Why I think fan girls are the major contribution to market drying up for more mature girl groups

As an unnie fan, I think there's a lot of assumptions here.

But, ya know, to each their own lol.

Quote from Lulu_Key

Im generalizing based on what I see in kpop spaces

Im happy to hear how and why someone older than 25 can relate to a teenager

I don't think relating is the right word, but like I mentioned in the previous thread, I like Lily because she comes across as awkward. It reminds me of myself when I was younger, but I'm not projecting some kind of fantasy on her of her living my "ideal" teenage life.

I enjoyed my teenage years, and don't have many regrets in that regard. So, I think that's kind of a weird generalization. But like I said, to each their own.

Quote from Lulu_Key

Why I think fan girls are the major contribution to market drying up for more mature girl groups.

As long as I have been to kpop, fanboys attitude have not changed much. Always happy to check out the new groups, and trade off.

Its really the attitude of fan girls that has changed toward girl groups and hence dried the market for mature girl groups.

When I got to kpop in 2nd generation, fan girls liked girl groups they could look up to. People they saw as role models on how to be successful in their own age group and older. They saw the inspiration for their future in them.

Nowadays, fan girls look for girl groups that replace their past. They stan whoever presents the ideal version of their own young self or rather how they fantasize about their own teenage years in their shadows. They want someone to replace whatever past they had for them. Thats also why they seem to refer themselves as unnies of 4th gen ggs. The questions they ask these girls in fan signs always suggest that they have this expectation of idols to represent that ideal past.

I dont speculate about how morally correct this is, but I do think if someone's past is so painful that they feel the need of replacing it, their money will be better spend on therapy rather than kpop albums and fan signs.

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I do like the psychology behind this. While not all fans, I could see it happening to some of them.

Quote from Lulu_Key

Im generalizing based on what I see in kpop spaces

Im happy to hear how and why someone older than 25 can relate to a teenager

Well, to play Devil's Advocate, let's use anime/ manga as an example: A lot of protagonists/ popular characters in anime/ manga are teenagers, yet a lot of people, ranging from different ages, relate to these characters. In some ways, idols are playing character.

So their trials and tribulations through their music and everything documented in between can provide a source of relatability (don't try to correct me spellcheck!It's now a word! )

Agree. People always blame male fans for not sticking but here I am after 5 years with Twice.

I am not interested at all in the 4th gen other than their stats. I get more hyped when older groups announce a comeback, like Kara. The only 4th gen I almost got in was LSFM because of Sakura and Yunjin finally debuting, but the way a teenage girl was treated turned me off.

Groups like New Jeans are freaking babies. All the respect for those who choose to stan, but I just simply can't relate to them. It is not even just the appearance, they are babies on a human level and in a way they act. There is nothing relatable about them for someone like me.

Quote from Lulu_Key

Personally for me that depends

I will use Harry Potter as fictional characters.

I can relate to them bc I read the books as a child and sorta grow up with the series. Would I like it at all if I was exposed to it as an adult? I don't think so

Same logic with manga characters.

I can probably watch a high school movie but would never feel enough to dedicated to follow a show or a series with high school characters. My level commitment to it is much different.

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You're just not in touch with your inner child! Show more feeling!

Quote from Lulu_Key

Personally for me that depends

I will use Harry Potter as fictional characters.

I can relate to them bc I read the books as a child and sorta grow up with the series. Would I like it at all if I was exposed to it as an adult? I don't think so

Same logic with manga characters.

I can probably watch a high school movie but would never feel enough to dedicated to follow a show or a series with high school characters. My level commitment to it is much different.

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yikes noah fence but this is so ridiculous it's absurd to read lol yall taking the woke olympics to a whole new playground and looking for the highest moral high ground to stand on it's become a real spectacle and not in a good way. how do you people even navigate the world with this mindset? imagine shunning people from reading books about teenagers just because the characters are teenagers and therefore you must not enjoy reading about them otherwise you're a pedo? even when the books themselves deal with issues that are universal and anyone of any age can relate to them? what sort of dystopia is this? good god

Quote from Lulu_Key

Nah fuck feelings

That's not very fancy of you. You're suppose to be the Fanciest Lulu ever

as an old woman i dont really relate idc about what these groups do as long as their vocals are good and the songs are listeneable i don't listen to lyrics

Quote from Dreamer95

Agree. People always blame male fans for not sticking but here I am after 5 years with Twice.

