Posts by riyakpopfan
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No worries, we all have a life outside of here after all. Huh. You do raise a good point. I don't know what most Pro-Life lawmaker's policy is when it comes to stuff like contraception and education and stuff like that. Personally, I'm in favor of it, but I'm also not a lawmaker, so there you go. After reading that, I think I understand your frustrations a bit better. I just didn't want you to have the wrong idea that every Pro-Life person holds those same beliefs and I'm very happy to see you don't seem to believe that, I just wanted to make sure.
I can yes. The moving and classism point is a very good one and I understand where you are coming with that completely. As for the racism point, I had never heard that before. That is super messed up. No wonder it can be seen that way. I'll be sure to check out that video when I have the time to, it sounds interesting. Thanks for the resources to check out, it means a lot to me and I do want to be informed on this issue.
That is true. I understand your point and I am very happy that is the case. That is true. I feel like the whole argument in general is such a slippery slope, and it requires being careful on the mountain. That is true, contraception can help in a lot of cases, but not all. There are "foolproof" ways to avoid having babies, but those can be seen as too controlling and not everyone is open to the idea of them (the ones that come to mind are abstinence and vasectomy) and I wouldn't want to force either one on people in such a pushy way.
That is a good point and I respect that. I can completely understand why being in a grey area in such a topic could be upsetting. That is true, some things are very black and white (like SA and murder for example) and there is no way around that. That is an interesting change. In the past, I always thought of black and white thinking as polarizing and leading to more intense debates and fights. I never considered that it might be necessary for change, but now that you mention it, I can fully understand why.
I also mean this with respect: I'm glad you're being realistic about this and speaking from what you have seen and your personal experiences. This conversation with you has gone much more pleasantly and better than I expected to be completely fair. Thank you for listening what I had to say and taking my stance into consideration when responding. It made me feel very respected and I liked that a lot. Have a great day/night!
I'm glad my response was able to provide some clarity :) I'm also glad this conversation went in a pleasant direction. Have a good day/night too!
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Nobody in this Thread that said that both sides got good points (including me) ignored that one side is trying to control others. That’s why they pro-choice and not pro-life.
But then on the other hand my knowledge of pro-lifers comes mostly from German debates. Here the main argument is that abortion is killing another human being and this goes against human rights, which pro-choicers see differently. Here pro- choice and pro-life at least are on one page that there should be better education and support for women and improvement in childcare. I have seen people in this Thread saying that this isn’t what they want, I guess pro-lifers in the US are more radical in their conservative views if this isn’t something they are advocating for too… if that is the case… I can understand the hostility some have towards them a bit better.
The issue is, the problem in the U.S. has escalated to the point where it's beyond moral debate. It's a control issue that is spreading to the legal level. As a situational example, say someone was the reason a massive car crash happened. And say the other party now needs an organ donation or blood transfusion to survive but there is a shortage and they can't find what they need. The moral opinion is variable, sure, but no matter where you stand morally on that issue the government cannot legally force you to donate your organ/blood to them. Even if your decision not to ultimately ends up with the person dying. Regardless of opinion on the morality of abortion, forcing women to host an organism inside of their body for 9+ months and then forcing them to give birth to it, in addition to dealing with the lifelong physical changes, the emotional toil, and the financial burden of pregnancy--that's not treating the woman's life with any respect. I've seen how pregnancy can absolutely wreak havoc on a person's body. Forcing someone to go through that for the sake of someone else's moral code is wrong.
Like you said, the hostility comes from the fact that the pro-life movement here does not support any other aspect of improving access to childcare, women's health, the child's wellbeing after birth etc. but only focuses on forcing women to give birth no matter the financial, emotional, or physical circumstances they might be in. Not to mention, in some states women can now be investigated and prosecuted for having a miscarriage. You can see why I don't feel so lenient towards the other side, at least not here.
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Maybe I'm too optimistic, but I don't see it that way. There are so many Pro-Life people that absolutely don't want to restrict these things. Not all of them think the same way on every single aspect of the topic.
No offense, but what do you think the literal definition of Libertarianism (in the US) is? And yes, it is 100% possible to be that way. Why wouldn't it be? Politics is a spectrum, not everyone is, has to be or even should be completely on one side or the other side.
I'm trying to understand how being Pro-Life is either racist or classist. Would you mind explaining it to me so I can understand it better, or linking me to some resources that do so?
Personally, I like playing devil's advocate sometimes (key word: sometimes). Nothing wrong with that. Not all issues are only black and white, and it gets people to consider the other side as well. Also, are you disagreeing that "there should be limitations" or "people should stop seeing it as contraceptives" , or just with the way those viewpoint are being argued and presented?
Again, like I said, not everything is black and white, we also have varying shades of grey on both sides. Morality in general is not black and white. I find the "there are good points on both sides" argument to be very understanding and mature, because that's the reality: there is. I should probably go, all this black and white thinking is tiring me out. Have a great day/night!
Hey sorry, I dipped for a bit and came back to so many responses. Even if not all of the pro-life people think that way, unfortunately the movement itself in the U.S. supports policy makers who absolutely do see that as an end goal to more power. Therefore, aligning with the pro-life movement is supporting these people who don't see women as actually humans but rather incubators for babies.
