How many people feel new jeans international popularity is overstated because of their playlisting

They have a massive gap between them and the field domestically, based on the year-end Circle/Melon numbers and Gallup Survey, so why wouldn't they have a similarly huge edge globally?

I'm sorry, but no K-Pop group or company has enough clout to just "rig" five songs on to the Billboard Hot 100 in a single year. They also outsold the Barbie OST and got a #1 on the Billboard 200, and Billboard literally tried to find reasons to give that achievement to Barbie instead and took sales away from NewJeans, making us wait an extra day to see who got #1.

Yeah, anyone who thinks the popularity isn't real is coping.

torn between 1st and 2nd option since 1) currently newjeans is miles ahead internationally but 2) i genuinely think le sserafim can catch up to them, if they play their cards right

NewJeans is obviously bigger. Not even Dua or Taylor Swift spent a longer time on TTH

In my opinion, their playlisting just help upgrading the reach of their already existent huge international popularity.

A big playlisting's reach can put songs on the map, but they can't force people into liking it and streaming it consistently for it to be 'faked'. One example is 'GODS' from NewJeans themselves. It made into TTH's, still didn't came close to the popularity of other songs they released this year.

On the opposite side, Attention's playlisting was much bigger than Hype Boy's (the later didn't made into TTH's, for example, while Attention did), but Hype Boy spent 170 days on Global, outreamed and currently has bigger daily streams than the most promoted song.

Not to mention, when Youtube Charts used to showcase us the monthly-to-yearly data of non-ad views and Youtube Music, they were the third most streamed K-pop group within a period of 12 months, while not receiving any time of big-playlisting boost in said plataform. You can see the other plataforms just match.

well i keep track of the 30 most streamed songs on spotify everyday and new jeans have been always having like 7 or 6 songs on them in the past year so i would say newjeans are the most popular by a big margin

Yeah, at the end of the day, I don't know Spotify analytics like others more familiar with the platform might, but what Minazuki said is what I've seen others mention when the topic of TTH comes up.

The paid for TTH accusations don't make any sense if you just look at the performance of NJ's songs at all

I chose option number 2 because there could be another girl group that debuts that can rival New Jeans. They've only been active for like 1.5 years (?) so it's still too early to say they will be the biggest gg internationally.

Quote from Minazuki

On the opposite side, Attention's playlisting was much bigger than Hype Boy's (the later didn't made into TTH's, for example, while Attention did), but Hype Boy spent 170 days on Global, outreamed and currently has bigger daily streams than the most promoted song

I think this observation right here kills the conspiracy theory about NewJeans and playlisting.

Any thoughts? catzi

Kpop fans complaining about playlisting.

Better complain about how much Western artists get of that (even some who almost nobody knows but are with the right label).

Anyway, this thread made me want to listen to more New Jeans. Will play their music now. Thank you

I mean there’s no doubt they’re the most popular GG of their generation but let’s not act they have more opportunities than their peers.

Like why do you think dua lipa doesn’t have high debuts but she has a crazy longevity.

Quote from ISaidISaid

Because you can’t read.

Getting added to a playlist itself is an achievement because new jeans is bigger is some metrics than others. (Emphasis on some metrics someone will ask if I think NJ is bigger BTS next😭, no they’re not)

I dont think so either. What I think users use as a massive indication of gap, however, is more linked to the massive boost tth does give compared to anything else for international stats. It is literally the biggest playlist on spotify and the fact that nj stayed since debut and even a song like gods made to the list just look fishy no matter the excuse yall come up with

Quote from YamaChwan

I think this observation right here kills the conspiracy theory about NewJeans and playlisting.

Any thoughts? catzi

This is how Nj page on spotify looked like 35 days after debut and exactly 9 days after being added to tth

20231223_160516.jpg

Like I said Nj are no nugu. They are indeed the biggest by international metrics. But miss me with the bs that its all organic when even a LoL song of theirs went to TTH.

Quote from ISaidISaid

Organic is a weird term. This is the same argument as big 3 privilege. And it’s a reductive argument.

