Posts by iolime
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I'm excited for Seventeen's comeback as well. I've saved up some money for the upcoming album, tho I might not be able to participate in streaming for many reasons. But I will try my best to set reminders regarding voting.
I've noticed that Carats have left or have been very inactive here, one by one, after the revamp. I think there's only less than 10 Carats here, overall. Understandable because of busy schedules, but it's also sad to think about it because of the consistent hate that Seventeen gets from the same users.
But hey, I'm just hoping that every Carat here are doing fine. Please be safe. Prioritize your mental and physical health. I'm serious. This pandemic is fvcking me up.
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Is this based on those groups' KR releases for this year? I'm a bit confused because you included SHINee who just had a comeback this year, but also included BTS even though they haven't made any comeback yet, or it could be because BTS' past releases are still charting hence why you included them, which is understandable. 'Cause if this is based on those groups' releases which have managed to enter the chart/s for this year, then I don't think Seventeen should be included there just like EXO because they haven't made any comeback yet. Unless they somehow managed to chart their old releases, which is unlikely 'cause they aren't a digital monster like BTS.
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Seems like you struggle to understand the word "NOW" which means nowadays
their past achivement is great but that's it
they are growing less fast than NCT if you compare their latest sales or that you calculate the average sales of their 4 latest cb
Now if you want to make also a fair comparison of their recent online concert, NCT appear 2 times in the top 10 best selling online concert
but Seveteen doesn't appear and their concert was very close to each other
if you want to calculate their popularity in US recently Neozone is the second BG with the longest album behind BTS albums on billboard
Nobody is denying the fact that Seventeen is a great group
but you are the one denying the fact that NCT is starting to do great in every metrics
and the past doesn't care, if we rank BG base on their past achievement then let's put Super junior and Shinee in the top 3 BG because they have more achievement than Seventeen and NCT
the top Kpop group ranking keep evolving base on the CURRENT performance of groups
not base on their past performance, and currently NCT seems to have better performance than seventeen
and using metrics to prove this point doesn't belittle or deny the success of Seventeen -_-
Goddamn, I already told myself that I won't be wasting my time in arguing with NCTzens like you here in this forum that kept on either being passive-aggressive or outright shady and petty towards Seventeen and their achievements. Alright, this will be my last reply to you.
If we were to go by your logic about your word 'nowadays' and since you included EXO in your thread, then does that mean NCT have also surpassed EXO now since NCT have sold more album sales with a single release, and how NCT have been doing better in the US Charts like BB200 compared to EXO? No. That's just outright dismissing EXO's past achievements.
Why do you think that even though both Seventeen and NCT have surpassed both SHINee and Super Junior in terms of album sales, those two 2nd gen bgs are still above them in terms of overall bg ranking? It's because of their past achievements during their time, those same achievements that did not go anywhere, wherein we have no reason at all to erase.
You're here outright making a conclusion for yourself and to a few of your fellow NCTzens here agreeing with you about this "Is it safe to say that NCT are Top 3 bg now?" when comparing NCT's current achievements to SVT's, while simultaneously dismissing both groups' past achievements, when 'overall including past achievements' is the valid way to compare and determine which group is actually doing better.
If you can bring up EXO in your thread about Top 3 bgs when they aren't even actively promoting as a group right now, which means you acknowledge their past achievements because they have no achievements right now as a group to compare to NCT, why you can't do the same thing towards Seventeen's past achievements while comparing them to NCT, when they're the ones who are actively promoting as a group? Absolutely ridiculous. You just made a fool out of yourself about that word of yours 'nowadays'.
You're not even a troll, yet this thread of yours makes you perceived as one. Therefore, don't be surprised if you see a few users/non-Carats here defending Seventeen and backing them up with stats.
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u know what, i tbh don't even care abt such stuff anymore, i just find it 'interesting' to read all these threads of ppl trying to justify why their faves are better than svt(yes ik that svt is not the point of this thread but the way ppl put them down are really 'interesting' lol) i'm not even here to argue bc its meaningless, this kind of threads appear like a monthly ritual or smt lol
on a side note, to the ppl here:
isn't it great that all our faves are having these records, doing well in their own aspect(digital, touring, sales, streams etc)???aren't y'all are very proud of them already??(i know for sure i'm very proud of svt) so why do some ppl have to feel insecure lol(not directing this to anyone specific), if you feel your fave is the best, then ok they are the best!!
every group and their fandom worked very hard, so why do we have to keep on comparing??even though you know it's gna bring them more hate and just to satisfy your 'fan ego??'...so what if your fave is top-xx, so what if they're not?? they're still earning all the money and recognition with all the aspects of kpop and together making kpop even more popular worldwide.
