Top 3rd Gen groups: My opinion about how iFans viewed them when I joined kpop vs how they are seen now

  • disclaimer: Those are NOT facts, those are my OPINIONS and impressions based in what I used to see and read on internet. So it's a 100% biased thread


    My intention is not to hate or shade any group, please I just want to share my impressions being on kpop for so long and show the differences in the treatment of groups I have been following for a long time


    The thread is a bit long. If you want to see my opinion about another group please comment


    So let's start :dancer-pepe:




    BTS

    How it was: BTS was far and away the most hated group. The amount of animosity they used to get was something I had never seen for any group with their level of popularity. Generally speaking, most of the group hate starts when the group is either approaching the top or at the top, but BTS seemed to evoke an amount of hate even when they were significantly less popular than EXO.

    How it is: I'd say the attitude towards them has warmed a lot with time, even if they are still very far from being a "loved" group by 3rd gen stans. They seem to be quite liked (or at least respected) by 4th gen stans. They still have their haters, but overall, I no longer see a collective hate train against them to the same degree they used to have. If anything, I see more hate towards them coming from non-Kpop fans as they sometimes clash with Western singers on charts and awards.



    Blackpink

    How it was: Blackpink was the token group for 9 out of 10 new non-Army Kpop fans in 2016 and 2017. Many people called them a weaker version of 2NE1, as well as a long list of posts dooming and glooming their future because of YG. But overall, they were a liked group.

    How it is: Blackpink is now a hated group, or at least a group Kpop fans (mostly 3rd gen stans) actively dislike. I believe they are a group the Kpop community gets tired of after some time and are now liked basically only by their fans (inside the Kpop bubble) and some 4th gen stans who discovered Kpop after 3rd gen was already over. The saving grace for Blackpink is that they don't need the Kpop community. They are pretty well-liked by casual music listeners, especially in East and Southeast Asia, where their status is god-like.



    Twice

    How it was: Twice was a DESPISED group. I'm using the word "despised" instead of "hated" because I feel it better describes the attitudes iFans had towards them. I believe Twice's popularity made iFans realize Koreans liked cute concepts, and it didn't sit well with iFans to see what they considered an inferior version of Girls' Generation smashing Korean charts with songs like "Cheer Up" and "TT". Twice suffered systematic hate campaigns. I remember people mass-disliking their YouTube videos and trending edited MR removed videos to expose how bad singers they were. I still think to this day that Twice suffers from the insane amount of hate directed towards them.

    How it is: Considering how disliked the group was, they fared pretty well with time, to be honest. Twice is a really well-liked group now on iFans' side, with many casual listeners. Overall, they are one of the most liked 3rd gen GG. I'd say they are like Girls' Generation and have aged like wine with time.



    EXO

    How it was: To this date, I still find EXO the most liked "top group" in Kpop (debatable since NewJeans' debut). They seemed to have many haters on the K-side, but not so many on the i-side. The fandoms that actively hated EXO were, for me, pretty clear: VIPs and Armys. The rest either liked or simply didn't care for them.

    How it is: 4th gen stans don't give a damn about EXO. Their catalog and recognition mostly come from 3rd gen stans who are still active. Overall, I'd say their songs have aged well, being more pop and R&B-ish and still receiving praise, especially for not resembling current BG music. And of course, their vocals are always subject to praise.



    Red Velvet

    How it was: Those who liked RV always stated they were the best thing in Kpop at the time. Overall, I'd say they were a well-liked group, with most of their hate being one-sided. Their music could be controversial, especially because iFans were never that fond of their Red side, preferring their Velvet side.

    How it is: They are still mostly regarded as a group with a very good discography and talented singers. They lack the same level of hype they used to have, but overall, it's hard to deny they have a very respected and well-liked discography.