IVE also had many advantages over totally nugu groups. You just draw a line in the sand on what’s organic and what’s inorganic. Imo that’s not a good argument at all.

New Jeans is a huge HYBE flagship group. They have much more exposure and eyes on them then any ones else. It’s a fact. Even right at debut they had huge hype.

That’s not the same thing as inorganic.

You can’t quantify privilege imo. Because unless you are a total nugu who rose up, you’ll always have privilege over others.

“New jeans is more popular because they’re from HYBE and have more exposure and privilege” won’t change the fact that they’re indeed more popular.

You are not arguing about who is more popular, you are merely talking about how some popularity is earned in an easier way (according to your scale) and that’s not really a sound or interesting argument to have.

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All that and still doesnt change the fact of how weird it is to get into the biggest playlist on spotify after 25 days since debut and never leave even after 1 year and months later.

congrats ig. Lsf is almost near 13m monthly listeners so looks like they will reach an even bigger amount the moment they get to tth

Quote from ISaidISaid

Organic is a weird term. This is the same argument as big 3 privilege. And it’s a reductive argument.

IVE also had many advantages over totally nugu groups. You just draw a line in the sand on what’s organic and what’s inorganic. Imo that’s not a good argument at all.

New Jeans is a huge HYBE flagship group. They have much more exposure and eyes on them then any ones else. It’s a fact. Even right at debut they had huge hype.

That’s not the same thing as inorganic.

You can’t quantify privilege imo. Because unless you are a total nugu who rose up, you’ll always have privilege over others.

“New jeans is more popular because they’re from HYBE and have more exposure and privilege” won’t change the fact that they’re indeed more popular.

You are not arguing about who is more popular, you are merely talking about how some popularity is earned in an easier way (according to your scale) and that’s not really a sound or interesting argument to have.

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Exactly.

catzi You have been strawmanning all year and it needs to stop. Nobody is making the argument that NewJeans have no company advantage whatsoever. They're from the biggest label in K-Pop right now, so obviously they're going to have more resources and exposure than a group like TripleS or Kiss of Life.

But company advantage is something IVE has over both of those groups too. Kakao is publicly traded for Christ's sake. And would Twice and BlackPink be half as big if not for JYP and the hype of Sixteen or YG debuting its first girl group since 2NE1, that he hyped for 5 years?

You're the only one in here using the word "organic"

Quote from ISaidISaid

What do you even mean never leave. There’s currently only one song there 😭😭😭

New jeans have more singles released than even some western acts and kpop groups like BP 😭

I’m really trying to understand what you mean by “1 year later”

Are you saying all their songs being a hit is fake? lol.

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huh? I literally posted this which you replied to lmao

I feel like they r same level as popular maybe a bit more

How do u know playlists popularity? Is it based on one’s people create or what Spotify creates?

Quote from catzi

huh? I literally posted this which you replied to lmao

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How is this fishy when their popularity metrics are similar in Korea?

You think they're rigging these too? Fishy isn't the word to use here.

Unprecedented. Transcendent. Those are better words.

Quote from YamaChwan

Exactly.

catzi You have been strawmanning all year and it needs to stop. Nobody is making the argument that NewJeans have no company advantage whatsoever. They're from the biggest label in K-Pop right now, so obviously they're going to have more resources and exposure than a group like TripleS or Kiss of Life.

But company advantage is something IVE has over both of those groups too. Kakao is publicly traded for Christ's sake. And would Twice and BlackPink be half as big if not for JYP and the hype of Sixteen or YG debuting its first girl group since 2NE1, that he hyped for 5 years?

You're the only one in here using the word "organic"

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I dont think i denied u guys deny big4 privilege exist but what i actually said was how u guys cant admit the tth boost exist and thats fine. What I have been saying all the time is how Nj's biggest gap seem to be directly linked to TTH. For example, u guys brag about their monthly listeners of 26m(?) when TTH literally have 34 million ppl listening to it and nj have been in the same playlist less than a month of debut until now, 1 year later. So it doesnt look that much like a flex to me Thats all. Sorry. They are indeed the strongest internationally but to me not in the way yall seem to think. I see it more in a way that was built on a house of cards. I will need to see what else they will provide in like a year or two and will gladly accept them as undeniably massive and on the same level as bp and bts depending on what other relevancy they provide besides what they already shown.

