My OPINION about Melon 2024 "Album of the Year!

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    I didn't open this thread, because I want to fight with people, but I didn't get a chance to prove my point! Some people think being "OBJECTIVE" means, you can ONLY rely on NUMBERS, but that's completely FALSE! When it comes to music, it's 100% about QUALITY and that's not about taste, especially if you know something about music, and you're not just a fan!


    If anyone start to fight and making it personal rather than prove why I'm wrong, I will ask alexS to close this thread or throw it in the river. 😉


    So, here's why I think "IU - Love Wins All" should've won AOTY! And no, I'm not saying this, because I love IU (5 of the nominated artists are my faves not just her), or because I loved her album the most! That would be 100% fan opinion, but as a sound engineer myself, I rate songs and albums in general based on 3 or 4 main criteria:


    1. Composition

    2. Lyrics

    3. Versatility (different genres)

    4. Vocal performance


    That's all. I don't care about charts or sales, BUT if you want to see stats, here are some:


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    Spotify: 135M

    Youtube Music: 305M


    Pretty much the only platforms where both Gidle and Aespa beating her.


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    And so on...

  • AllKill VIP
    • New

    I have big respect to IU but she was basically unseen this year

    also circle numbers don't count here

    the score was:

    60% - Melon digital

    20% - fan votes

    20% - judge panel votes


    and overall IU already won way too much awards today

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    Like 1
    • New
    Quote from David33

    When it comes to music, it's 100% about QUALITY

    I wonder what people mean when they say this, mysic is subjective, so who are you to say which album is better than another?


    Anyway, discussing something subjective as music quality for awards which have strict criteria like 60% digitals 20% fan votes 20% panelists is ridiculous.

    • New

    Except Love Wins all and Shh other songs in that album are miiiid

    Taeyeon To.X is 10 times better as an album compared to “Winning”! If I would go by your criteria I would give Album of the year to Taeyeon not IU


    Heck even Armageddon Album has more good songs…

    7 out of 10 songs in Armageddon are good

    If you don’t like Hip-hop then it is fine, but Armageddon has very good Hip hop direction and production in the first half of the album


    Anyways Armageddon album has insane production and a lot of good songs so it deserves Album of The year and of course charted really well

    • New
    Quote from bartkun

    I have big respect to IU but she was basically unseen this year

    What do you mean by "unseen this year"? She had the biggest Kpop concert this year. The only artist with a 100% sold-out rate everywhere. Her album was a massive success. So, I don't get what you're trying to say.


    She was working non-stop all year, that's why she couldn't attend to any Award, because she's sick. She didn't just release a new album and did her first World Tour, but she finished shooting her biggest Kdrama produced by Netflix also. And I didn't mention her Variety appearances and her YT channel.

    • New
    Quote from sveznalica

    I wonder what people mean when they say this, mysic is subjective, so who are you to say which album is better than another?


    Anyway, discussing something subjective as music quality for awards which have strict criteria like 60% digitals 20% fan votes 20% panelists is ridiculous.

    Music is only subjective when we're talking about which song we like the most.


    I'm talking about the actual quality of the song.


    For example, I love Armageddon (the song) MUCH better than Supernova, BUT Love Wins All was a better produced song.


    Supernova may be a bigger hit than LWA, but Armageddon as an ALBUM is not better than The Winning! On IU's album, there's only 5 songs, and pretty much all of those are better than any song on Armageddon.


    pasted-from-clipboard.png   pasted-from-clipboard.png

    Quote from sveznalica

    David almost all IU achievements you posted to use as an argument against aespa winning AOTY look laughable, especially when you see numbers aespa pulled this year. Yes, IU is successful woman, living legend, but this year someone did better than her and that's okay!

    I don't think it's laughable that a SOLOIST pulled better numbers than a mainstream group. Gidle and Aespa only have a big advantage on Spoti and YT!

    • New

    Actually, IU and Taeyeon would've been my pick for AOTY, but I choose IU, because it was more balanced and more versatile overall.


    I love Hip Hop, but I didn't like what Aespa released, it was nothing special. Honestly, I don't even remember which one was a Hip Hop song.

    • New

    And how is music quality not subjective? It is basically what you prefer

    • New

    Yeah, I've seen your posts, and I usually just leave it alone, but this is the kind of shit that gives professional musicians a bad name. I don't go around talking about this because it literally does not matter and does not make my opinion inherently more valuable. I have a Master's degree in Music Theory and Composition, and am a full time working musician, so you could say I "know something about music".