As for the classism and racism point, someone else here already explained a bit but starting in the 1900s there was a very real fear among white leadership in the U.S. that white people were not having babies enough while POC were increasing in proportion in the population. Therefore, white people would become a minority and the only way to prevent that is to stop abortions. Look up Jane Elliot's video on "The Birth Dearth" for a more detailed explanation. It's a very good starting point to understand how much of modern anti-abortion sentiments are born from racist ideology. Additionally, someone here mentioned that certain states would still have legal abortions. That plays into the classism point--the only people who could then afford legal abortion would be people with enough money to travel to get one. The rest of the women? They'd be forced to turn to very unsafe methods that could possibly kill them. Additionally, minorities generally have higher poverty rates. So I'm sure you can see where I'm going with that.
As for the point on limitations, I don't think it's anyone's business how many times someone seeks out abortions and for what reasons they do. I stand by my statement that the vast majority of women who seek out abortions do not make that decision lightly. Things happen, even the most thorough contraception cannot always prevent pregnancy. And unfortunately there exist many women who are in situations where they are sexually assaulted on a regular basis that they cannot escape. Putting a "cap" or "limitation" on this type of thing is a slippery slope.
Of course not everything is black and white. Shades of grey in issues are undoubtedly important and I'm not trying to refute that. However, when it comes to a group of people potentially losing the right to their bodily autonomy, there isn't a shade of grey that I can accept because that is fundamentally wrong. Everyone has a right to their body and their health. It is a basic human right. The same way I don't think there are shades of grey in discussion about whether racism/homophobia is wrong. I just don't think in the current climate, it is productive to be looking at things from the pro-life side when we already have to fight so hard just to be seen and respected as human beings. Sometimes black and white thinking is needed to bring about necessary change. That has been true throughout history.
And I mean this with respect, I'm glad you're an optimistic person. Unfortunately, I cannot be, not when I've lived as a minority woman in the U.S. not when I've seen how my friends have been panicked and crying the past few days over a decision that could change the way they're allowed to seek healthcare.
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Reading through parts this thread gave me a bit of a headache, I'm not going to lie. I think some people don't understand what pro-choice means--no one is telling you you HAVE to get an abortion. It is simply fighting for a person's choice to get one or not to get one. So if you're "pro-life for yourself, but pro-choice for others" then you're pro-choice. Don't align yourself with a movement that is actively working towards restricting women's bodily autonomy, right to healthcare, and choice not to undergo the physical/mental/emotional tolls of childbirth. Restricting abortion the way the pro-life movement would like to will also move towards restricting access to birth control, other forms of contraceptives, reproductive healthcare, and in some of these states even treatments for life-threatening conditions such as ectopic pregnancies.
It's giving the same energy as "I'm a Republican for the economy, but not for social issues." You're either with women fighting for bodily autonomy or you're against us.
Also, if you truly think you are "pro-life" please look into the racist and classist implications behind that movement. If you're ready to take on all of that as part of your "personal views" then, sure, you're pro-life. And the arguments that "there should be limitations" or "people should stop seeing it as contraceptives" is also wild to me because you're taking a few anecdotal pieces and running with it as a way to play devil's advocate. The vast majority of people who are seeking abortion are not just doing it for funsies. "There are good points on both sides" is also actively ignoring that one side is absolutely fighting to endanger the rights of the other.
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I think that's a general problem with teenagers though and also a societal fear of aging. There are teens out here calling people in their 20s and 30s "old" which is just not at all true. Young fans are generally immature (not a bad thing, they'll grow up some day) so don't put too much stock in what they say about things like this. They'll all get here someday. There was a point in time I also thought being in my 20s was far away and unimaginable yet here I am.
And, yes, like others mentioned here the narrower "target audience" of kpop is absolutely due to misogyny and people assuming that anything teenage girls are very interested in is "just a phase" or of lower quality than other more "acceptable" hobbies
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I think there's a general problem of people trying to age other people out of things. Why should anyone have to grow out of k-pop? There is nothing wrong with being older and liking k-pop. It's a music genre and it brings a lot of people joy, at any age, to be able to listen to it and partake in it. Not everyone above 18 who listens to kpop is creepy and trying to sexualize minors (that's more of a problem to take up with companies that force minors to debut and do questionable things. I personally think idols shouldn't debut under 18)
And even then, where do you draw the line for who is "too old"? I've been told I'm "too old" and "ancient" and I'm only 23 which is ridiculous. Just leave older people be.
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How do you play?: Casual (although I am looking into nuzlocking)
Favorite type: Ice/Psychic
Favorite Pokemon: Torchic's whole evolution line (my very first game was Emerald so Torchic, Combusken, and Blaziken will always have a special place in my heart <3)
Favorite game: Emerald and Platinum
First shiny: I don't remember
It might've been Ralts?Your choice of starter in gen 9: I wanna say Sprigatito but they're all so cute omg
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Bengali here!
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Ah yes, the company that severely sexualized her since she was a minor, never did anything about the unfair hate she received as a result, and eventually kicked her out for doing something completely normal and human is the better fit for her. She was sooooo happy there I'm sure 🙄
How YOU or other "fans" prefer her to look or act is none of her business. She's an artist and under PNation she's doing what she wants under her terms (as far as we know ofc) and she and Dawn both look happier for it. Let's not normalize the same behaviors the "fans" who got her kicked out of Cube in the first place were displaying please
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Y'all sleeping on Lady Luck I swear
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This song is criminally underrated:
External Content www.youtube.comContent embedded from external sources will not be displayed without your consent.Through the activation of external content, you agree that personal data may be transferred to third party platforms. We have provided more information on this in our privacy policy.And Luna, in general, is criminally underrated but this song in particular deserves so much more attention:
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