    NCT

    How it was: NCT was a victim of strong bullying from all sides. They used to be called flops, and I believe till this day NCT is the precursor and the true synonym of "Boygroups only release noisy shit". Nevertheless, people used to dislike NCT as a concept of a group too, being separated into multiple units. This concept was always subject to scrutiny with Kpop fans, as the concept was too confusing and there were too many members.

    How it is: To be honest, nothing has really changed. NCT is still very ignored, and people only bother to talk about them when it's time to criticize their songs. People stopped calling them flops, but they are still not liked, even by 4th gen stans.



    Mamamoo

    How it was: Mamamoo was a very ignored group on i-fans' side. There isn't much to say because they were very far behind. Back in the day, it seemed like there were only three girl groups i-fans cared about, and the others were all boy groups (the opposite of today). Nevertheless, just like Red Velvet, people who were fond of Mamamoo were very vocal about their talent and music quality.

    How it is: Having found significant success overseas only very late in their careers, Mamamoo is a group that most people feel ended "too soon". It's similar to what would happen if (G)I-DLE disbanded tomorrow after "Tomboy", "Nxde", and "Queencard". Overall, they are respected but less remembered.



    Seventeen

    How it was: Just like Mamamoo, Seventeen was a group that only their core audience cared about, but they were overall very well-liked. They used to trend regularly and receive praise for their strong and detailed choreography and perfectly in-sync dancing. They seemed like a very promising group that was going to hit it big, or at least that's what everybody thought at the time.

    How it is: Their core audience has increased, and that's about it. They don't even seem like a top group anymore. I'd say they are neither hated nor liked; they are just there. It's a strange situation where they have definitely grown and never flopped, but even with all the promise, they failed to have a mainstream breakthrough moment. The attention seems to have shifted towards newer 4th gen groups (TxT, Stray Kids, Enhypen), which diverted some of the audience that otherwise might have gone to Seventeen.

  • TLDR version:


    BTS

    Was: Extremely Hated

    Is: Somewhat hated, somewhat respected. Hate coming from non kpop fans


    Blackpink

    Was: Liked, a token group

    Is: Disliked by 3rd gen fans, somewhat liked by 4th gen stans


    EXO

    Was: Relatively well Liked, specially for a top group

    Is: Ignored, but praised by 3rd gen stans


    Twice

    Was: Extremely hated

    Is: Pretty well liked I'd say


    Red Velvet

    Was: Controversial, but very liked

    Is: Still liked, but less hyped


    NCT

    Was: Mocked all the time

    Is: Still hated, but at least free of "flop group" tag


    Mamamoo

    Was: Have a limited but passionate audience

    Is: Mildly liked, significantly less than other 3rd gen GGs



    Seventeen

    Was: Restricted to their core audience but praised

    Is: Not subject of criticism, but vastly ignored for a top group. In many ways they are still restricted to their core audience

  • I'm not sure what to say, since you made it clear these are just your impressions, so I'll just sit here and be salty because you didn't say only nice things about my favs ;judgingpepe:

  • I'm not sure what to say, since you made it clear these are just your impressions, so I'll just sit here and be salty because you didn't say only nice things about my favs ;judgingpepe:

    lmao


    But in my defense, I was one for the few Mamamoo defenders. They sill are my second more listened girlgroup ever, behind only Red Velvet


    What is depressing is I made the inverse path of the average kpop fan and started to lose interest around Hip era. I was a big fan of their early R&B sound and even liked a bit their 2018 music mainly because the seasonal concept was pretty cool

  • BTS

    How it is: I see more hate towards them coming from non-Kpop fans as they sometimes clash with Western singers on charts and awards.