    I know nothing I say is going to change your mind or your behavior, so I'm directing this to anyone else who is reading. I'm actually pleasantly surprised that nobody seems to be buying this bullshit, but just in case. Don't let anyone tell you their opinion on art is more valuable because of some arbitrary criteria like their job title. Also, not all of us industry professionals are this insufferable. Carry on.

    • New

    No it’s not. IU’s song production has always been extremely mid. She’s like Taylor swift in that people resonate with her pop lyrics but she’s the lowest common denominator and that’s why she appeals to such a broad crowd in Korea.

    • New

    Ok if you want to talk quality, then IU's album wasn't even the best solo album this year.


    • Memi's album was by far better and interesting then IU (whose been kind of resting on her laurels a bit). That would be my pick for album of the year (Dec 2023 still counts).
    • Darin's got an incredible Voice
    • I thought Jungtune's album was far more interesting then IUs
    • EJae's album was well received and critically admired
    • Not my cup of tea but I heard many good things about Kim Min Hee


    Here's the rub David. You don't want IU competing in an out and out "merit" battle with some of the amazing indie music coming out from Korean female soloists. What i've recommended above is the tip of the Iceberg.


    You DO want streams and stats to count, but only up to a certain point, because otherwise she'll out and out lose. So you want your cake but to eat it too.


    IU's Lilac was far far better then her recent one, and even it lost to another female soloist on pure merit in 2022, losing to Lang Lee.


    You whinge about the stats, but you want them to count for the awards, otherwise a free for all against what IU dropped in 2024? You won't like the results.


    But again, don't have to believe me, wait for KMA in early Feb to see the real results.

    • New
    Quote from David33

    Some people think being "OBJECTIVE" means, you can ONLY rely on NUMBERS, but that's completely FALSE! When it comes to music, it's 100% about QUALITY and that's not about taste, especially if you know something about music, and you're not just a fan!


    That would be 100% fan opinion, but as a sound engineer myself, I rate songs and albums in general based on 3 or 4 main criteria:


    That's all. I don't care about charts or sales, BUT if you want to see stats, here are some:


    You're entitled to your opinion about what is your own personal favourite album of the year.


    That said, you've completely contradicted yourself. You can't talk about objectivity then rate something based off your own criteria. That's being subjective.


    As for the stats and the X posts you've referred too, most of them are dated earlier in the year.


    Bearing in mind that Armageddon also has around 3 months less tracking time than The Winning, here are some more recent posts that provide a reason as to why Armageddon is indeed deserving of the Album of the Year award. At least by award show criteria.


    Korea

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    International

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    • New
    Quote from sveznalica

    And how is music quality not subjective? It is basically what you prefer

    No, it's not. It's literally like comparing two pictures that you take with two different phones, for example. You can see the difference in quality!


    You can like the iPhone one better or the Samsung version, but if you look at it as a PROFESSIONAL, you will see the real differences! That's what I'm talking about! What you're saying is just TASTE! Personal taste has nothing to do with quality!

    • New
    Quote from frala19

    Yeah, I've seen your posts, and I usually just leave it alone, but this is the kind of shit that gives professional musicians a bad name. I don't go around talking about this because it literally does not matter and does not make my opinion inherently more valuable. I have a Master's degree in Music Theory and Composition, and am a full time working musician, so you could say I "know something about music".


    I know nothing I say is going to change your mind or your behavior, so I'm directing this to anyone else who is reading. I'm actually pleasantly surprised that nobody seems to be buying this bullshit, but just in case. Don't let anyone tell you their opinion on art is more valuable because of some arbitrary criteria like their job title. Also, not all of us industry professionals are this insufferable. Carry on.

    It's not my fault if people can't understand the difference between QUALITY and PERSONAL TASTE!


    At least my reviews are fair, unlike most of you! I don't pick my favorite songs, because it was released by my fave artist, I pick the best songs, MV's and albums, because it was the better produced one!


    So, yeah, it's not bullshit, you just can't handle real opinions if it's not 100% blindfolded fangirling.


    People like you always talking nonsense about Charts, and Streaming numbers, but ONLY when their faves doing great, but when they don't, suddenly Charts don't matter anymore.


    At least, I'm not a hypocrite, and I don't write my reviews to make everyone like me or to please everyone!


    Go, live in your Delulu Land, I don't care, but don't talk about Quality Music if you don't know what it means!


