What do you guys think about SMF Vata & Ateez choreography plagiarism controversy

  • AllKill VIP

    Not sure if I missed out on any thread about it


    Basically in SMF leaders were tasked to create an original move, and Vata's dance was chosen. The dance went viral


    The issue is that, it is very similar to Ateez Say My Name


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    It wasn't really an issue, until Wooyoung himself pointed it out with a biting move (a move in the bboy scene to imply that a move is copied)


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    The original choreographer also got news of it and posted somsthing


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    And he also said something about it


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    What do you guys think?


    :thinkerpepe::thinkerpepe:


    Personally if you ask me, it is hard like really hard to come up with a totally different dance move.


    But in this case that dance move is literally the signature dance move for Say My Name. It's not just like 1 action or a short bit, it was like an entire move. It's like if someone copied the signature move of the lines 'I'm on the Next Level' or 'Narcissistic my god I love it' we would IMMEDIATELY notice it.


    I think Ateez has the right to voice out their displeasure about it but that is just me. What about you guys?

  • AllKill VIP

    it IS Ateez Say My Name's Killing Point move. Even the choreographers called him out on it and Wooyoung rightfully did so, subtly. No Atiny is attacking Zico but we are calling out that they did not create the move. All of Ateez work is created from scratch FOR them.


    Kinda dumbfounded seeing that Vata and San are close friends and that Block B was a brother group to Ateez.


    But because of this Say My Name is trending world wide, so thanks I guess...

  • icyruios

    Changed the title of the thread from “What do you guys think about SMF Vata & Ateez choreography” to “What do you guys think about SMF Vata & Ateez choreography plagiarism controversy”.
  • AllKill VIP
    Quote from xx-jenn-xx

    it IS Ateez Say My Name's Killing Point move. Even the choreographers called him out on it and Wooyoung rightfully did so, subtly. No Atiny is attacking Zico but we are calling out that they did not create the move. All of Ateez work is created from scratch FOR them.


    Kinda dumbfounded seeing that Vata and San are close friends and that Block B was a brother group to Ateez.

    You know I always roll my eyes whenever I see plagiarism accusations, but the entire dance just looks too too similar


    Even the hands at the waist and the circling round

  • AllKill VIP
    Quote from icyruios

    You know I always roll my eyes whenever I see plagiarism accusations, but the entire dance just looks too too similar


    Even the hands at the waist and the circling round

    Ateez has been done dirty lately. People wanna bitch at Wooyoung and say Ateez shouldnt' be complaining. If this was a big 3/4 group people would be rioting. Ateez rightfully works hard and has earned all they have achieved, big company or not they shouldn't be plagiarized. Everyone argues that dance moves can't be copywrited. Sure, but to claim YOU created this move when you didn't. GTFO, seriously. I am SO GLAD that the original choreographers are backing Ateez on this. And SMART of Wooyoung to call him out. Like he ain't stupid.


    It's almost as bad as this blatant obvious p.o.s

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    All those "controversies" look like when 5 year old kids see someone dance and than ask you "is this from fortnite?"

    A.C.E | ATEEZ | DRIPPIN| MCND | NU'EST | ONF | SF9 | Stray Kids | TFN

    Atinys have every right to call out that thief lmao, also the way he was calling out other contestant for copying his choreo, then proceeds to copy ATEEZ move, the hypocrisy is real

    I was quiet on this situation but I can't ignore it when even the member (Wooyoung) showed his displeasure.

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    The vata guy knows ATEEZ, he clearly knew what he is doing lmao, it's because ATEEZ come from small company they think they can get away with it

    First of all, Wooyoung using this "copy" gesture before dancing the move was hot as hell, like for real! He was hot for this!! Omg!!

    Back to the topic: the moment i saw the challenge i actually remembered SMN by Ateez which shows how this wasn't an original move and the first time i have ever saw that move was in the Ateez MV, i was fascinated by it.

