This tweet just highlights BTS' power and relevance in the western music industry

facts spilled

LMAO Facts

This is very very correct

When you are popular among your peers too.

Why no major pop star is allying with the one person who could check BTS is a mystery

Quote from WhyKnock

Why no major pop star is allying with the one person who could check BTS is a mystery

You mean IU don't you? Just for a goof, what "alliance" do you think would "check" BTS? No disparagement to IU, who is a wonderful artist, but I think you are amongst the many who think that what BTS have accomplished is easy and as simple as getting a western collab.

Quote from Klaymore

You mean IU don't you? Just for a goof, what "alliance" do you think would "check" BTS? No disparagement to IU, who is a wonderful artist, but I think you are amongst the many who think that what BTS have accomplished is easy and as simple as getting a western collab.

What BTS, Bang PD achieved in S.Korea is indeed organic and through the curve.

But their current Western popularity is considerably due to being plugged into a high-powered existing machine like Columbia.

That does not mean BTS has no credit, if they don't have what it takes, no high-powered machine can sell them.

But just to point out that their success in Korea and success in West have different dynamics.

We will have to wait and see, if the Western stint is a lasting one or is it like the super-foods sold in the West, every couple of years there would be a new 'food' with massive marketing push and chatter - Kale, Quinoa, Turmeric milk, Jackfruit etc.

And BTS do seem to be aware of it, in the Billboard interview when RM states they don't expect to be mainstream in the West, but want to have one major stadium tour. That is a very grounded perspective.

As to Whyknock thinking that Kpop is some medieval strife of the princes, where there can only be 'ONE' and all others decimated, the intention is not to take down BTS, but rather IU, according to Whyknock she is a burden on Kpop and should retire or be made to retire.

Quote from bbgc

What BTS, Bang PD achieved in S.Korea is indeed organic and through the curve.

But their current Western popularity is considerably due to being plugged into a high-powered existing machine like Columbia.

That does not mean BTS has no credit, if they don't have what it takes, no high-powered machine can sell them.

But just to point out that their success in Korea and success in West have different dynamics.

We will have to wait and see, if the Western stint is a lasting one or is it like the super-foods sold in the West, every couple of years there would be a new 'food' with massive marketing push and chatter - Kale, Quinoa, Turmeric milk, Jackfruit etc.

And BTS do see to be aware of it, in the Billboard interview when RM states they don't expect to be mainstream in the West, but want to have one major stadium tour. That is a very grounded perspective.

As to Whyknock thinking that Kpop is some medieval strife of the princes, where there can only be 'ONE' and all others decimated, the intention is not to take down BTS, but rather IU, according to Whyknock she is a burden on Kpop and should retire or be made to retire.

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You attributing BTS' success in the west to a label push is like the other guy who thinks an IU/Cardi B collab would "check" BTS. Their western stint of success as you put it, has been going on since 2017, I don't see it slowing down.

Also, WTF is this nonsense about Kale and Quinoa? Don't quote me again.

Quote from Klaymore

You attributing BTS' success in the west to a label push is like the other guy who thinks an IU/Cardi B collab would "check" BTS. Their western stint of success as you put it, has been going on since 2017, I don't see it slowing down.

Also, WTF is this nonsense about Kale and Quinoa? Don't quote me again.

If you don't want me to quote you, then you should have not quoted me.

And if you think that Western success is exactly same as their Korean, that is like saying Kale and Quinoa are the same.

As to things nonsensical, educate yourself.

Quote from bbgc

What BTS, Bang PD achieved in S.Korea is indeed organic and through the curve.

But their current Western popularity is considerably due to being plugged into a high-powered existing machine like Columbia.

That does not mean BTS has no credit, if they don't have what it takes, no high-powered machine can sell them.

But just to point out that their success in Korea and success in West have different dynamics.

We will have to wait and see, if the Western stint is a lasting one or is it like the super-foods sold in the West, every couple of years there would be a new 'food' with massive marketing push and chatter - Kale, Quinoa, Turmeric milk, Jackfruit etc.

And BTS do seem to be aware of it, in the Billboard interview when RM states they don't expect to be mainstream in the West, but want to have one major stadium tour. That is a very grounded perspective.

As to Whyknock thinking that Kpop is some medieval strife of the princes, where there can only be 'ONE' and all others decimated, the intention is not to take down BTS, but rather IU, according to Whyknock she is a burden on Kpop and should retire or be made to retire.

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They aren't even fully signed to Columbia unlike a sh*t ton of other kpop acts who are fully signed to their western labels.