Seventeen was a triple million seller, their albums sold more and their songs charted better.
If NCT dreams achievements end up as impressive as they right now seem thatโs an argument in their favour but even if they sell 1.5 million Seventeenโs current best selling album isnโt far behind at 1.4 million and it wouldnโt be a reach to say they could also cross the 1.5 million milestone next comeback.
It's honestly no use in arguing with those same users that can't even acknowledge Seventeen's past and overall achievements. They will always dismiss Seventeen's achievements just so they can claim their repetitive narratives like OP's "Is it safe to say that NCT are Top 3 bg now?" everytime NCT makes a comeback. Let's just hope that we won't be seeing another shady and petty thread like this towards Seventeen once they have a comeback on June. Let's just quickly give our 2 cents about the topic, move on, and let them drown in delusion and embarrassment.
Since there are barely any active Carats here who have the energy to argue, I'm just glad and thankful that there are still a few non-Carats here who are ready to back up Seventeen with stats like their past/overall digital performance, touring numbers, etc.
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You can say whatever you want. You asked what people were talking about and the conversation shifted to Stray Kids vs NCT a long time ago.
I'm not asking what users here are currently talking about here tho? Where in my comments in this thread refer to that? You can just ignore my first comment if you want, I'm just giving out my 2 cents about the main topic of this thread, that's all. Users here in this thread can talk whatever they want, if the rules in this forum allowed that, I honestly don't care.
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So, am I not allowed now to give my 2 cents about the main topic of this thread? I thought the rules here in this forum is to stick to the main topic of the thread as much as possible to avoid unnecessary comments and the thread being closed/deleted? I'm just giving my 2 cents here since there are barely any active Carats here who have the energy to argue with a few NCTzens here who are very consistent in either downplaying or erasing SVT's achievements.
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Then what else are we talking about here if OP themselves brought up the topic about NCT now surpassing SVT and became the 3rd biggest bg after BTS and EXO? Because if it's not about their generation, then OP wouldn't have brought that up because there are bgs from 1st and 2nd gen who are above them, all the more reason that NCT is not the 3rd biggest bg.
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Goddamn. SVT be living rent free in your minds. You and a few of your fellow NCTzens here are still acting like SVT's past and overall achievements did not exist, at all. Those same achievements that NCT did not reach or haven't reached yet.
NCT as a whole surpassing SVT in overall album sales and now NCT Dream's one KR comeback doing better in charting immediately equates to all metrics combined for all of you to make a conclusion that they have surpassed SVT and became the overall 3rd biggest bg after BTS and EXO in their generation? Embarrassing.
The SVT downplay/erasure by a few NCTzens like you here in this forum is insane. Y'all are very consistent with this conclusion everytime NCT makes a comeback, while simultaneously SVT and Carats being both quiet in this forum.
Today's your fave's comeback, right? Then just focus on them and be happy for their achievements. SVT doesn't even have anything to do with them, yet all you can think about right now is indulge yourself in delusion.
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OP honestly needs to be reported and stopped with their unnecessary posts/threads like this, again. They are back at it again with their agenda of unnecessary SVT vs NCT and/or Carats vs NCTzens, and even adding EXO and EXO-Ls while doing so. They could have worded their post correctly for a healthy and civil discussion, but no. They just managed to piss off the fans, as well as bashed the groups, which is a very valid reason to report this nonsense of a thread. But at least some users here managed to be civil about it instead, not jumping in with OP and bashed the groups as well.
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Have it also ever crossed your mind that SVT did arena tours back in 2019 by selling out their North American tour? For example, Pledis didn't even signed up SVT with a JPN Label for better promotions and album distributions, not until this year, yet they still managed to reach 400k+ sales with their latest JPN release last year and sold out 8 JPN Dome Tour dates with an estimated overall capacity of 300k attendees.
What makes you think that they have no demand for a US Label? Their touring numbers back in 2019 in the US already speak for itself.
Have it also ever crossed your mind that Pledis might not have the same connections and money like SM, or Pledis is just acting quite greedy again by not signing them up to any Labels so that they can acquire more money for themselves from album sales, which can clearly be seen for the past 2 years with SVT in Japan?
If we were to go by your logic that because SVT doesn't have demand for a US Label, then why didn't SM signed up EXO with one when they can clearly sell pure US album sales and chart the BB 200 without having one? There is always something happening behind the scenes that we are not aware of.
