Previous me would also complain that Babymonster is similar to 2ne1 and Blackpink

Quote from SooYoung

that's not wrong actually

for the moment only SM and HYBE have prove to be able to do groups with different onept from each other and makee them successfull

how in your world are Nmixx, ITZY, and Stray Kids not successful?

Quote from bartkun

but ITZY starting combo Dalla Dalla - ICY - Wannabe

was amazing

something went wrong later on, or rather should I say that Not Shy wasn't "it"

Cake did pretty well this year and it is still charting

Quote from Dreamer95

Dude, it is okay to like things, I also liked M&M which everyone hated, but I am comparing chart wise not opinion wise. Icy was objectively not well received and Wannabe suffred as a result.

Besides Itzy's problem is complex, it is not even just the songs, it is also how they sing them. They are yelling the songs at you and it just gets tiring with every subsequent release.

With sneakers and cake it’s clear ITZY still has the ability to do well dude. They are a popular group they just need a consistent sound which they had but JYP didnt keep it up. But they can still release hits

Quote from Dreamer95

Mate, have you really fallen this far to literally defend Itzy of all? I mean, okay, Twice I get, I also shilled for them until very late. Like I was unhappy since CSM, but kept waiting and hoping.

But Itzy mate? While at it, why don't we just start praising JYP. Clearly you think Sneakers and Cake were good, bart thinks Icy was good, someone else, me actually, thinks Loco wasn't all bad. There is literally no problem then, right? JYP is doing, great, variety of people enjoying different Itzy songs, what could be a more perfect strategy?

No there is clearly a problem I literally have said there is a problem. I don’t think ITZY or Nmixx are being managed particularly well. I have literally told you my many criticism of JYP constantly. This is why I’m tired of all talk. There are legitimate criticisms of JYP and how it manages its group and the songs it’s giving its group and the lack of consistency. My point is sneakers and cake both did well on the charts that isn’t really arguable and Cake has had descent staying power. Again this isn’t saying problems don’t exist I never said that and have quite literally said many times the opposite.

However, I’m not going to say ITZY isn’t a success because that’s just dumb. Y’all act like one can’t have the same opinion here. JYP needs to improve their consistency and how they manage their groups but also ITZY does developed hits everynow and then. That literally goes with the complaint of consistency regarding their songs.

Literally the same problem exists for Nmixx they come out with Love me like this and then with their latest comeback which was bad.

Quote from Dreamer95

Dude, it is okay to like things, I also liked M&M which everyone hated, but I am comparing chart wise not opinion wise. Icy was objectively not well received and Wannabe suffred as a result.

Besides Itzy's problem is complex, it is not even just the songs, it is also how they sing them. They are yelling the songs at you and it just gets tiring with every subsequent release.

I don't think they are even can beat to Itzy, at least Itzy is a unique group since the beginning. They are a girl group famous for chanting choruses like hey ha hoo, yoo, bla bla which i liked. Itzy has also made more challenging performance dance-oriented groups a trend. There's no need to belittle the excellent Dalla Dalla, Icy, Wannabe triology that Itzy released in the first place just because they's past their peak. I still think they could come up their good momentum at least, they just need better song next CB. I have a feeling whatever the next CB does without Lia will be a success. Because the members will develop more and challeging them self more and we can see different sides of them. It's hard to find good songs. I think kpop fans can't understand this.

Quote from Dreamer95

I quote both of you together because it just comes to the same stuff. Sorry, I disagree. I disagree that there ever was something about Itzy that worked. Even with Dalla Dalla, I am a firm believer that singles cannot be judged only on their own, you also need to take account what came before and after. For example if you put a good song your next one will definitely get more hype and better debut, meanwhile when you put a bad song, the next song won't get the same attention. Kinda what happened when Twice released Alcohol Free, it was a good song and eventually crawled to top10, but previous songs damaged its performance.

So going back to Dalla Dalla, it is their first song, right? Naturally it is the JYP hype, Twice hype, new girl group since Twice hype. That's what helped it to debut so well. The very next song that came out after Itzy established themselves with Dalla Dalla, it underperforms. And it didn't just length out bad, it debuted pretty bad too. That's pretty unusual coming off a true hit song, because usually post hit songs do even better initially, only losing in longevity: Cheer Up>TT, Next Level>Savage and etc. So this tells me people definitely weren't head over heels about Dalla Dalla that they'd rush to check out new Itzy song. It didn't have very good longevity or impact. It was fine for a debut song and that's it.

The conclusion is Itzy don't even have a hit song. The one seemingly hit song was JYP/Twice boost and that's it. From there on it was flop after flop for them in Korea. I am sorry to say this, but this group never made it. And thanks to them Nmixx debuted with even less hype.

You're just Itzy anti. Itzy won rookie grand slam their debut year. Dalla dalla winning digital bonsang. Sure sure keep believe your own lie.

Quote from Dreamer95

I quote both of you together because it just comes to the same stuff. Sorry, I disagree. I disagree that there ever was something about Itzy that worked. Even with Dalla Dalla, I am a firm believer that singles cannot be judged only on their own, you also need to take account what came before and after. For example if you put a good song your next one will definitely get more hype and better debut, meanwhile when you put a bad song, the next song won't get the same attention. Kinda what happened when Twice released Alcohol Free, it was a good song and eventually crawled to top10, but previous songs damaged its performance.

So going back to Dalla Dalla, it is their first song, right? Naturally it is the JYP hype, Twice hype, new girl group since Twice hype. That's what helped it to debut so well. The very next song that came out after Itzy established themselves with Dalla Dalla, it underperforms. And it didn't just length out bad, it debuted pretty bad too. That's pretty unusual coming off a true hit song, because usually post hit songs do even better initially, only losing in longevity: Cheer Up>TT, Next Level>Savage and etc. So this tells me people definitely weren't head over heels about Dalla Dalla that they'd rush to check out new Itzy song. It didn't have very good longevity or impact. It was fine for a debut song and that's it.

The conclusion is Itzy don't even have a hit song. The one seemingly hit song was JYP/Twice boost and that's it. From there on it was flop after flop for them in Korea. I am sorry to say this, but this group never made it. And thanks to them Nmixx debuted with even less hype.

So even when ITZY does well you just give credit to someone else. Yes ITZY had hype by being from JYP that doesn’t guarantee DD success at debut that’s just dumb. Also I mentioned cake and Sneakers which got a lot of attention as well. You just don’t like ITZY so refuse to acknowledge they have had hit songs. This is your prerogative and I won’t change your mind nobody will. But it doesn’t change my criticism that ITZY is popular they just lack consistency due to JYP. That’s the correct take you are just an ITZY hater.

Quote from bartkun

I actually liked the first three songs because they've actually had "same color" for me

it's like when you look at STAYC and think about ASAP, RUN2U, Poppy

that you know, ahhh this is so STAYC like song

it was the same then for me, it was ITZY's vibe that I liked very much

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Agree wholeheartedly. Not shy was that song that out them out radar and Mafia totall killed their momentum

Too early for badass hip hop, "popular girl in the school" with good rap will suit them perfectly

I mean im glad it's YG style hiphop instead of something really bizarre and sounds like its not from yg, what do you expect from yg anyway? it's obvious this is the concept they're going from, they already said the debut is going to be hiphop and this is it.

Anyway all the girls did really well and idk if other big 4 groups can pull this concept off lol.