I am not interested at all in the 4th gen other than their stats. I get more hyped when older groups announce a comeback, like Kara. The only 4th gen I almost got in was LSFM because of Sakura and Yunjin finally debuting, but the way a teenage girl was treated turned me off.

Groups like New Jeans are freaking babies. All the respect for those who choose to stan, but I just simply can't relate to them. It is not even just the appearance, they are babies on a human level and in a way they act. There is nothing relatable about them for someone like me.

I do agree with New Jeans.

I find their concept unrelatable to me, but I do like their songs.

I think they are the 1st 4th gen GG I have not been able to connect with.

Haven't had as much of an issue with groups like IVE, AESPA, LSFM, STAYC, or NMIXX. But, I think seeing NJ in their MVs and interacting with people their own age really illustrated and cemented to me that they are babies (to me at least). It was the 1st time I thought to myself I might be aging out of KPOP.

I want to be like my faves?

Let me think about that one.

Quote from whiplashed

yikes noah fence but this is so ridiculous it's absurd to read lol yall taking the woke olympics to a whole new playground and looking for the highest moral high ground to stand on it's become a real spectacle and not in a good way. how do you people even navigate the world with this mindset? imagine shunning people from reading books about teenagers just because the characters are teenagers and therefore you must not enjoy reading about them otherwise you're a pedo? even when the books themselves deal with issues that are universal and anyone of any age can relate to them? what sort of dystopia is this? good god

I highly doubt she meant that. I mean, when you step outside of it, how could, say, a 38 year old man relate to a 17 year old? But on the flip side, we were all once teengers (at least those of us in our 20s and beyond lol) and some of that shapes who we are now.

Idk if I agree 100%, but I defitely can see what you are saying.

We need more threads like this, about the industry

Quote from Lulu_Key

Ok let me put it this way

Between two forms of media, one that represents sth I dealt with in the past and one representing what I'm dealing with right now, I will always be more invested in the latter.

To me past is gone, a chapter closed. If I ever need help with processing sth in the past, I will seek professional therapy not teenage movies.

Eh, therapy is overrated. Take it from someone who went to 15 years of combined therapy. Yeah, outcomes may vary but sometimes you find the answers to life in the strangest things: Be it a song, paintings, a sunset or sunrise, or even in our own memories....

but what I really want to say is.... FIND YOUR INNER CHILD!!!

Quote from Lulu_Key

my op says I don't speculate on this as a moral issue

That comment is based on my perspective on every form of media, has nothing in it that's woke?

I lived my teenage years to the fullest and done with them. I don't feel anything special regarding problems of that time period.

Can it be entertaining? Sure

Do I think it's healthy to be so engaged and with teenage media at an older age? Nop

That just means someone hasn't grown up mentally with their age.

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ironically your whole tirades from the other thread to this one just kinda shows how immature your mindset is with the black and white view you have of the world lol because that's not how it works. there are many, many, many tv shows, films, books, manga/anime series whose main characters are teenagers, but the underlying themes and messages in them are distinctly relatable to every person of every age, and deliberately so, because their writers didn't write those products with only kids under the age of 12 in mind, they wrote them with the intention for people of every age to enjoy them. "enjoying" doesn't mean obsessing over the characters' age or youthfulness fyi, in case you still can't seem to grasp that distinction. people can be engaged to discuss about a books's plot, themes, prose, a film's visuals, effects, execution, and anything in between. that's still "engagement in teenage media" but it has nothing to do with the characters' age. so your morality complex about gatekeeping people from enjoying things and accusing them with generalisations that aren't even true because you don't comprehend how different people can be different ain't the win you think it is

and before you question me with naming books or shows to prove i know what i'm talking about, just off the top of my head pixar/disney are masters at weaving a lot of complex adult themes into kids/teenagers' films (find nemo, the lion king, inside out, etc), and those franchises still get thinkpieces written about them to this day, mostly from adults, so are you going to call them all pedos or "not having grown up with their age" for engaging in and relating to films about literal kids? like come on, surely you've got more critical thinking than that