BTS only has a distribution deal with Columbia. Columbia barely even pushes them in the west... especially at the beginning where DNA, Fake Love, IDOL had pretty much no radio and no playlisting on spotify (also btw BTS wasn't even signed to Columbia when they charted on the hot 100 with DNA). BWL had more radio and playlisting than the normal BTS song cause of Halsey's label (it was pretty obvious given that when halsey released her new single "Nightmare" a few weeks after BWL's releases that BWL's radio started decreasing and they were taken off big playlists). And than ON got no radio and barely any playlisting.

BTSs western popularity and its growth has NEVER NEVER EVER been cause of Columbia. The first "proper" push BTS ever got from Columbia was Dynamite, that was after they'd had a whole ass stadium tour in the US and had also sold out 15 stadiums in the US for the MOTS Tour). So miss me with "plugged into a high powered existing machine like Columbia" talk.

"And no one knows them"

Ooohhh the dots are connected now! So it will be a live concert?

Quote from Klaymore

You mean IU don't you? Just for a goof, what "alliance" do you think would "check" BTS? No disparagement to IU, who is a wonderful artist, but I think you are amongst the many who think that what BTS have accomplished is easy and as simple as getting a western collab.

It is like fighting wars. If you want to beat someone you ally with the party most likely to beat the person.

Quote from worldlove27

They aren't even fully signed to Columbia unlike a sh*t ton of other kpop acts who are fully signed to their western labels.

BTS only has a distribution deal with Columbia. Columbia barely even pushes them in the west... especially at the beginning where DNA, Fake Love, IDOL had pretty much no radio and no playlisting on spotify (also btw BTS wasn't even signed to Columbia when they charted on the hot 100 with DNA). BWL had more radio and playlisting than the normal BTS song cause of Halsey's label (it was pretty obvious given that when halsey released her new single "Nightmare" a few weeks after BWL's releases that BWL's radio started decreasing and they were taken off big playlists). And than ON got no radio and barely any playlisting.

BTSs western popularity and its growth has NEVER NEVER EVER been cause of Columbia. The first "proper" push BTS ever got from Columbia was Dynamite, that was after they'd had a whole ass stadium tour in the US and had also sold out 15 stadiums in the US for the MOTS Tour). So miss me with "plugged into a high powered existing machine like Columbia" talk.

Thanks for the details.

#1. I don't see why it is taken as 'insulting' to be pushed by a label, after all that a major label chooses to do so, is itself an affirmation of their talents.

#2. We can keep hairsplitting on extent of success before and after Dynamite, but reported news is that Ron Perry of Columbia took it as a special project to push Dynamite and that did bring BTS far more reach even among common public, passing listeners of music in the West.

They did put a clip of them performing Not Today in there, that was purposeful.

Hmmm... it's bbgc an alt of that anti, mods?

Quote from paradis

I mean, no lies were told

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please tell me what is in the tweets. Twt blocked.

Quote from Ves

Don't bother. That one tried to argue PTD was not about the pandemic while knowing nothing about it. Would not be surprised if they don't realize BTS only has a distribution deal with Columbia and is not a fully signed artist. I'm not going to diminish what Columbia has done, but it was the fans that brought BTS to the states and sold out their stadium tours. And now we're "chart manipulators" just because we buy music like we buy tix to their concerts. Yes, thanks Columbia.

That was not my primary 'argument', but that performing at UNGA is historic and they had better song- lyrics which can resonate far into the future than PTD, and do not need MV/scrambling to contextualize the message

But if they were requested specifically for pandemic, then PTD suffices.

Anyway I should know better than to debate 'nuance' with 'fans', the word comes from 'fanatics' and nuance/context is not something fanatics are known far.

I should not bother, and yes fans should not bother either. Good advice.

Quote from Ves

LOL, you know you're ARMY when you recognize the choreo from a 2 second clip. Right there with you!

LMAO you caught me.

I feel like this comeback will finally be up in my alley again since I am a emo kid lmao

Too bad Itzy is coming back at the same day but well... What can we do.

Quote from Ves

If you need it boiled down, we are the ones taking the heat for their "success", getting lambasted across social media as "chart manipulators", oddly enough using a similar "fanatics" argument that you employ here. Anyway, I'll be damned if I'm going to let someone give all the credit to Columbia after that.

tbh I agree, imagine getting bullied all over social media for your hard work then suddenly your hard work isn't your hardwork anymore cause Columbia did the work for you.

But seriously, the bts and army bullying is getting way too far. I just saw people on atlr saying BTS THEMSELVES whitewashed Meghan only in that pic she took with them. It was a filter, even the sky was brighter. And not only that the 2nd pic didn't have any filter at all.

