on TALENT and not HYPE, groups like Blackpink, TWICE, NewJeans and many others would even be in the B tier!
This would be the REAL list, based on TALENTS for GIRL GROUPS. The order isn't important, just the tier list!
S tier: MAMAMOO, Red Velvet, SNSD, Wonder Girls, Nmixx, Kiss of Life
A tier: 2NE1, Fin.K.L, Apink, Brown Eyed Girls, f(x), Kara, AOA, EXID, GFriend, Momoland, Oh My Girl, (G)I-dle, Aespa, Le Sserafim, STAYC
SNSD S tier? Be honest. Taeyeon has been hard carrying that group ever since she kicked Jessica out. Several of your A tier groups need to move down as well, starting with (G)I-dle.
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Yep, I agree that Twice and Blackpink are a tier above Red Velvet.
Still a successful group, but not quite on the same level.
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I have to disagree. First, Taeyeon didn't kick out anyone. Jessica did that to herself, she got a lot of chances. Don't blame the girls for her mistakes! Taeyeon, Tiffany, Seohyun is an S Tier vocalist. Hyo as a rapper and dancer. YoonA, Yuri and Sooyoung is better than average vocalists and dancers. Of course they're an S Tier group.
G-Idle deserve the A Tier, even if they're not the best vocalist, because they are probably one of the most creative and talented group in the 4th gen. No one is below-average in that group. For the A Tier, Idols have to be at least AVERAGE, and they are! B Tier is for below-average vocalist, dancers, and rappers.
Before Blinks attack me, Blackpink is a B Tier, because Rose (as a vocalist) and Lisa (as a dancer) can't make the group better overall!
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I have to disagree. First, Taeyeon didn't kick out anyone. Jessica did that to herself, she got a lot of chances. Don't blame the girls for her mistakes! Taeyeon, Tiffany, Seohyun is an S Tier vocalist. Hyo as a rapper and dancer. YoonA, Yuri and Sooyoung is better than average vocalists and dancers. Of course they're an S Tier group.
G-Idle deserve the A Tier, even if they're not the best vocalist, because they are probably one of the most creative and talented group in the 4th gen. No one is below-average in that group. For the A Tier, Idols have to be at least AVERAGE, and they are! B Tier is for below-average vocalist, dancers, and rappers.
Before Blinks attack me, Blackpink is a B Tier, because Rose (as a vocalist) and Lisa (as a dancer) can't make the group better overall!
What mistakes did Jessica make? Tell us all about them, since you were there to see them.
Tiffany and Seohyun being "S tier vocalists" is the best joke I've heard this week. Momo and Lisa are better dancers than Hyoyeon, but you have their groups placed a whole two tiers lower, so that can't justify their placement. Those other members have never been known for having above average vocals or dancing ability. They are fillers in every sense of the word.
No one is below average in (G)I-dle? Have you ever heard Shuhua sing? The others are also unspectacular.
B is a passing grade, so placing who you think are the "below average" talents in that tier is also a choice.
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What mistakes did Jessica make? Tell us all about them, since you were there to see them.
Tiffany and Seohyun being "S tier vocalists" is the best joke I've heard this week. Momo and Lisa are better dancers than Hyoyeon, but you have their groups placed a whole two tiers lower, so that can't justify their placement. Those other members have never been known for having above average vocals or dancing ability. They are fillers in every sense of the word.
No one is below average in (G)I-dle? Have you ever heard Shuhua sing? The others are also unspectacular.
B is a passing grade, so placing who you think are the "below average" talents in that tier is also a choice.
Do some research about what Jessica did, and why SM fired her. She had a contract with SM, but she only wanted fame so she can make her company bigger, and now that she's not in SNSD anymore, both her career and company is a mess. Use Google, I won't do the job for another troll.
I'm a vocalist, I'm pretty sure I know more about vocals than a troll on AKP. The fact that you mentioned Momo and Lisa being a better dancer, proves my point. The VOCALS are the most important part, not the dance or the rap. Lisa and Momo are only good at dancing, that's all. You're talking about individuals, but we're talking about GROUPS, and like I said, Lisa as a good dancer and Rose as an average vocalist doesn't make Blackpink better. The same goes for Momo. JYP is using too much autotune, it's clear as day.
Hyohyeon is probably one of the best rapper and dancer in the industry, it's not my opinion, it's a fact and said by many people in the Industry. Idols like Lisa and Momo hasa LONG was to go, to reach her level!
Actually it's not a choice, it's not about favoritism, my list was 100% based on TALENTS! I don't care if you don't agree, I didn't make my list to see people agree with me. You can make your own list. That's why I said, this whole conversation is pointless, because most Kpop fans doesn't know shit about vocals, dancing or rapping and other talents, like producing songs. Most of you only care about favoritism and visuals, not to mention HYPE!
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You're right. I refuse to boost the engagement and activity of a rival thread. I'm manifesting a flop thread for ISaidISaid
I already feel filthy giving Ripia a minor hit thread (we call that Baddie energy)
Me? A flop?
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Do some research about what Jessica did, and why SM fired her. She had a contract with SM, but she only wanted fame so she can make her company bigger, and now that she's not in SNSD anymore, both her career and company is a mess. Use Google, I won't do the job for another troll.
I'm a vocalist, I'm pretty sure I know more about vocals than a troll on AKP. The fact that you mentioned Momo and Lisa being a better dancer, proves my point. The VOCALS are the most important part, not the dance or the rap. Lisa and Momo are only good at dancing, that's all. You're talking about individuals, but we're talking about GROUPS, and like I said, Lisa as a good dancer and Rose as an average vocalist doesn't make Blackpink better. The same goes for Momo. JYP is using too much autotune, it's clear as day.
Hyohyeon is probably one of the best rapper and dancer in the industry, it's not my opinion, it's a fact and said by many people in the Industry. Idols like Lisa and Momo hasa LONG was to go, to reach her level!
Actually it's not a choice, it's not about favoritism, my list was 100% based on TALENTS! I don't care if you don't agree, I didn't make my list to see people agree with me. You can make your own list. That's why I said, this whole conversation is pointless, because most Kpop fans doesn't know shit about vocals, dancing or rapping and other talents, like producing songs. Most of you only care about favoritism and visuals, not to mention HYPE!
Use Google? Really? Is that your final answer? You can't tell me what she did wrong because you don't even know. Admit it. All you can come up with are the most vague of accusations. But that's never stopped a SN8D minion from sacrificing Jessica at the altar of Soshi, has it? How quickly y'all turned on her, sort of like the group itself...
You're a "vocalist" and I'm Mariah Carey. How's that for a flimsy appeal to authority?
I brought up dancing ability because you did. And that is a talent, is it not? Yes, I believe one could even argue quite easily that it is in fact a more important talent for most Kpop idols than vocals. But apparently dancing ability suddenly only matters when your name is Hyoyeon. How convenient. And we'll just conveniently ignore the fact that she can't sing any better than Momo or Lisa. All three are absolutely atrocious singers. But that's simply not an important point to consider in your "vocals are the most important part" argument, right?
Thinking Momo or Lisa have "a long way to go" to reach Hyoyeon's level just shows how incredibly biased you are. I simply can't take your poor, biased assessment of talent seriously. But since you don't care whether or not I agree, I can naturally assume you won't respond to any of this.
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I've been saying the same thing in every thread about metrics and criteria
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