Quote from Lulu_Key

Ok let me put it this way

Between two forms of media, one that represents sth I dealt with in the past and one representing what I'm dealing with right now, I will always be more invested in the latter.

To me past is gone, a chapter closed. If I ever need help with processing sth in the past, I will seek professional therapy not teenage movies.

I think the word processing is an interesting word. It's almost as if there is some kind of unresolved issue?

Rather than processing, what if someone just feels a sense of nostalgia? In this sense, I am referring specifically to music rather than television media.

Or maybe relating to a love song? In that sense, it's less about the person singing, but the content that is sung.

Or, are you referring to watching someone's variety contents and following them because they are relatable?

I think I'm getting your overall point though. From what I get, it seems you're saying that older fans who stan younger idols because they find them relatable (to what is happening in their current life) have not matured, which I can agree (if that's what you mean).

Or are you saying that older fans who stan younger idols because they like their personalities are also strange? I think you can like someone's personality without finding someone relatable though. Asking because I saw some people mention that in the previous thread. That I don't agree with, but I want clarification on what your main point is.

Quote from Lulu_Key

I never lost my inner child

I always pursued what I wanted and what made me happy. Inner child living and eating well.

Then why you make thread that is hard for some hoomans to read?

Quote from whiplashed

ironically your whole tirades from the other thread to this one just kinda shows how immature your mindset is with the black and white view you have of the world lol because that's not how it works. there are many, many, many tv shows, films, books, manga/anime series whose main characters are teenagers, but the underlying themes and messages in them are distinctly relatable to every person of every age, and deliberately so, because their writers didn't write those products with only kids under the age of 12 in mind, they wrote them with the intention for people of every age to enjoy them. "enjoying" doesn't mean obsessing over the characters' age or youthfulness fyi, in case you still can't seem to grasp that distinction. people can be engaged to discuss about a books's plot, themes, prose, a film's visuals, effects, execution, and anything in between. that's still "engagement in teenage media" but it has nothing to do with the characters' age. so your morality complex about gatekeeping people from enjoying things and accusing them with generalisations that aren't even true because you don't comprehend how different people can be different ain't the win you think it is

and before you question me with naming books or shows to prove i know what i'm talking about, just off the top of my head pixar/disney are masters at weaving a lot of complex adult themes into kids/teenagers' films (find nemo, the lion king, inside out, etc), and those franchises still get thinkpieces written about them to this day, mostly from adults, so are you going to call them all pedos or "not having grown up with their age" for engaging in and relating to films about literal kids? like come on, surely you've got more critical thinking than that

There are also shows like Euphoria and CW shows that usually take a high school setting and deliberately infuse them with adult themes in order to attract a wider range of audiences.

Quote from Lulu_Key

I'm making too much good sense in real life

I need to word vomit somewhere else

When did you get so cocky?! Lulu used to be one of the purest souls on AKP

Remember your veteran leadership!

I don’t think consuming fictional content should be equated with real life. You don’t have to “relate” to a character in a book to like it. It’s actually dangerous to even imply it. You can read it because the story is interesting and the characters are interesting. Game of thrones has teens in it doesn’t mean the book is for teenagers. Similarly for many pieces of media. Why people read fiction including YA or Middle Grade or any thing really is wholly unrelated to people following and relating and obsessing over real life teenagers.

One argument brought up that I do sort of see the merit is by cherry-boy that people view idols as fictional far away beings and hence similar to books or anime. Like it’s just a story about people and your favs are the protagonists so you’re rooting for them.

If it helps you cope good for you I suppose.