    For the record: I never called anyone's opinion BULLSHIT, unlike you! And you wanna lecture me? You're just like Yama, talking nonsense about toxicity yet, he's trolling other fandoms every day. Stop preaching water if you're drinking wine.

    • New

    I'm obviously talking about the nominated artists, not the whole Kpop!

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    Like I said many times. My criteria is not subjective, because it's not about personal taste. If it's a 100% personal taste, I would've picked Moonbyul's album or Taeyeon's.


    I looked at the numbers now, just for you!


    Album Stream on Melon. Link for you to check it: https://xn--o39an51b2re.com


    The Winning: 172M (5 songs)

    Armageddon: 185M (10 songs)

    • New
    Quote from sveznalica

    I wonder what people mean when they say this, mysic is subjective, so who are you to say which album is better than another?


    Anyway, discussing something subjective as music quality for awards which have strict criteria like 60% digitals 20% fan votes 20% panelists is ridiculous.

    nah digitals, the quality matters

    "You can troll on your main and we have plenty examples of that" (c) Ves


    soojin-seo-soojin.gifsoojin-seo-soojin.gifsoojin-gidle.gif

    • New

    David33 is cooking y'all lowkey. But it's still a losing battle.


    --


    Music being subjective is in the sense of preference. A song can be of high quality and you would still not like it simply because it is not to your taste.


    Music being objective is in the sense of quality. High quality songs have high production value, effective chord progressions, dynamic range, etc.


    But like I said, a song can be of high quality and you would still dislike it. Which brings me to my conclusion: music is mostly and usually subjective because it is shaped by individual experiences ...HOWEVER music can still possess objective elements.

    • New

    so now what? You want to be selective in couting charting poitns, and want to introduce subjectivity i.e. your opinion in selecting AOTY


    Simple, just create your own award show and give the AOTY to IU. You can apply all your opinion and craft the selective criteria in determining the winners

    • New
    Quote from David33

    I'm obviously talking about the nominated artists, not the whole Kpop!

    Yes but you don't get to pick and choose your lane.


    Again, you're trying to basically be hypocritical. You want stats to count, otherwise you've no guarantee of IU's album even being nominated, but you don't want them to count "too much" either, because that's why Aespa's Armageddon and (G)I-DLE's 2 had higher results.


    Your entire premise is flawed. If that stats count for the nomination, they count for the result - hence Armageddon winning.


    If they don't count, then who knows if IU would even be nominated. Certainly in an "album of the year" category across all musical artists last year.

    • New
    Quote from David33

    No, it's not. It's literally like comparing two pictures that you take with two different phones, for example. You can see the difference in quality!


    You can like the iPhone one better or the Samsung version, but if you look at it as a PROFESSIONAL, you will see the real differences! That's what I'm talking about! What you're saying is just TASTE! Personal taste has nothing to do with quality!

    And good for us that music and phones are not the same, as saying in my country goes, don't mix grandmas with frogs.

    • New

    I don't like awards for this reason: it's very subjective.


    Music, painting, dancing, etc. are all arts. If we judge them at it's core, it's really about how well they are able to evoke a feeling from the audience.


    Speaking from a literature standpoint, technicality, rules and "quality" in writing are often broken for the sake of delivering a specific message to the readers. The same applies for any arts.


    Thus, it is extremely unfair to judge arts and give awards. Charts will be biased. Judges will be biased. People should stop objectifying something subjective and just enjoy the moment.

    • New
    Quote from David33

    No, it's not. It's literally like comparing two pictures that you take with two different phones, for example. You can see the difference in quality!


    You can like the iPhone one better or the Samsung version, but if you look at it as a PROFESSIONAL, you will see the real differences! That's what I'm talking about! What you're saying is just TASTE! Personal taste has nothing to do with quality!

    Except you don’t get to decide which is the iPhone and which is the Samsung. Because you know jack shit about music lol.

    • New

    You have to lose some battle to win the war.


    YARN | You may've won the battle, little dude, but you lost the war. | Home Alone 2: Lost in New York (1992) | Video gifs by quotes | bcda2b4e | 紗


    The 2nd part of your comment is what I said, but people don't want to understand it. Kinda get it, tho. Fans, not just Kpop fans, don't want to or can't think like this, they always use their fandom brain.


    To be honest, this is true about Movies and Shows as well. That's why people always argue about which movie deserve to win the Oscar.

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