Do you think KPop being tied to Korea weakened its long term prospects?

Historically, empires which originated from humble beginnings eventually grew out of its home base and moved its capital to a bigger city.

Genghis Khan started out from Onon River, an insignificant river in eastern Mongolia, but since it was too poor and too isolated to support a large entity, he moved his capital to a town called Karacorum (several standings exist), in the middle of Mongolia.

However that was not enough and the capital was later moved to a town which the Chinese called Shangdu, and Samuel Coleridge called Xanadu, which was larger and could support more people.

All Chinese emperors, whether they came from inside or outside of Chinese civilization, had to choose between several cities to serve as a capital. In the old days it was Xian in Shaanxi province or Loyang(sometimes Kaifeng, which is close to Loyang) in Henan province. After these cities got old, it was either Beijing (Peking) or Nanjing (Nanking). Only these two cities were considered to be large enough to control all of China.

Napoleon began from Corsica but he didn't make it his capital.

Stalin was born in Georgia, Caucasus but he didn't make it his capital.

Even Alexander the Great tried to make Babylon as the center of his Empire.

The only empire which made the price of its origin its center appears to be the Roman Empire, but that was 2,000 odd years ago and Rome is at the center of the Italian peninsula so its location was not bad. Still, in its later years, its capital was moved to a town called Mediolanum, which the Italians now call Milano, because that was closer to the economic base of the Empire.

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In retrospect, I now think Korea was too small to house KPop, which was the cultural movement of the 2010s and early 2020s.

I think that at some point, KPop's HQ should have been moved to a larger base, like Tokyo , Singapore or Los Angeles, instead of being stuck at Seoul .

Seoul lacks a decent concert venue, a fact I have gone over quite a few times. Only one stadium worth its crap, with an indifferent populace which has only allowed EXO and BTS (plus potentially iu, who is not a Kpopper) to perform there and then nothing which can house more than 30,000 crowds.

In addition, being stuck in Korea distances the KPop singers from interaction with other countries' top figures, which are essential for increasing international competitiveness.

KPop singers being stuck in Korea meant they could not capitalize in concerts held outside of K-O-R-E-A in 2021, and made them late responding to scheduling events in 2022. (I personally think Mr. Bang should NOT have let the BTS members return to K-O-R-E-A and scheduled more events outside of it earlier this year, largely ignoring the K-O-R-E-A-N fans, but that's another story.)

Being stuck in Korea led these KPop figures to more exposure, more scandals, more rumors, and more unwanted attention.

In addition, the general Korean public proved to be quite hostile, as seen in the circus surrounding BTS' military service, or the inconvenient fact that the Koreans hoLeald IU, primarily a domesticist, in the same regard with BTS (and above basically everyone else), the conqueror of the Earth, and a host of other unnecessary issues which would have been avoided if KPop had been headquartered outside of K-O-R-E-A.

It also subjected the idols to the ravages of the K-O-R-E-A-N show program directors, etc. The infamous ISAC is being revived, for example, although Hybe will continue to boycott it.

The idea I have been pushing for years is leave Korea as a minor league, left for the rookies who want some outside exposure, and the trottists and domesticists, and when an act becomes reasonably popular outside of K-O-R-E-A move it to the overseas HQs to promote extensively to overseas fans, with maybe one promotion in K-O-R-E-A per year.

In other words, liberate KPop from Korea.

Soccer originated in England but is played in many countries. Golf began at Scotland but it is played everywhere. Same thing. KPop could have originated in K-O-R-E-A but it did not have to be the exclusive property of the K-O-R-E-A-N-S who have proven to be hostile to KPop after all.

Quote from bbgc

Except that K-pop didn't originate in Korea, but rather Korean adaptation of Western music production.

So it has already "moved".

In any case, it is not an exclusive property of Koreans, anybody can do 'pop'.

But for it to be K-pop, you do need Koreans, as artists primarily or some association.

You should promote the England based group "Kaachi", they are your non Korean K-pop group.

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Actually, most of the Kpop songs are now written by non-Korean composers. The lyrics could be massaged remotely by some contractors back hom.

It was the staff which were cheaper to use in Korea, plus the desire of the company owners who were keen to collect floating investment capital running around there, which made Kpop get stuck in Korea instead of being allowed to swim around in bigger ponds all the time.

Quote from Afriyieau1

Tbf nothing is really stopping kpop expansion. And kpop has been doing all that you keep saying. It’s just that after dominating SEA and Japan and to an extent China, it was very difficult for kpop to break into the west and other parts of Asia like India

And that’s not because the companies ignored those countries because they did try to push their groups into those markets. But it just never caught on. BTS has done the biggest successful expansion so far for kpop and that’s how kpop is still growing

Because if kpop was still limited to the regions I mentioned before, 4th Gen groups wouldn’t be doing so well like their current achievements and selling million albums easily and pulling good numbers in western tours.

Korea is acting like a mold which makes KPop get stuck.

The headquarters being in K-O-R-E-A makes it subject to the various schemes and paparazzis and scandals based from there.

As long as KPop is headquartered in Korea, it will always be subject to what the K-O-R-E-A-N-S, generally hostile to KPop, feel like about it.

Quote from neigl

To me it seems Kpop is loosing ground in Korean society. If love dive is now #1 with 300-400k listener thats like half of what iu and BG was fighting with, a year ago.

They compensate with exploring more countries. But so far its mainly kids and exotic people. Mainstream wise the english/us domination in Pop is still unbroken.

No need to move the Capital for now.

Being closer to the real fanbase makes KPop more able to react to the changes of fortune.

Being stuck in Korea, which is hostile to KPop as proven by recent events, makes it defensive.