Quote from Lulu_Key

you are combining my discussion from two entirely different topic together

I didn't say people who like teenage movies are pedos.

I said people who try to replace their own sad past with teenage media, need therapy.

If you can't see how they are different then idk what tell ya

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if you think any adult who enjoys such films/books is "trying to replace their own sad past with teenage media and need therapy" then I'm the one who doesn't know what to tell ya lol this is hilarious 😂

there are so many good books and films and manga/anime series out there that touch on universal social matters like family, friendship, loyalty, etc. and explore the characters' bravery, self confidence, interpersonal skills, etc., from multiple facets and points of view, and sometimes the plots are just very well written and entertaining and interesting regardless of the characters' age, but apparently people who enjoy them must all register to the nearest therapist because the characters are teenagers 😂

the funny thing is the people who write/produce those products are all adults themselves, which automatically means they must understand or relate to their characters at least to some degree, so does this mean all writers need therapy because they're sad sacks of shit who haven't yet grown up with their age? 🤔 oh wow learnt sth new today

Quote from Lulu_Key

I said people who try to replace their own sad past with teenage media, need therapy.

If y

But why would you make this statement lol. There are a number of reasons to enjoy teenage media other than “relating” to it. I think you’re confusing many things.

Settings like school or college or premises like those make it easier to tell some kinds of stories. “Relating” is I would say the last reason someone consumes fictional content. In fact if you need to “relate” to media to consume I worry about you Lulu. It will offer you no way to grow. And also implies a lack of media literacy. So I hope that’s not what you’re trying to say.

Quote from Lulu_Key

a mix bag of both

First part is correct, if someone finds much younger idols relatable, they have not matured.

Second part, it still depends on how much is that person invested. Liking to some bits, finding them entertaining yeah I could see.

But like really liking them to the point for stanning? Idk

For me there is this wall. Like I watched a video of Eunchae that bartkun posted. Do I think she is a cute kid? Sure

Did I felt like I want to know more about her? No

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Quote from Lulu_Key

Those shows are highly criticized

they are not examples to prove my point wrong

Interesting.

I think stanning can also mean different things to different people. I don't consume the media and follow every single thing for the groups I stan or my biases, but I still consider myself a stan.

But, I think I get your overall message.

I don't think women are necessarily to blame for the lack of mature concepts though. At least not for the reasons you mentioned. Women are the main consumers of KPOP, true, so they dictate the overall trends. I think the oversaturation of new groups and the boom of KPOP has more to do with it than some psychological motive however.

And on the second quote, I wasn't really trying to prove your point wrong since I don't really remember what your point was in relation to that person I quoted. I was just adding an example to their point about media featuring teenagers including themes that can target a wide range of demographics.

Quote from Lulu_Key

The premise of my thread is fangirls who are replacing their old past with the images that idols sell.

My replies are in concern of that premise.

Why is it hard to follow?

who said it was hard to follow? you're the one who brought up things to support your argument and i was addressing those particular things, so nothing i said was out of the blue or not brought up first in this thread so idg your attempt at deflecting here

Quote from whiplashed

if you think any adult who enjoys such films/books is "trying to replace their own sad past with teenage media and need therapy" then I'm the one who doesn't know what to tell ya lol this is hilarious 😂

there are so many good books and films and manga/anime series out there that touch on universal social matters like family, friendship, loyalty, etc. and explore the characters' bravery, self confidence, interpersonal skills, etc., from multiple facets and points of view, and sometimes the plots are just very well written and entertaining and interesting regardless of the characters' age, but apparently people who enjoy them must all register to the nearest therapist because the characters are teenagers 😂

the funny thing is the people who write/produce those products are all adults themselves, which automatically means they must understand or relate to their characters at least to some degree, so does this mean all writers need therapy because they're sad sacks of shit who haven't yet grown up with their age? 🤔 oh wow learnt sth new today

I mean, have you watched some of these shows and movies recently? A lot of gutter trash, so it's safe to say that a lot of writers are trash and probably do need therapy......