Interesting
I wonder what's the consensus will be once Kepler disbanded
If the post disbandment groups are successful it's privilege. If they flop it's GP999 curse
RE: Produce privilege shouldn't even be call as a privilege
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just u all wait until Boys Planet 999 will start and they will have performances with fans in audience or even some fan meetings and open performances when they will be able to interact with fans
for sure that itself will make show bigger than GP999 which was held during corona times
we will also see what will happen to ILAND girls edition, altough with the way how NewJeans members are so young I'm a bit concerned about this one
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its privilege but nowhere strong as big 3/4 privilege ofc
Literally this. It helps out for the first year/debut and first comeback then disappears. It turns out, like the whole k-pop industry, the produce members are mostly fast-fashioned
Edit: just a note as well, or an observation, produce shows aren't meant to secure/lead the participates to a long successful career. After the show 90 participants are left in the dust whilst the 11(/12) members who made it are only guaranteed stardom for a few years. Not even guaranteed knowing X1. After that their path ends and they're dropped into the dust as well. Fast-fashion. Sorry I just had that thought I had to get out
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Depends on what you mean by privilege. Yujin and Wonyoung aren’t privileged. They’ve built their fandom and popularity same way as any other idol. They promoted and been active for 3 years now. They’ve earned it. But Ive and the other members have an advantage. Not sure I’d call it privilege, but an advantage for sure.
That goes for all ex-produce groups, even the ones that flopped. Really, it goes for all groups with a member who was already famous pre-debut.
Difference between Lesserafim and Ive and other ex-produce groups is that they’re actually good groups. Lesserafim is also from a big 4 agency and would have succeeded without any ex-Izone member. Just like Itzy succeed without Somi. Ive would have a harder time gaining popularity if not for Yujin and Wonyoung but even with the two of them they’d failed if it wasn’t for the fact that they’re genuinely a good group with amazing music.
IOI didn’t promote for as long as Izone and weren’t able to build a big, stable fandom, but they were popular. 3 of them were tipped to be the next it-girl. Gugudan’s debut charted pretty high on Melon and Weki Meki had decent sales. But people didn’t like their debuts and for each comeback they lost more and more popularity. Same would have happened to Ive if it wasn’t for Eleven, Love Dive and After Like being amazing songs and great comebacks.
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Question is really if it’s privilege to have member/s who were already popular pre-debut. With their own fandoms and selling power.
Personally I don’t think that’s privilege. It’s an advantage, but not privilege.
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Question is really if it’s privilege to have member/s who were already popular pre-debut. With their own fandoms and selling power.
Personally I don’t think that’s privilege. It’s an advantage, but not privilege.
i mean advantage and privilege are synonyms words
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hmmm might of been of change of concept, the main track on wyl is not exactly appealing, it also could’ve been of yeonjung because I know a lot of people who just like yeonjung
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They have privileges for sure. Is that the reason why they are doing great? I dont think so.
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i mean advantage and privilege are synonyms words
Yes but there are nuances to it and they can't always be used as synonyms. Privilege hints at a system and exclusivity. It's something only few can benefit from. An advantage is something that helps you succeed and/or reach your goal.
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I dont deny that IVE/LE SSERAFIM benefitted from Produce/IZ*ONE, but so did every other Big 3/4 that benefitted from their own companies. In fact, I would say post IZ*ONE groups/artists EARNED THEIR PRIVILEGE. They worked hard for 2.5 years (and even more years before Produce 48) to build up their fanbase, hone their skills. They VERY WELL DESERVE THE PRIVILEGE. Has any of the Big 3/4 worked hard for 2.5 years to GET THEIR PRIVILEGE? Sure they worked hard as trainees waiting for the debut. Guess what, IZ*ONE members DID TOO before they went on the show. And on top of that they hustle for 2.5 years to get to where they are.
I think the crux of the problem is because this "privilege" word is used to discredit a group.
They mix the earned privilege with the unearned one.
both are earned, but people would use the "privilege" word to say "those group don't deserve the fame and success" -
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There's definitely some privilege as the Izone members had established fanbases already upon debut. It wouldn't be the same if they were unknown rookies. At least at debut. Their sustained success is due to them and their company/producers, like every other group.