    I'm glad the choreography actually stood up for Wooyoung and showed clearly his opinion.

    It's a plagiarism bc this dancer is saying it was an original move and everybody knows it isn't. He should be ashamed actually, like i would be if i was called out like that.

    If this were just some random TikToker, I'd give the benefit of the doubt, but you're talking about a highly experienced professional dancer and choreographer who works in kpop. Even if I was to suspend my disbelief, the fact that he is very silent when he knows this accusation is going on sort of answers its own question. Again, as a professional dancer or choreographer, you'd be fast to address the issue (you've never seen it, ooh, should have credited, or something). It's very much giving "no one really knows about this group so I thought I'd get away with it" energy.


    People get paid to create choreography and get jobs because people saw something else they did. They also get paid to teach classes based on popular choreography. So I get why this matters to the original choreographer. This isn't just bragging rights or something..

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  • AllKill VIP
    Quote from monalisalove

    First of all, Wooyoung using this "copy" gesture before dancing the move was hot as hell, like for real! He was hot for this!! Omg!!

    Back to the topic: the moment i saw the challenge i actually remembered SMN by Ateez which shows how this wasn't an original move and the first time i have ever saw that move was in the Ateez MV, i was fascinated by it.

    I'm glad the choreography actually stood up for Wooyoung and showed clearly his opinion.

    It's a plagiarism bc this dancer is saying it was an original move and everybody knows it isn't. He should be ashamed actually, like i would be if i was called out like that.

    Girl, I am thinking the same. Like Wooyoung is learning a lot more dancing and b-boying and everything, and to come out there and do a move that only street dancers would know, not only shows me how hella smart he is, but that he has some damn balls. Like Hell yes, for standing up to this shit.


    What I appreciate even MORE is their original choreographers stepping up and calling this out. Like, you don't need to be from a big company to have a loyal group of people behind you who support you.

  • AllKill VIP
    Quote from the101

    If this were just some random TikToker, I'd give the benefit of the doubt, but you're talking about a highly experienced professional dancer and choreographer who works in kpop. Even if I was to suspend my disbelief, the fact that he is very silent when he knows this accusation is going on sort of answers its own question. Again, as a professional dancer or choreographer, you'd be fast to address the issue (you've never seen it, ooh, should have credited, or something). It's very much giving "no one really knows about this group so I thought I'd get away with it" energy.


    People get paid to create choreography and get jobs because people saw something else they did. They also get paid to teach classes based on popular choreography. So I get why this matters to the original choreographer. This isn't just bragging rights or something..

    The fact that Vata won that episode with that shit just infuriates me more. They were supposed to create an original choreography but that piece isn't original at all, yet he still won? IMO they should review this and revoke his win for that becuase it's not deserved at all. The Fact that he is in fact FRIENDS with SAN is like...wow betrayal? Sometimes I roll my eyes when Atiny calls things out but as I pointed out earlier it's been happening TOO much to Ateez.


    First with Wave, then this Nigerian Person who copied not one but TWO MV's, and now this. Like, I get that Ateez isn't from the Big 3/4 but this is seriously getting stupid at this point....

    Lots of misinformations going around here to aggravate the issue:

    - It wasnt the "whole dance" that was similar to ateez choreo. That move is just a small part of few seconds at the start of a whole routine and isnt even its most important part. The routine did not get viral because of that part (most people didn't even bother including that part in their challenge)

    - Vata never claimed he invented that move. If he did please show where he said it instead of just spreading lies to vilify him.

    - Vata never called out other people for copying him, it was another contestant

    - You can't plagiarize individual moves. This would only be an issue if Vata was indeed claiming he invented the move, which he never did. He created a new routine that incorporated and put together a set of pre existing moves, which is how choreo are always made.

    Edited once, last by h28 ().