    Blackpink

    How it is: They are pretty well-liked by casual music listeners, especially in East and Southeast Asia, where their status is god-like.

    interesting, do you think is that why the bp v bts "fanwar" is so severe at social media and lasts practically years since pandemic? or they just simply placeholders for male vs female stars "fanwar" in hollywood post disney popstars?


    because for me it's not fueled by fans but by non-fans who use the other group for thinly veiled racist insults (like the hate for bp is misogyny, hate for bts is mostly emasculated image, both comes from very narrow stereotype of asian people's gender image and celebrity)


    and for twice, i'm still very iffy with that pianist reactor on youtube who said twice is made only for male gaze concepts and refuse to listen to them. basically slut-shaming twice, which is also the theme for tumblr-raised "im not like the other girlie girl" a-holes. for me the unapologetically fun and girly concept of them is what people need as alternative of girl boss pop divas in the west. being cute is not a sin, people

  • interesting, do you think is that why the bp v bts "fanwar" is so severe at social media and lasts practically years since pandemic? or they just simply placeholders for male vs female stars "fanwar" in hollywood post disney popstars?


    because for me it's not fueled by fans but by non-fans who use the other group for thinly veiled racist insults (like the hate for bp is misogyny, hate for bts is mostly emasculated image, both comes from very narrow stereotype of asian people's gender image and celebrity)

    I'd say the hate both groups get cannot be directly blamed to the opposite fandoms, as both get a lot of hate from people who are not kpop fans but talking specifically about the feud and animosity between fandoms I don't think this can directly associated to non kpop fans weaponizing one of the groups to hate towards the other (it happens, but not to a high degree)


    I do believe armys and Blinks are still to be blamed for the endless fanwars on the internet between both groups


    Generally speaking, we people wants to Hate on BTS they don't need to use Blackpink as token. The opposite is also true. With BTS is specifically see many hate comments from American pop fans, and Blackpink is almost never subject that came up on those discussions.

  • OP can you do one for bigbang (2013-2018 pre Seungri)

    I wasn't active in 2013


    But during Made era until pre Seungri scandal Bigbang was a highly respected group and the token Boygroup of GG fans


    BG fans in other hand used to have a much colder response to them, they were seen as a very problematic group already but somehow the VIPs and GG stans created a very strong narrative of them being true artists and gaslighted people to believe their issues weren't that severe



    By 2016 most of their scandals were either ignored, or people blindingly sided with them because of... reasons




    In 2018 seems like kpop fans finally woken up and started to take BB issues seriously

  • Pre-seungri what major issues tho?


    The hit and run was ruled as unpreventable by the court since judge ruled there was no way Daesung could see him from where his car was.


    As for weed.....cultural differences I guess. Weed is harmless (compared to something that actually kills millions of people a year which is legal aka alcohol) and is also legal where I live so I don't see the issue at all with what GD or TOP did. But I can see how others would view it as a problem.

  • Pre-seungri what major issues tho?


    The hit and run was ruled as unpreventable by the court since judge ruled there was no way Daesung could see him from where his car was.


    As for weed.....cultural differences I guess. Weed is harmless (compared to something that actually kills millions of people a year which is legal aka alcohol) and is also legal where I live so I don't see the issue at all with what GD or TOP did. But I can see how others would view it as a problem.

    As some one who has been following kpop since 2012, lemme tell you, what's real has never stopped narratives.


    People to this day still bring up things like that. Even when they know it was eronious. It's not about what's true, it's about what you can use to sling mud.


    Most of what Icaro is saying is pretty spot on for the most part.

  • As some one who has been following kpop since 2012, lemme tell you, what's real has never stopped narratives.


    People to this day still bring up things like that. Even when they know it was eronious. It's not about what's true, it's about what you can use to sling mud.


    Most of what Icaro is saying is pretty spot on for the most part.

    This


    People didn't care whether the issues were particularly serious or problematic until it was time to take a side that Bigbang was a "bad group that shouldn't be supported"

  • agree wholeheartedly on Twice, it was weird seeing them in Korea where they were so incredibly huge and well-liked, and then I'd go on Youtube and everyone would just be hating on them so hard. Even on reddit everyone was constantly complaining about how their concept was always cute or even that they released "too much" music.

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