When the 3rd generation girl groups arrived, you know a shift happened.

1st Official Post

    2016, a statement year. Trendy and newly debuted girl groups delivered hits left and right.


    Year-end Digital Chart:

    #01. TWICE - CHEER UP

    #03. GFriend - Rough

    #12. Mamamoo - You're The Best

    #16. TWICE - Like OOH-AHH

    #26. TWICE - TT

    #27. GFriend - Me gustas tu

    #29. GFriend - NAVILLERA

    #32. BLACKPINK - Whistle

    #38. Red Velvet - Russian Roulette

    #47. I.O.I. - Very Very Very

    #70. Mamamoo - Decalcomanie

    #71. BLACKPINK - Playing With Fire

    #80. Mamamoo - I Miss You

    #84. Lovelyz - Ah-Choo


    Mamamoo, Red Velvet and Lovelyz were in their 2nd-3rd year

    TWICE and GFriend were in their 1st-2nd year

    BLACKPINK and I.O.I were in their debut year


    My question is this -- If the 4th generation is already here, why is there no significant shift in hierarchy? The top 1-4 girl groups right now are still all 3rd gen groups. Is it possible that 4th gen is not here yet and only coming this year or the next?

    Edited 3 times, last by acadz ().

  • AllKill VIP
    • Official Post

    They're here but they just haven't released any major hits(aside from Dalla Dalla) yet lmao. You can't just expect them to come out of the gate swinging especially when the general public aren't as enthusiastic about idol groups(especially new ones) compared to 2016. Literally the only idol groups that are still digimons with the reform are BTS and BP lmaoo

    Quote from itiswhatitisss

    They're here but they just haven't released any major hits(aside from Dalla Dalla) yet lmao. You can't just expect them to come out of the gate swinging especially when the general public aren't as enthusiastic about idol groups(especially new ones) compared to 2016. Literally the only idol groups that are digimons with the reform nowadays are BTS and BP lmaoo

    So in the last 3 years (since people are saying 4th gen started in 2018), they only had one hit? I mean it's not like 3rd gen groups didn't had hits during 2018-2020 so the 'general public aren't as enthusiastic about idol groups' is not a good excuse imo.


    Quote from thebadguy

    But 3rd gen started in 2012 so it took atleast 4 years to it become noticeable isnt it?


    I think 2012-2015 in girl groups were transition years which was still dominated by 2nd gen groups and transition groups like AOA, EXID and Crayon Pop. 2016 is the year where new groups TOTALLY replaced old groups.

    Quote from acadz

    I think 2012-2015 in girl groups were transition years which was still dominated by 2nd gen groups and transition groups like AOA, EXID and Crayon Pop. 2016 is the year where new groups TOTALLY replaced old groups.

    obviously it took 4-5 years for the 3rd gen groups to replace the 2nd gen groups, but it doesn't changes the fact that 3rd gen started in 2012 with debut of exo.

    3rd gen was an enormous reset with multiple 2nd gen groups disbanding or going into hiatus. The powerful 3rd gen groups are still going strong, so there is not a huge shift. Definetly not hte same situation. Also with the focus on global market, charting in Korea is less important.

    I already said it but my bet is that 4th gen groups won’t be totally mainstream in SK. They will have a couple of “national” hits here and there but that’s about it

    Quote from thebadguy

    obviously it took 4-5 years for the 3rd gen groups to replace the 2nd gen groups, but it doesn't changes the fact that 3rd gen started in 2012 with debut of exo.


    I don't have a problem if people consider transition groups like AOA, EXID and Crayon Pop (all debuted in 2012) 3rd gen groups. What I am confused is why people blatantly cutting off the 3rd gen timeline. Especially 2018 which was definitely a clear 3rd gen year with 3rd gen mega hits like BBoom2x, Starry Night, D4 and DTNA.


    If 4th gen really started in 2018 that means 3rd gen only ran from 2012-2017, which is relatively short considering how 3rd gen groups are still leading the pack even now. In comparison 2nd gen apparently started with TVXQ and ran for 9 years (2003-2011).


    Quote from motorp77

    3rd gen was an enormous reset with multiple 2nd gen groups disbanding or going into hiatus. The powerful 3rd gen groups are still going strong, so there is not a huge shift. Definetly not hte same situation. Also with the focus on global market, charting in Korea is less important.


    That's the question. If 3rd gen is still strong and there's no shift whatever, why a 4th gen have to start? And there are really not much distinction with these "4th gen" groups to the 3rd gen, it's not like they invent or reinvent something.

    Quote from acadz

    I don't have a problem if people consider transition groups like AOA, EXID and Crayon Pop (all debuted in 2012) 3rd gen groups. What I am confused is why people blatantly cutting off the 3rd gen timeline. Especially 2018 which was definitely a clear 3rd gen year with 3rd gen mega hits like BBoom2x, Starry Night, D4 and DTNA.


    If 4th gen really started in 2018 that means 3rd gen only ran from 2012-2017, which is relatively short considering how 3rd gen groups are still leading the pack even now. In comparison 2nd gen apparently started with TVXQ and ran for 9 years (2003-2011).

    it might happen just like it happened with 3rd gen,it started in 2012 but only after 4-5 years in 2016 the 3rd gen groups started to get big hits. Same could happen in 4th gen too, it started in 2018 but only after 4-5 years in 2022-2023 the 4th gen groups would start getting big hits.

  • AllKill VIP
    • Official Post

    Twice started in 2015 and BP in 2016 which means they still have a few years before their contracts are over. Companies just started to debut new girl groups Itzy debuted in 2019 and Aespa in 2020 and Soumu/BH GG will debut this year so its too early to tell but 3rd gen girls groups are slowing down. Mamamoo and RV's contract end this year so we'll see if they continue but I'd doubt they'd keep promoting at the same rate. So by 2022-2024 we'll slowly see 4th gen take over 3rd gen.


    There is 2 common ways to define the end and beginning of a new generation :


    1. The debut of groups that will define the generation (Itzy, Gidle, TXT, SKZ) and the end of previous groups (No one, everyone is still alive, at least in 2018/19).


    2. Music releases that define a generation (Growl for 3rd gen, TVXQ Hug for 2nd gen) preferably by a group that debuted during this generation. If this is not a requirement, DDD, BWL or Dynamite could be a great start for the gen. You could also say Dalla Dalla but the song doesn't have the impact nor legacy right now (could definetly build up a legacy with itzy in the future).


    I tend towards the 2nd criteria, as i think it is better to define a generation by their songs than their groups. I also think the situation and environment kpop is in is really important.


    In the past 2/3 years, kpop got a massive shift to the global market, with groups and songs trying more than ever to succeed internationally. Because of that, the overall landscape of Kpop changed dramatically and new groups basically forgot to chart in Korea. This massive turnaround is imo one of the biggest reason why we are definetly not in the same gen as in 2013.


    In 2013 and the debut/success of EXO, Kpop changed tremendously with new influx of fans who started to buy albums. Overall, kpop fans grew much faster than in the 2nd gen and with album sales keeping increasing, there were much more money to make in the Kpop industry. It's imo one of the big reason 3rd gen started around 2012/13, and the grow of the international market is imo the big reason why 2018/19/20 is the start of a new gen.

    I have always argued that people talking about the "4th generation" too early, some saying groups from 2018 is 4th generation when they clearly are not. I say we are now in between the 3th/4th generation of girlgroups, but the end of the 3rd generation matter mostly on how long Twice, BP and some of the other 3rd generation groups continues to dominate.

    Thanks! You’re asking good questions and their answers won’t make strong sense...

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