  • AllKill VIP
    Quote from h28

    Lots of misinformations going around here to aggravate the issue:

    - It wasnt the "whole dance" that was similar to ateez choreo. That move is just a small part of few seconds at the start of a whole routine and isnt even its most important part. The routine did not get viral because of that part (most people didn't even bother including that part in their challenge)

    - Vata never claimed he invented that move. If he did please show where he said it instead of just spreading lies to vilify him.

    - Vata never called out other people for copying him, it was another contestant

    - You can't plagiarize individual moves. This would only be an issue if Vata was indeed claiming he invented the move, which he never did. He created a new routine that incorporated and put together a set of pre existing moves, which is how choreo are always made.

    I mean they copied at least about 4 counts, which was the exact thing that they voiced out in the show that someone else copied 4 counts worth as well

    I don’t think it’s plagiarism. I think in choreography you have to copy a sequence of moves for it to be called plagiarism not just a single move.


    By copy right law usually a single move is not copyrightable. So no it’s not plagiarism I think.

    So he copied an isolated move - one move does not = plagiarism of choreo

    Also not the first time I've seen this particular move so is it really original?

    I don't care for the most part but its interesting when I hear ateez for the last year it's usually them/their fans accusing someone of plagiarism.......

    Quote from icyruios

    I mean they copied at least about 4 counts, which was the exact thing that they voiced out in the show that someone else copied 4 counts worth as well

    Then ateez choreograoher also copied those 4 counts since that sequence of moves already existed before.I doubt he credited the original inventor of that sequence though...

  • AllKill VIP
    Quote from h28

    Lots of misinformations going around here to aggravate the issue:

    - It wasnt the "whole dance" that was similar to ateez choreo. That move is just a small part of few seconds at the start of a whole routine and isnt even its most important part. The routine did not get viral because of that part (most people didn't even bother including that part in their challenge)

    - Vata never claimed he invented that move. If he did please show where he said it instead of just spreading lies to vilify him.

    - Vata never called out other people for copying him, it was another contestant

    - You can't plagiarize individual moves. This would only be an issue if Vata was indeed claiming he invented the move, which he never did. He created a new routine that incorporated and put together a set of pre existing moves, which is how choreo are always made.

    First of all

    NO ONE CLAIMED that the whole dance was copied...we said the SPECIFIC killing point of Say My Name was copied.

    The claiming that Vata said he invented it was the fact that they were supposed to on the show create ORIGINAL choreography, which is what he did THIS is not original that piece which is more than a few seconds is a blatant, obvious copy of the SAME MOVE in Ateez Say My Name. If it was so simple why would Ateez OWN CHOREOGRAPHERS who created that move come out and call him out?

    I think you're the one who's facts aren't straight.


    The whole point is that this was competition show where the requirements were to create YOUR OWN ORIGINAL WORK, using something that already exists and is a killing point in a song that was created YEARS AGO is not ORIGINAL WORK.


    Whether someone else called out copying on his behalf or not it's kind of ironic that you would call someone else out while in turn doing it to another person. Sure dance moves can't be copywrited, but it can be called out when you do stupid shit like this and claim it as your own. It's not a reach when Ateez clapped back and the original choreographers let out a comment. Half the time Ateez doesnt bother with this shit, it's usually Atiny's being loud.


    So please go tell Wooyoung to his face he's wrong and his choreography team who backed him up.



    Quote from h28

    Then ateez choreograoher also copied those 4 counts since that sequence of moves already existed before.I doubt he credited the original inventor of that sequence though...

    that sequence did NOT exist before as we all pointed out it does not match that stupid shopping cart move that was seen on the ellen show or any other shopping cart move, there is distinct noticeable variations and differences between the shopping cart and the say my name killing point.

    Quote from h28

    Lots of misinformations going around here to aggravate the issue:

    - It wasnt the "whole dance" that was similar to ateez choreo. That move is just a small part of few seconds at the start of a whole routine and isnt even its most important part. The routine did not get viral because of that part (most people didn't even bother including that part in their challenge)

    - Vata never claimed he invented that move. If he did please show where he said it instead of just spreading lies to vilify him.