Context matters too in this case. I'm surprised that anyone can compare PD48 with GP999 for example.
One is the most successful season/group and had the additional exposure of partnering with AKB48, one of the most well recognised JPOP groups. The other was a rebrand that happened after a massive scandal. A Kepler member won't debut with the same fanbase as an Izone member.
The other thing I find odd are the comments that the ex-Izone members worked hard for their success. I agree, but does it lessen the hard work of NMixx, Aespa, Itzy, New Jeans etc because they didn't do the "hard work" in the public eye? Like didn't Lily train for a really long time? Is that worth less because nobody saw it?
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There's definitely some privilege as the Izone members had established fanbases already upon debut. It wouldn't be the same if they were unknown rookies. At least at debut. Their sustained success is due to them and their company/producers, like every other group.
Context matters too in this case. I'm surprised that anyone can compare PD48 with GP999 for example.
One is the most successful season/group and had the additional exposure of partnering with AKB48, one of the most well recognised JPOP groups. The other was a rebrand that happened after a massive scandal. A Kepler member won't debut with the same fanbase as an Izone member.
The other thing I find odd are the comments that the ex-Izone members worked hard for their success. I agree, but does it lessen the hard work of NMixx, Aespa, Itzy, New Jeans etc because they didn't do the "hard work" in the public eye? Like didn't Lily train for a really long time? Is that worth less because nobody saw it?
Every idols went through the stage of being a trainees and work hard to debut same with the Produce members. The point is that produce members earn their popularity and fandom through debuting in a Produce group by promoting music, going on variety show and such... then they bring those "popularity" to their newer group after produce group disband.
and for the group you mention, the different is that they already have popularity and eyes on them because of "big 4 privilege".
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Every idols went through the stage of being a trainees and work hard to debut same with the Produce members. The point is that produce members earn their popularity and fandom through debuting in a Produce group by promoting music, going on variety show and such... then they bring those "popularity" to their newer group after produce group disband.
and for the group you mention, the different is that they already have popularity and eyes on them because of "big 4 privilege".
Yes, Big 4 is privilege, that's true and I didn't claim otherwise. But so is getting that 2.5 years of exposure prior to their debut with their actual groups. If you want to be really pedantic, Ive/LSF and the non-produce members get that privilege, more so than the Produce members themselves.
Long term, Big 4 will always have the advantage, but for their debut the privilege is certainly there for the ex-PD48 members.
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bet if IVE/LE SSERAFIM was flopping hard y'all would call it a curse.
I don't think it is a privilege or a curse. It can be played either way. There is an advantage that they already have a fanbase to go off of and you can't really argue against that. But that doesn't guarantee success either.
For the IZONE soloist, I don't really like their music, I hear them being mentioned now and again but not much else. From IOI there is Somi, Chunga, and the actress from business proposal. That's it really.
It all depends on how the company promotes them. With IVE and Sserafim they stuck with few members and didn't solely rely on produce fame as others did, they also had really good songs.
The IOI groups didn't go as hard, they relied on the members produce fame and that's why they failed.
Also who is downplaying IVE and Serafim? Like you're the only person on this site to mention this so idk why you're so angry. I haven't seen any thread downplaying IVE and Serafim's success.
Hell if anything IVE especially is hyped up. Everyone thinks they will win rookie of the year and there are so many threads about why they deserve that title.
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Yes, Big 4 is privilege, that's true and I didn't claim otherwise. But so is getting that 2.5 years of exposure prior to their debut with their actual groups. If you want to be really pedantic, Ive/LSF and the non-produce members get that privilege, more so than the Produce members themselves.
Long term, Big 4 will always have the advantage, but for their debut the privilege is certainly there for the ex-PD48 members.
I don't think anyone here is denying that IVE/LSF benefit from having ex-izone members.
Produce privilege is that members already have a fanbase when debuting a new group while Big 4 group will always have the attention from the public.
Long term or debut, big 4 have the privilege, but for ex-produce their privilege is only them bring their fandom over unless you have a Wonyoung lol.
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big 3/4 privilege >>produce privilege
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