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Seventeen is 13 if i am not mistaken, then divide by number of releases
If we based this on just KR releases last year, SEVENTEEN with 13 members sold two 1M albums with 2 KR releases. Can an NCTzen correct me if I'm wrong, NCT sold two 1M albums (Resonance pt. 1 & 2), 1M+ albums (Neo Zone w/ repackage), and two more releases from NCT Dream and WayV which I'm not aware of how much they have specifically sold, each.
I honestly don't know what we're trying to prove here, but the conclusion is that NCT sold 5M albums with 6 releases while SVT sold 2M+ albums with 2 releases last year.
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Didn't you read what I stated regarding US Charts? How is SVT going to sell and enter the chart if they don't even have a US Label like NCT to back them up for album distributions, which is very much needed for both groups since they don't have a big fanbase like BTS and BP in the US.
So, how are we going to compare who has, no doubt, have a bigger fanbase in the US? Based on NCT's charting on BB 200 and pure US album sales, and SVT's US touring numbers with bare minimum promotion? Which do you think is more important in determining that, touring numbers or album sales? We don't know, hence why NCT having a bigger fanbase, no doubt, in the US Market can't be proven.
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How are those achievements by SVT considered as an excuse? Those are statistics and facts, not an opinion to be called as an excuse. You can clearly see it, I am already stating them to you if you aren't aware of them since you're not a fan which is very understandable, but you just can't acknowledged it for some odd reason.
If you, yourself, already stated that it's not just by album sales alone, then what even made you came up with the conclusion that NCT is now above SVT? Is it because of the BB 200? Is it because of a small gap in YT views, excluding ads? Or is it because based on both groups' last releases, Make A Wish lasted for 3 days on Melon Daily Chart compared to HOME;RUN who didn't even lasted for a day? Haha, both groups' domestic digital performance are bad, but the Melon stats alone for both groups are there for you to see the overall comparison. Both groups' achievements did not disappear, you can now clearly see the comparison.
And yes, if you think that SVT is ahead of NCT in Japan, then you are absolutely right. Way ahead, especially based on their album sales and touring capability. Let me just repeat that if you're stating that NCT is doing the bare minimum in the JPN Market since they are just starting their focus this year, kindly see that SVT still haven't released their full potential as well. They are just starting, they just recently signed up with a JPN Label this year. They are no longer an Indie group in Japan, finally.
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NCT is already above Seventeen whether Kpop boomers want to acknowledge it or not, their highest selling album is above Seventeen, they can sell 5M in a year and now even subunits will be on equal grounds with SVT. They also have better streams worldwide, youtube likes/views and though both do terrible digitally domestically, NCT charted longer last time. Only thing where Seventeen is doing better is Japan sales but even there an NCT subunit can now sell 150K with a Japan release with bare minimum promotion (meanwhile some people are calling their fave group big in Japan with barely 100k) and no focus on this market, and NCT's numbers there are likely to progress as they enter a new phase and focus more on Japan with the new unit.
What are those K-Pop boomers going to acknowledge when based on overall domestic and international achievements, SVT is still bigger than NCT. You just straight up diminished all of SVT's achievements! Not everything is about album sales. Why do you think EXO is still bigger than SVT even though they surpassed them in having the best selling album back in 2019? Not just because EXO is far ahead of SVT, but because EXO's achievements did not go anywhere, meaning there are still a lot of achievements that SVT would need to reach in order to be on equal-footing or surpass them.
NCT surpassed SVT in album sales, but that's it! The domestic charting you're referring to is when Make A Wish stayed for 3 days on Melon Daily, while HOME;RUN didn't even lasted for a day? How is that much big of a difference for you to come up with the conclusion that NCT have already surpassed SVT in terms of overall domestic digital performance? You diminished the fact that SVT is the 5th boy group on Melon Chart alone. And they did that with less album releases than NCT.
https://twitter.com/kpopboyschโฆ/1364013833354768385?s=19
SVT doing the bare minimum in the US Market just sold out their North American tour. They were the third highest K-Pop group after TVXQ and BP announced last year who have sold more concert tickets outside Asia. Both SVT and NCT do not have a big fanbase in the US, we can clearly see that by the difference to what groups like BTS and BP have achieved in the US Market. Hence why do you realize that the reason why SVT can't enter the BB 200 like NCT 127 is because they aren't signed up with a US Label for album distributions, which is much needed if you don't have a big fanbase like BTS, BP, and EXO who have no problem in entering the charts without any US Label backing them up. SVT is reaching the same heights as NCT 127 in the US Market through their touring power while doing the bare minimum of promotion.