Quote from catzi

I dont think i denied u guys deny big4 privilege exist but what i actually said was how u guys cant admit the tth boost exist and thats fine. What I have been saying all the time is how Nj's biggest gap seem to be directly linked to TTH. For example, u guys brag about their monthly listeners of 26m(?) when TTH literally have 34 million ppl listening to it and nj have been in the same playlist less than a month of debut until now, 1 year later. So it doesnt look that much like a flex to me Thats all. Sorry. They are indeed the strongest internationally but to me not in the way yall seem to think. I see it more in a way that was built on a house of cards. I will need to see what else they will provide in like a year or two and will gladly accept them as undeniably massive and on the same level as bp and bts depending on what other relevancy they provide besides what they already shown.

How can you think it's a house of cards when their demand in the U.S. also translated to their physical sales? Only two other girl groups have made history on Billboard 200, Twice and BlackPink. Are those two groups' popularity built on a house of cards too?

Get Up outsold Barbie, one of the biggest summer movies, by box office results, ever, with an OST loaded with huge western artists.

Why does BlackPink's Spotify streams count but NewJeans' doesn't? Is NJ the only group accomplishing big things that's from a big company? Absolutely not.

Like, your theory would have more credence to me if NJ weren't also equally massive elsewhere. They're the best performing girl group digitally in Japan too. Is that rigged?

Quote from YamaChwan

How is this fishy when their popularity metrics are similar in Korea?

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You think they're rigging these too? Fishy isn't the word to use here.

Unprecedented. Transcendent. Those are better words.

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I find hilarious how youre always posting this like its a "gotcha" moment when it evokes literally zero reaction from me lmao idk i think its what make sense when all of their 8 singles (attention, hype boy, cookie, ditto, omg, cool with you, eta, super shy) were massively promoted with god knows how many mvs each and i even left hurt and asap out since ador doesnt consider it title tracks despite both having mvs

Quote from catzi

I find hilarious how youre always posting this like its a "gotcha" moment when it evokes literally zero reaction from me lmao idk i think its what make sense when all of their 8 singles (attention, hype boy, cookie, ditto, omg, cool with you, eta, super shy) were massively promoted with god knows how many mvs each and i even left hurt and asap out since ador doesnt consider it title tracks despite both having mvs

If I wanted to elicit specific reactions from you, there would be far more effective ways to accomplish that than linking Circle Chart Data. It's not hard to push your buttons.

I post it because it's relevant to the discussion. Circle Chart is an aggregation of how groups performed across all digital charts in Korea. The relevant part is that "in Korea" phrase, because it shows that NewJeans are significantly beyond their peers in cumulative streams and sales in Korea as well.

If NewJeans were at par or below par with their peers in Korea, but significantly more popular internationally, even though the "the game is rigged" argument would still be absurd, your insistence on that conspiracy being true would be slightly more understandable.

But NewJeans are destroying records in Korea just like they are internationally. All of this is in line with what they've been doing since debut.

It's funny how you yourself mentioned their song count. That doesn't help your argument. NewJeans pulling these numbers with only 12 songs to their album discography makes the gap even MORE insane.

I'm separating this point from my "essay"

Can you not see the absurdity of trying to discredit NewJeans' record domination of Circle Chart by complaining they promoted their songs too well?!?!

I heard Super Shy in an Arizona Walmart the other day.

I'm not remembering hearing any other K-Pop group on that store's music soundtrack, not even Fifty Fifty's Cupid.

There is something different about NewJeans. And they annoy all the right people.

Take playlisting out of the formula and 80% of newjeans achievements disappear, newjeans is clearly #1 globally but without hybe strategies the gap is not actually big.