    - Vata never called out other people for copying him, it was another contestant

    - You can't plagiarize individual moves. This would only be an issue if Vata was indeed claiming he invented the move, which he never did. He created a new routine that incorporated and put together a set of pre existing moves, which is how choreo are always made.

    1) no one said he copied the whole dance, atinys have always voiced out that gliding part

    even its most important? maybe it wasn't the main segment of the dance, but still its part of the choreo, its the beginning part which is supposed to get people's attention, so its still equally important as the main segment, if it was not that important, why he did include it in the dance?

    2) The task was to come up with their own choreo for the song, if u have some knowledge about street dance, it is literally well known rule that dancer should come up with their own original chore, if the choreo is created by other person its not valid, thats even the reason biting move (calling out plagiarism) exists in the first place, there's a difference between cover dancers and professional dancers

    3) Lmao, there's literally a video of him and his crew mate calling out other team for copying his choreo in the link I posted above, much ignorance???

    4) Do you know street dance? If u are creating a choreo for competition, all set of moves should be original

    The mental gymnastics u gyus make to defend this mf, even after both the original choreographer and original performers called him out, have some shame


    Also, u clearly have no clue about hip hop scene, it requires so much professionalism, there's unwritten rule that everything should be original, in dance choreo should be your own, in rap, the flow, the lyrics should be your own, none of gets copyright, but none of it should be copied, once u copy others then you are just cover artist or wannabe

  • AllKill VIP
    Quote from h28

    Then ateez choreograoher also copied those 4 counts since that sequence of moves already existed before.I doubt he credited the original inventor of that sequence though...

    You know I've been waiting for people to show me the exact 4 counts for that particular dance move that happen before Say My Name, because people are saying oh it's a dance move it's common


    Until now I'm still waiting

  • AllKill VIP
    Quote from icyruios

    You know I've been waiting for people to show me the exact 4 counts for that particular dance move that happen before Say My Name, because people are saying oh it's a dance move it's common


    Until now I'm still waiting

    People trying to say this shopping cart move that was all popular on the ellen show is what ateez copied and i'm like your grasping at straws

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    they reference this.

    it is NOTHING like the move in Say My Name...that reach

    Quote from xx-jenn-xx

    People trying to say this shopping cart move that was all popular on the ellen show is what ateez copied and i'm like your grasping at straws

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    they reference this.

    it is NOTHING like the move in Say My Name...that reach

    its just reverse moonwalk, the only thing they could find lmao :cryingr:

    tell me which two are the exact similar between this, smn choreo and vata choreo

  • AllKill VIP
    Quote from jinaland

    its just reverse moonwalk, the only thing they could find lmao :cryingr:

    tell me which two are the exact similar between this, smn choreo and vata choreo

    fr please these fucking people lol :sob-bunny:

  • AllKill VIP

    Aye AKP Atiny's


    wanna voice your opinions....?

    xx-jenn-xx

    LTMs_Sammi

    Minazuki

    tischkopfbein

    HwaGoose

    Pearl-Iris

    TheLadybug

    okeechobee

    @kidsgonestray

    myliltiny

    aznboy-x2

    Violanah

    BomBomi86

    KittyQueen

    koffeemusings

    BEYBLADE

    :siptear:...totally didn't tag the fandom for this bullshit....yes...yes I did.


    Vata Did one thing right

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    Aye Argentina has taste! I LOVE MY DESIRE

    f*ck him but he did give say my name a reveal which is good because that song is too iconic :lighter-pepe:

    "Out of all the languages he could've spoken, He chose to speak facts"

  • AllKill VIP

    I MEAN...