SVT in the JPN Market, ever since their JPN debut back in 2018, they were considered as an Indie group there because they aren't signed up with a JPN Label, they were only under Pledis Japan. SVT doesn't even have a much better album distribution like other groups, for example TXT, but they still managed to sell 400k+ for their 2nd Single. For an Indie group, they still managed to sold out their 8 Dome Tour dates, which was supposedly just 5 dates, but because of higher demand from fans, they added 3 more dates which also sold out at the end. SVT without even showcasing their full potential in the JPN Market because of the less opportunities given to them by their own company still managed to reach those achievements.
Domestic popularity? SVT being recognized and awarded last year by the SK Government with a Prime Minister's Commendation award joining big groups like EXO and SHINee already tells you that even if SVT and NCT are both unknown by the SK GP because of their digital performance, SVT is still more known for their input for their home county because of that honorable award given to them.
Spotify streams and YT views? SVT aren't far off in YT views compared to NCT, especially when Pledis only started giving them YT ads for promotion last year during Left and Right era and they don't even get that much ads compared to NCT. Very impressive for SVT for still racking up those big streams on Spotify when their core fandom is from East Asia, where Spotify isn't even widely used compared to the West.
Even with all those achievements by SVT, especially in touring capability, still haven't reached by NCT, yet you already came up with the conclusion that NCT is now bigger than SVT because of album sales alone? Why do you think those so-called 'K-Pop boomers' can't acknowledged that NCT is now above SVT? Kindly don't diminish SVT's achievements that they have reached for the past 6 years while being held down and not even showcasing their full potential because of their own company's lack of resources, money, and connections. Imagine the heights that SVT could reach more if only Pledis have given them much better opportunities, but they still managed to be the 3rd biggest boy group in their generation after BTS and EXO.
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I'm honestly still shocked about their US fanbase. A lot of us, Carats, never would have thought that they could actually sold out their North American tour.
They aren't signed with a US label for album distributions to check first if they can at least enter at the very bottom of the Billboard 200 Chart, or even at least convert more casual listeners to fans by checking them out more through more promotions such as US TV debut, interviews, music festival appearances, etc, and see if they can confidently stick to their plan with the arena tour in 8 cities. Who would have thought that even with little promotion, they did it and even sold out!
We had no idea that they actually have that many fans in the US Market. It's as if Pledis was testing the waters first through their touring capability if they can actively/heavily promote SVT over there.
Even though it was just a sold out North American tour compared to top groups' big achievements, that achievement from SVT was still very impressive. Compared to a few of their non top group peers, as well as new generation groups, who have done more moves than them in that Market, they did surprisingly well.
All I can say is that US Carats are very quiet on socials like Twitter and YT, as well as English forums, but they are surprisingly very active in attending concerts. Haha, US Carats are silent but deadly like a fart.
SVT alone in Japan doing extremely well even with being labeled as an Indie group over there since 2018 because they aren't signed with a JPN Label for much better opportunities, especially in album distributions and promotions. But everything is much better now 'cause they just recently signed up this year with a JPN Label, finally! They are just starting to release their full potential in the JPN Market.
At this point wherein they are still outdoing themselves, as well as surprising us along the way, we should never underestimate their capability even with less opportunities given to them by their own company.
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EBS?
Who the hell use this Nickname?
The gap between an new debuted group and seventeen is much smaller than the gap between BTS and seventeen.
Stop the cap.
Seventeen are not flops but also not a top group. Even tho there are only a few top groups out there. It's basically BTS alone and then the 2 top girl groups Twice and BP.
Most non fans don't even know the last title track from Seventeen. I ain't gonna lie, that's not even seventeen fault its just the whole kpop industry are oversatured and is basically a 1 Men show with BTS.
Display MoreBeside that all what I wrote.
Seventeen don't have only digital sales, which is an indicator the Gp.
Seventeen also don't have any hit songs in Korea.
Less YouTube views( tbh beside BTS and Bp and all Hype artists where the views are real without adds)
Compared with the top groups there to many lacking areas.
Just like nct, Mamamoo, izone and Red velvet.
Yes, SVT is not close to EXO's level, especially to BTS', but they are the only 3rd Gen boy group who are behind them based on their achievements from huge physicals and touring sales. Hence why I think that's where the term 'EBS' came from, mainly known within K-Pop fans in SK, and even from Idols and Variety Shows.
But I mean, you're not wrong either tho. Current top groups which are BTS, EXO, BP and Twice both have a huge fandom and gp recognition, and SVT lacks gp recognition based on their digitals. Hence why most non fans, as well as some Carats, don't consider them as a top group, which is understandable.
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