Quote from ISaidISaid

Because you can’t read.

Getting added to a playlist itself is an achievement because new jeans is bigger is some metrics than others. (Emphasis on some metrics someone will ask if I think NJ is bigger BTS next😭, no they’re not)

That's not how it works

It basically show how much hype push them

Nj the group is ahead of other 4th gen ggs but its obv within their own label their push and lsfrm is not even the same, image with those ggs outside of it

In other aspects, when u considering individual popularity for a group so trendy their members engagement is very lacking

Quote from ISaidISaid

New Jeans is 2X or 3X more popular than other 4th gen GGs, there’s no way to compete (11)

The only right answer

NJ b-sides with 0 playlisting debuted higher than any other group title tracks. Here is your response

Look at even bsides tracks streams, even without TTH, they will still endin everyone after BTS and BP comfortably heh.

Quote from YamaChwan

How can you think it's a house of cards when their demand in the U.S. also translated to their physical sales? Only two other girl groups have made history on Billboard 200, Twice and BlackPink. Are those two groups' popularity built on a house of cards too?

Get Up outsold Barbie, one of the biggest summer movies, by box office results, ever, with an OST loaded with huge western artists.

Why does BlackPink's Spotify streams count but NewJeans' doesn't? Is NJ the only group accomplishing big things that's from a big company? Absolutely not.

Like, your theory would have more credence to me if NJ weren't also equally massive elsewhere. They're the best performing girl group digitally in Japan too. Is that rigged?

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Dude once I said bp is bigger than twice on o h and got literally around 60 ppl disagreeing with my post lmao. Do you have any idea how many that is for o h standards? Even when ppl may not see it at the time, i'm usually ahead when it comes to noticing patterns and stuff. Other ppl wasnt aware of that bc twice still had bigger records in sk and better sales, but i already knew bp had bigger casual interest despite the streaming farm claims. The tth boost doesnt take the credit out of nj from being the biggest 4th gen gg internationally. I just dont think its a massive gap yet for the reasons I already mentioned. I do not exclude the possibility of Ive falling behind either, like it happened to Twice in Sk after BP stayed relevant (though I dont think it will happen, since JYP and Starship are completely different companies and Sistar disbanded with a #1 hit). So yeah i'm not blind to 4th gen ggs weaknesses and strength and I dont think nj's popularity is all fake. I know that a lot of things ppl accuse nj, bp was accused before too. But like I said before, i will need 1 or 2 more years to see what else nj will provide to actually say the gap i massive because thanks to tth I still dont see how. Bp debuted in 2016 and iirc when I said Bp was bigger than Twice that caused a massive disagreement it was in 2019. So as you see its not an absurd amount of time to view things in a more accurate way. And like I said before I'll gladly accept Nj as the undeniably biggest gg if they keep growing the way they are in the next couple of years.

Quote from YamaChwan

I'm separating this point from my "essay"

Can you not see the absurdity of trying to discredit NewJeans' record domination of Circle Chart by complaining they promoted their songs too well?!?!

But I'm not? I just dont know any other group that promoted 8 songs with an mv for each in such a short amount of time. For a successful act like Nj, 4b points sound about right? Wouldnt it be bad if they promoted their music so bad and still flopped? You take literally anything as offense lol

Quote from Coldhit

Look at even bsides tracks streams, even without TTH, they will still endin everyone after BTS and BP comfortably heh.

Yeah

People are really delulu here. NewJeans (the song) is still doing half a million streams every day and have 163 million strams already. Look at the stats of the other girlies released close to NewJeans (song):

- Spicy: 92 million, 300k daily streams

- Queencard: 212 million, 529k streams

- I Am: 202 million, 460k daily streams

- Unforgiven: 164 million, 409k daily streams

A NJ b-side with negligible playlisting is pulling numbers close to those girls title tracks

Hurt, a 2022 b-side is still doing 226k streams every day. This is more than Tomboy (224k), Kistch (195k), Savage (195k), you get the idea...