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    slay

    the choreographers of ateez's dance are valid for being mad, kinda low of vata to out rightly copy despite throwing a big fuss over a member of just jerk copying his dance moves in smf


    i dont follow ateez but it's all over my tl and all im seeing is just a witch hunt and gotcha moment, people making very mean and personal attacks towards vata, totally unrelated to the whole incident, and i dont think that's right either

    You see people not agreeing 200% with you so you just call your friends so that you can just circle jerk together in your little echo chamber. I see there is no point trying to have a discussion then.

  • AllKill VIP
    Quote from h28

    You see people not agreeing 200% with you so you just call your friends so that you can just circle jerk together in your little echo chamber. I see there is no point trying to have a discussion then.

    Who's not agreeing with me? Because as far as I know the OP of this post Jinaland, Aznboy and all the other atiny's and even non Atiny's see the issue but YOU.


    there's no discussion to be had when you have the original choreographers of Say My Name going LIVE ON INSTAGRAM to prove exactly what we said in this thread. wtf lol


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    Quote from Zicofan000

    Vata is getting death threats right now for copying one move, so no I dont think its worth getting death threats or threats about ruining his future


    Quote from caratnotcarrot

    the choreographers of ateez's dance are valid for being mad, kinda low of vata to out rightly copy despite throwing a big fuss over a member of just jerk copying his dance moves in smf


    i dont follow ateez but it's all over my tl and all im seeing is just a witch hunt and gotcha moment, people making very mean and personal attacks towards vata, totally unrelated to the whole incident, and i dont think that's right either

    I don't agree with that either and those people who do that are not ones we consider part of our fandom. The hate and death threats aren't right and I do not condone that behavior.


    Simply calling him out as Ateez themselves have done and their own choreographers should be enough, but twitter and other places are a cesspool of shit as we know.

  • AllKill VIP
    Quote from BomBomi86

    ;judgingpepe:


    Death threads are obviously too much but it’s time for Vata to clear this up. Did he speak up about this? Because the choreographer released a statement.


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    said himself.

    Quote from caratnotcarrot

    the choreographers of ateez's dance are valid for being mad, kinda low of vata to out rightly copy despite throwing a big fuss over a member of just jerk copying his dance moves in smf


    i dont follow ateez but it's all over my tl and all im seeing is just a witch hunt and gotcha moment, people making very mean and personal attacks towards vata, totally unrelated to the whole incident, and i dont think that's right either

    Quote from Zicofan000

    Vata is getting death threats right now for copying one move, so no I dont think its worth getting death threats or threats about ruining his future

    Its not right either, but he should have apologized way earlier when atinys are still calm and politely pointing it out, the whole of stan twitter called us dramatic and attention seekers, and that Vata guy still being quite and he has never apologized, ofc toxic stans would lose patience, lets be real any fandom would be same, lets not like act like atinys are the only toxic ones.

  • AllKill VIP
    Quote from Zicofan000

    Plus you cant copyright dancing, lets get that straight. He could have credited the choreographer thgh

    We never said you could copyright it. We are saying he copied the move without giving credit and the anger comes from him being on this show on an episode where he had to CREATE HIS OWN CHOREOGRAPHY and basicaly claimed this move as his own when it is not his own. He won that episode with work that ISN'T HIS. We simply stated that he should own up to what he did, he hasn't and Wooyoung called him out on it. this didn't happen today this happened days ago, KCon was days ago...he has had plenty of time to apologize and release a statement.


    If this shit happened to a group in the Big 3/4 this forum would be in an uproar but it's happening to Ateez and ya'll think we are wrong for calling the hypocrisy and lack of an apology/statement out. It's kind of bullshit. lol. I am pretty sure that if this wasn't a copy Wooyoung wouldn't bother and their choreographers from 2019 wouldn't be going live on Instagram to make a statement...give me a break lol

    Quote from jinaland

    Its not right either, but he should have apologized way earlier when atinys are still calm and politely pointing it out, the whole of stan twitter called us dramatic and attention seekers, and that Vata guy still being quite and he has never apologized, ofc toxic stans would lose patience, lets be real any fandom would be same, lets not like act like atinys are the only toxic ones.