Quote from Ves

If you need it boiled down, we are the ones taking the heat for their "success", getting lambasted across social media as "chart manipulators", oddly enough using a similar "fanatics" argument that you employ here. Anyway, I'll be damned if I'm going to let someone give all the credit to Columbia after that.

And if you check my activities, you will find that I called bullshit on 'chart manipulation' or treating fans as though they are aliens from Mars/not part of public.

You should not bring what you face elsewhere in the context of subject being discussed.

And neither do I limit fan-fanatics to ARMY, all fandoms are premised on an emotional investment beyond mere consumption of music/art.

I think having an organized large fandom is itself a credit, having a major label recognize and push talent is itself a credit.

Quote from Ves

Maybe it'll just be a momentous day in history with two verified bops being released? The 24th is looking to be a very good day indeed!

I'll make sure to check the song as well, it's good to have in between videos during streaming LOL

You guys think it'll be a souful song or a hype one?

Quote from nm-tn

Yes, please, don’t bother.

Because you’re insulting BTS and ARMY by attributing BTSs success here in the West to western attachments (eg. Columbia). As someone mentioned here, Columbia only distributes their albums - probably the reason why they never even lifted a finger before in helping them.

They (Columbia) only hopped on the train when they saw how successful the boys were becoming, and how much they grew with each comeback. They “hopped” on the train that was already going at full throttle. So miss me with the label push thing.

Debunk me by providing a simple comparison.

Percentage of people in the West, say US who were aware of BTS before Dynamite and after Dynamite.

Look at the statistical curve of popularity increase, whether it increased progressively or spiked?

As simple as that.

Note: Don't turn this into "BTS succeeded only because of Columbia" reductionism - I DO NOT imply that at all.

BTS had to be already successful for Columbia to choose them, this is only about their current status and future in the West.

Quote from bbgc

Debunk me by providing a simple comparison.

Percentage of people in the West, say US who were aware of BTS before Dynamite and after Dynamite.

Look at the statistical curve of popularity increase, whether it increased progressively or spiked?

As simple as that.

Note: Don't turn this into "BTS succeeded only because of Columbia" reductionism - I DO NOT imply that at all.

BTS had to be already successful for Columbia to choose them, this is only about their current status and future in the West.

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as someone who is from the US and saw BTS's rise here unfold from the beginning, I can tell you that is not true. From 2017-2018, BTS already had a substantial fanbase here but their name/brand was just starting to develop in the US industry and media. The moment when the media really started talking about them full on was after their very successful SNL appearance in early 2019. After that, their LY Stadium tour and social media presence that came from it coupled with their continued appearances at award shows, interviews, etc is when US armys started noticing that locals really knew BTS even if it was only by their name. By 2020, the pandemic came and their sold out world stadium tour was postponed, so instead of making that time a hiatus, they decided to release Dynamite. Dynamite was huge, partly because of all the newly-turned fans experiencing a comeback for the first time and partly because it was their first English single so US media gave it more attention than their previous releases that were primarily in Korean. But just because the media and industry gave it more love than their Korean songs, doesn't mean the same held true for the GP. I can not tell you how many people I have seen say that they had no idea Dynamite was a BTS song. Yes it was played on the radio a ton, and yes it got lots of press, but still people didn't know it was their song until they saw them perform it. And once seeing them perform, the GP's response 90% of the time was not "oh I like this song, who are the guys singing it, I want to learn about them" but instead it was "omg BTS sang this?? I had no idea. Bro, they sing in English too??". So yes, Dynamite was huge for them, but their name was already out there so that era was just like any other since Wings where it just brought in an another huge group of new fans.

Quote from Ves

I disagree. I think ARMY were key and we are a bigger part of the equation than Columbia. Did Columbia help? Sure. After they saw what we could do, they decided they wanted a slice of the pie after all.

That can be proved/disproved only by data.

What was BTS quantum of recognition before and after Dynamite? Was there a noticeable spike or not?

I see it in the following manner,

BTS success in Korea leads to >> fans pushing their visibility internationally, but still within fan/Korean/limited circles >> labels (Columbia) recognizing the potential >> pushing it to general public consciousness.

I ain't even going to try explain shit to that one user that's in every bts thread trying to dismiss bts and their every achievement.

BTS are legends and no lies was detected in that tweet

Quote from bbgc

I see it in the following manner,

BTS success in Korea leads to >> fans pushing their visibility internationally, but still within fan/Korean/limited circles >> labels (Columbia) recognizing the potential >> pushing it to general public consciousness.

now I really know you don't know what you're talking about. Everyone knows BTS were popular/successful internationally first, then Korea started notice this nugu boygroup that they have been treating badly from the start. BTS aren't your typical success story, so whatever narrative you want them to fit in doesn't work here