Quote from crimsonice

I don't think there's a need to move. It's an opportunity to establish an entertainment capital in Asia and at the same time.. continue to evolve their society. The world is already very global and accessible.

The rise of KPop should have been accompanied with a major move to make Seoul the entertainment capital of Asia, and possibly the world, but instead the older population propped - trot.

The re-construction of the Chamshil Olympic Stadium, basically the only stadium in Korea which can hold big concerts (the soccer stadium where Big Bang and GDragon had their concerts is far from the city center and soccer fans hate concerts there because they hurt the lawn), has been delayed, delayed and now delayed again so the non-KPopper Lee Jieun can hold her concert there (she cancelled an earlier engagement but it is likely that she will have one more chance in late Sep), shows how uninterested Korea's elites are upon the advancement of KPop.

In addition , being stuck in Korea does stunt their movements as the events of 2020-21 had shown. I think if the company heads had any kind of long term plan, they should have moved Twice to Japan, BlackPink to some country in the West, BTS in USA, etc and weather the travel restrictions there, like Miyawaki Sakura, Yabuki Nako and Honda Hitomi riding out the restrictions in K-O-R-E-A and also the Niziu members who could not return to Japan for a few months.

Quote from bbgc

Maybe 10% of the active groups have some foreign traction and 1% actually make a profit.

The rest 90% depend on the Koreans.

And it should not take nth-level intelligence, to know that the 10% emerges from the same pool.

People are awed by the success of BTS or BP in the West and forgot about the average group.

Korea might have kpop as 30-40% of its consumed music.

Whereas the West might have 4% of which the top groups would take 3.99%.

So where does that leave the average or nugu groups.

So no, it is Koreans who sustain K-pop.

This whole discussion is premised on only the top 5% of the groups.

Where was the West when BTS was struggling from 2013 to 2016?

BigHits girl group GLAMs member resorted to blackmail for money.

Very elitist thread and reeks of cultural appropriation.

It is like those Western White Yoga studio types declaring Hindu opinion on Yoga doesn't matter.

Italian opinion of pizza doesn't matter etc.

Disgusting.

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Except Pizza in most countries have little to do with Neapolitan Pizza.

Italy was not united till 1870. Each region had its own style of food and they had little to do with each other.

Edward Banfield, an American sociologist, went to a small town in southern Italy in 1955 , saw a lot of things he could not imagine in USA, and wrote the "Moral Basis of a Backward Society", whose title probably tells all we need to know about the contents of the book.

What we now call 'Italian' food originated from USA, where immigrants from different regions of Italy met for the first time in their entire lives and had to kind of mingle in the same neighborhood. A common denominator of the 'Italian' food the Americans liked was found.

World War II sent the US troops, including those with Italian backgrounds, everywhere to the world and that's how the 'Italian' food spread. The pizza most people know about has very little to do with that eaten in Naples where it was a regional dish, meaning people out of Naples hardly knew it; the 'Roman' style of Pizza actually comes from the American style of pizza with more ingredients.

There are plenty of 'Chinese' dishes only eaten in Korea, also.

Also, with GFriend, the age of mid-sized groups ended. Groups have to have the ability to challenge for world control, or they won't go too far , as seen in the limited successes of acts from smaller companies in the 4th generation.

When KPop was being big, trot largely hid from public view. So they didn't matter so even older Koreans listened to some KPop, particularly ballads. But now there are fewer younger people and more older people who now exclusively cater to trot, like former balladist Lim Youngwoong. And now people like LeeJuck or Changmin of 2AM write trot songs since that's where the money is, while KPop acts rely on foreign composers.

So a complete divergence appears to have taken place, which won't stop.

Yoga has a bunch of schools. Those who were more likely to spread in the West became well known and turned into the major school.

It is what happens if a regional, or a country-only, trend turns mainstream. It has to transform into something else, or get buried as a fad like Mah Jongg which was very popular during 1920s among Americans but disappeared after WW2 because the Mah Jongg tile makers insisted upon keeping the Chinese symbols, which became not too hip after Pearl Harbor with most people not really knowing the difference between Chinese and Japanese.

Quote from Afriyieau1

It won’t. The fact that kpop groups nowadays are still garnering success even though they don’t have much support from Korea should tell you that opinions of Koreans are irrelevant. Whether they hate or like a group, groups can still do well now

And they took this long to learn it.

Distancing it from Korea will make it more beneficial by distancing it from rapacious Korean reporters, crazed fans and other unpleasantness.

Quote from bbgc

It is nonsensical to talk about locational restrictions, when concerts are a tiny portion of your songs are consumed.

Your HQ can be anywhere in the world, yet content be consumed by anyone anywhere, that's not even a new digital/online thing, but since radios, records, TV etc.

Secondly if there were an economic benefit for K-pop companies to move out, do you think they are stupid enough to ignore it and wait for your suggestion?

They would have considered all the below questions,

While BTS and BP are flaunted, what percentage of global music consumption is K-pop?

Can that percentage be increased by moving outside Korea?

And even if so, will the profit percentage increase, by moving out of Korea?

Will the cost of moving, be worth it in the long run, or is the popularity limited to BTS and a few?

And decided that they are better off with the current model.

Your hate-love obsession with IU is adding your brains.

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Basically it is the Korean execs in the entertainment companies who are angry about moving away since they will become less relevant in different countries.

In Korea, moving the capital from Seoul was discussed a few times because Seoul is so close from North Korea, but each time the movements were defeated by established interests who owned large properties in there, precisely the kind of people who support - IU.

Doing away with Korea also means doing away with these largely irrelevant execs too.

The primary benefit of working in Korea is easier coordination and cheaper costs. However that also leads to inflexibility and making it subject to Korean opinion which can only hurt.