    He can still apologize, maybe he is busy with preparing a statement, but i would definitely worry if I was getting death threats.

    Believe me the calm Atinys are overshadowed in this case, like I cant even enjoy Zicos song anymore in melon because the comment section is filled with filthy comments. Plus twitter fans are fully attacking Zico and mentioning him in every post, why? the guy has nothing to do with this

    Quote from jinaland

    u can't copyright rap flow either, its kind of unwritten rule in hip hop that one should come up with his originality

    there's a difference between real professional and cover artist I said, and he hasnt credit the original no professionalism at all

    I agree with that

  • AllKill VIP
    Quote from Zicofan000

    He can still apologize, maybe he is busy with preparing a statement, but i would definitely worry if I was getting death threats.

    Believe me the calm Atinys are overshadowed in this case, like I cant even enjoy Zicos song anymore in melon because the comment section is filled with filthy comments. Plus twitter fans are fully attacking Zico and mentioning him in every post, why? the guy has nothing to do with this

    I'll be real with you, I don't know what Zico has to do with this either. Most of what I see is geared towards Vata. I think maybe Zico was doing the dance challenge to it or something, and I believe (correct me if I'm wrong Atiny's or whomever) that some got upset over him doing it because of Vata's choreography and not because it was done to Ateez Say My Name.


    That's where I think Zico comes into play?!

    Quote from xx-jenn-xx

    We never said you could copyright it. We are saying he copied the move without giving credit and the anger comes from him being on this show on an episode where he had to CREATE HIS OWN CHOREOGRAPHY and basicaly claimed this move as his own when it is not his own. He won that episode with work that ISN'T HIS. We simply stated that he should own up to what he did, he hasn't and Wooyoung called him out on it. this didn't happen today this happened days ago, KCon was days ago...he has had plenty of time to apologize and release a statement.


    If this shit happened to a group in the Big 3/4 this forum would be in an uproar but it's happening to Ateez and ya'll think we are wrong for calling the hypocrisy and lack of an apology/statement out. It's kind of bullshit. lol. I am pretty sure that if this wasn't a copy Wooyoung wouldn't bother and their choreographers from 2019 wouldn't be going live on Instagram to make a statement...give me a break lol

    Yeah but he didnt win that episode because of that move though? he won because he came out with a catchy choreography ( that had many moves + a copied move which he should have credited)

    Plus my question is will you all be reacting the same way if the dance didnt garner attention?

    Quote from xx-jenn-xx

    I'll be real with you, I don't know what Zico has to do with this either. Most of what I see is geared towards Vata. I think maybe Zico was doing the dance challenge to it or something, and I believe (correct me if I'm wrong Atiny's or whomever) that some got upset over him doing it because of Vata's choreography and not because it was done to Ateez Say My Name.


    That's where I think Zico comes into play?!

    I have seen all zicos dances to this ( including live ones in festvals) and he has ALWAYS avoided that move

  • AllKill VIP
    Quote from Zicofan000

    Yeah but he didnt win that episode because of that move though? he won because he came out with a catchy choreography ( that had many moves + a copied move which he should have credited)

    Plus my question is will you all be reacting the same way if the dance didnt garner attention?

    I'm sure anyone who watched that show and knows ateez would have pointed it out at some point. The thing is I didn't catch wooyoung's move he did at kcon despite me watching it and I had no idea this was an issue until it became and outrage. Wooyoung subtly called him out, where it escalated from that point I don't know. This is me being honest. I wouldn't have known and I wouldn't be defending Ateez and the realization of it all if it didn't blow up so big because I don't watch that show and I don't follow stan twitter.


    he won the episode for the choreography he created which included that dance move. IMO it invalidates you as a professional to win something with a move incorporated that you didn't create yourself. That's just my opinion.

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