PLEASE READ PART ONE AND THE DISCLAIMERS AT THE BOTTOM BEFORE COMMENTING!!!
Everytime I post one of these threads I get a little sinking feeling, but at the same time the first one performed so fucking well even with all the drama and the only reason I’m posting this is bc the first one had a character limit! So as always, thank you for all the love! Hopefully people don’t act like absolute morons here.
1. DO NOT tag any of the following
- Known antis
- Known trolls
- People who do not want to be tagged
2. DO NOT comment your “opinion” if it’s passive aggressive and baseless. This is for people who can have an open and amicable discussion. You can disagree, but please do it in a respectful manner- it is NOT that difficult.
3. These threads are not for “tea” or “drama”, if you aren’t mature enough to uphold the two rules above, please click the back button!
Do not pull the “oBstRucTiOn oF FrEe sPeEcH!!!1!!!!11!” argument. I spend hours and put lots of work into these threads and I do not want them ending up in Dumpster Fire or getting closed. It is NOT my fault your parents (or possible lack thereof) did not teach you how to communicate respectfully.
This thread exists because there was a character limit on the other one!
Now… as I was saying.
You might be thinking: “Vi, what more could you possibly need to say on this situation?!”
A little more. I didn’t think I would need to but apparently I do.
So curb your enthusiasm little antis, page 7 will be there whenever you need it!
I already broke down most player hater “nAmjOoN dId nOt ApOLoGizE!!!11!!!”/”nOt rEaL aPoLoGy!!!1!” logic in the original thread along with providing proof of growth.
And I could continue and go into more specifics, but I won’t.
Here’s why you shouldn’t either!
Something that I've read multiple times is that some "but namjoon" types intentionally hold BTS to an impossibly high standard and admit that they do this, while also admitting that they hold their own groups to a lower standard. Their reasoning is that BTS is a global group so they're expecting to know better and not make mistakes. You can see how this makes zero sense because the mistakes that are brought up are from the past before BTS was global. Well then the narrative shifts to Namjoon needs to apologize more explicitly to set an example for other groups because that's his obligation as leader of BTS. They just move the goal posts constantly. Some kpop fans are the most hateful projecting bunch of fans I've ever seen. My theory is that these are the fans for whom kpop is escapism and if they acknowledge that their fave has made a mistake, they can't tolerate that because it ruins the fantasy that they're using to escape their IRL problems. So the focus must always be shifted and fault projected elsewhere.
TLDR: Nothing BTS (or Namjoon) ever do will be good enough for some people so there is literally 0 point trying to change anyone’s opinion. Some people use k-pop as unhealthy escapism and their fave making a mistake distorts that fantasy, so they deflect to Namjoon.
Anyone here a psychology or sociology major?
Let’s talk about the selective exposure theory.
The selective exposure theory refers to an individual’s tendency to favor information which reinforces their pre-existing beliefs/views while avoiding contradictory information. (It’s also been known as “confirmation bias”). People will take apart information given to them, and either reject it or accept it based on their own beliefs and mindset. They choose the idea/information that is favorable to them. When those same individuals are confronted with information that contrasts their ideas and previous information given to them, people use certain defense mechanisms in order to achieve their own peace of mind (cognitive equilibrium). The selective exposure theory is crucially based on the assumption that one will continue to seek out information on an issue that they have already established their firm (opposing) stance on.
An example of this would be the antis refusing to acknowledge any of his explanations or apologies- instead they seek out situations where he could come off as racist, etc. in order to confirm their bias. Antis will go deep diving through BTS’ videos under the guise of “being informative”, but their stance on the situation/RM has already long been established.
Ladies and gentlemen… we broke down “but namjoon”ers.
People who use the “but namjoon” argument do not have the intention of changing (and we shouldn’t try to change them).
However, we can be well-informed about his growth and what he’s done since then.
*Had to cut some parts out because of the character limit AGAIN*
Even after making the decision to join BTS, there were a lot hurdles. Some people might not believe, but most people thought we were hopeless. And sometimes, I just wanted to quit. But I think I was very lucky that I didn’t give it all up. And I’m sure that I, and we, will keep stumbling and falling like this.
Maybe I made a mistake yesterday, but yesterday’s me is still me. Today, I am who I am with all my faults and my mistakes. Tomorrow, I might be a tiny bit wiser, and that’ll be me too. These faults and mistakes are what I am, making up the brightest stars in the constellation of my life. I have come to love myself for who I am, for who I was, and for who I hope to become.
No matter who you are, where you’re from, your skin color, your gender identity, just speak yourself. Find your name and find your voice by speaking yourself.
I’m Kim Nam-joon, and also RM of BTS. I’m an idol and I’m an artist from a small town in Korea. Like most people, I’ve made many and plenty mistakes in my life. I have many faults and I have many more fears, but I am going to embrace myself as hard as I can, and I’m starting to love myself gradually, just little by little. What is your name? Speak yourself. Thank you very much.
This speech speaks for itself (literally). I mean… wow. It leaves me speechless every. time.
Who even does… that? I want you to imagine going out of your way to do that. Sure, Americans/other foreigners could make the effort to understand the culture more and realize that the word doesn’t mean what they think it does- but RM closed the gap and left no room for misinterpretation. The argument that he doesn’t care quickly comes apart when you realize he did this in 2018, 5 years after that incident. It’s obvious he does care, and he does want to right his wrongs- it’s shown through his actions consistently ever since he promised to better himself during his Hello 2017 V-live where he discussed his past mistakes and issues. If he didn’t care, I don’t think he would’ve taken a precaution that some people have deemed “unnecessary”.
It’s difficult to argue someone is a bad person when they have created multiple circumstances (the rest mentioned in the other thread) throughout their lives and have subsequently used those situations as stepping stones whilst uplifting others. If you try to explain this to an anti from an objective and non-Namjoon related standpoint, you’ll REALLY get to witness the logical fallacy they got going on.
It’ll look something like this:
Person B: My fave is in a controversy again for being racist.
Person A: What?
Person B: Yeah. Some of the lyrics are iffy, but at least they’re not Namjoon.
Person A: Namjoon acknowledged and apologized for his behavior years ago. He’s also working to become a better person. He even changed the lyrics to “Fake Love” just to make sure people wouldn’t mix up the lyrics because some words sound alike!
Person B: Um. I don’t know. He hasn’t done enough. It seems kinda disingenuous.
Or maybe even this:
Anti: I am sorry for saying that very offensive word again, it’s a bad habit. I know it’s the fifth time but I swear I’ll stop. Forgive me?
Any sane person: No
Anti: But YOU OWE ME YOUR FORGIVENESS!!! YOU FORGAVE NAMJOON!!!
You see the issue here? By their own logic, no human can grow and become a better person except for them or the people they favor- and especially not RM. & yes I KNOW that seems like a given but hey, it’s better to over-explain then to under-explain.
So today I will leave you with some logical fallacies, because why not? Fun fact: an anecdotal evidence fallacy x Army TWT analysis thread should be coming soon!
Anecdotal evidence fallacy: people base their arguments on their own experiences- emotion outweighs factual evidence and they fail to realize they are generalizing just one circumstance.
Slothful induction fallacy: god this one should just be named the k-pop fallacy. This fallacy occurs when one ignores substantial evidence and makes a claim based on coincidence or something completely irrelevant to the argument. In this fallacy, there is facts and evidence that what you are saying is in fact true, the person arguing you just chooses not to acknowledge it.
Tu qoque fallacy: this should be called the AKP fallacy because half the people who will try to argue with me do this instead lmao. This fallacy occurs when the opposing side decides not to create a valid counter argument, and instead criticizes you on something unrelated or arbitrary. This is just straight up attacking someone without coming up with a logical counterclaim- a common occurrence on this forum.
There are more but these are my faves :)
Anyways, I’m so glad they finally reunited with Armys, even though I’m total lime green jello (I’m so jelly).
I thought I was okay but...
But Namjoon was lookin’ so good at these concerts wowee!