This video made me realise how much media in general panders to the male gaze(Rant)

Meh. From what I've seen, female fans objectify their idols just as much as male fans do. Maybe female fans don't needs butt shots and such to ignite their engine but still, it's one and the same.

Plus, the sexy concepts for gg's have mostly vanished so I think this rant is kinda late to the party.

I agree mostly. But when an idol is forced to do a concept or wear an outfit she doesn't want to, the blame's on their company, not the fans. The fans cannot know every shenanigan that's happening behind the scenes. I appreciate watching a pretty lady as much as the nexy guy; still, I'm not gonna condone the use of coercion to make idols do sexy stuff if they don't want to.

Now for sure there are some weird male fans who gonna fetishize the idols' bodies, quench their thirst on shady subreddits or websites, etc. What can you do though? These guys exist, the best thing is to ignore them. As long as they don't cross the line of course.

Being sexy of itself was never the problem. Appealing to fans is also not the problem.

The problem has always been this : the heads of these companies and managers and people in charge of these women are all MEN in power so it feels more predatory.

In terms of BGs they’re also controlled by other men so the power difference and predatory nature is viewed differently.

People keep saying fans but fans are not the ones close to the idols. It’s the people in power around them who can take advantage of them and they’re all (usually) men.

Was't there a girl group that was forced to do sexy concepts against their will? Like, the company was a horrible. Something with a s.

Quote from bumble-bunny

Was't there a girl group that was forced to do sexy concepts against their will? Like, the company was a horrible. Something with a s.

it was stellar!

Wbk! I just watched a video about a guy saying why he hates a female gamer youtuber, it has like 3m views. One of the main reasons was just because she's pretty. It made me so uncomfortable when he said she would turn around just so the viewers could see her ass, wtf. It's like they think women only make movements so they can be seen as desirable for men. If they sexualize us when we're just being ourselves, it doesn't surprise me one bit that media feeds into that.

But it's ok to be sexy as long it's because the idols themselves want to. There's multiple ways to shine and sell.

Quote from Serendipity2000

Never said there was anything wrong about a woman wanting to be confident in her sexuality or about fans forcing idols to do stuff. It's about the industry and what kind of content companies put out at the cost of their idols mental health and their bodily autonomy being disregarded for more views or cash grabs....

That’s what I said haha?

sex sells right?

Guy groups have to do sexy things too and I hate to say it but boy groups are probably more sexualized by fans than ggs

Quote from Tic_tac_toe

Being sexy of itself was never the problem. Appealing to fans is also not the problem.

The problem has always been this : the heads of these companies and managers and people in charge of these women are all MEN in power so it feels more predatory.

In terms of BGs they’re also controlled by other men so the power difference and predatory nature is viewed differently.

People keep saying fans but fans are not the ones close to the idols. It’s the people in power around them who can take advantage of them and they’re all (usually) men.

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Yeah a recent TW trend caught my eye, it was about the abuse suffered by 1D under either their management or label or both. There was a quote about a BG member that was thrown against the wall and told to STFU and do what they were told. I think BG members get physically abused with managers hitting/striking them, while GG get the sexual stuff thrown at them from slimy execs.

Quote from BlackpinkHouse

Yeah a recent TW trend caught my eye, it was about the abuse suffered by 1D under either their management or label or both. There was a quote about a BG member that was thrown against the wall and told to STFU and do what they were told. I think BG members get physically abused with managers hitting/striking them, while GG get the sexual stuff thrown at them from slimy execs.

29DFC148-1DD0-408E-A92A-4F8E02104845.gif

Wasnt SHINEee Jonghyun rubbing himself on Taemin at a concert?

Yep, it low-key pisses me off when fans call "female empowerment" songs and concepts that are created by men in power and given to girl idols with little to no creative control. Like, I'm sorry but you've got to be beyond naive to think those middle aged male CEOs, managers, producers etc have feminism and female empowerment in mind while deciding how their girl groups should dress, dance and what they should sing about. Unless the idols have assertiveness and a say on their own concept and music then it most definitely isn't female empowerment.

Quote from chounim

Yep, it low-key pisses me off when fans call "female empowerment" songs and concepts that are created by men in power and given to girl idols with little to no creative control. Like, I'm sorry but you've got to be beyond naive to think those middle aged male CEOs, managers, producers etc have feminism and female empowerment in mind while deciding how their girl groups should dress, dance and what they should sing about. Unless the idols have assertiveness and a say on their own concept and music then it most definitely isn't female empowerment.

I agree. This video gives a good explanation of why girl crush isn't female empowerment. It pretty much hits in your points.

Quote from workingclass

I agree. This video gives a good explanation of why girl crush isn't female empowerment. It pretty much hits in your points.

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I'm going to watch this video later but I want to say that the biggest sign of how fake this supposedly feminist concept is, is the contrast between the stage persona/image of these female idols and their off stage persona. Some of the same girls who act fierce and bold and tomboyish on stage are suddenly all shy and reserved and girly in interviews and talk shows, and this aspect bothers me a lot. First of all, it's not empowerment if you're openly and unapologetically faking it (CL for example has openly talked about how her real personality was nothing like her stage image and that she was in fact shy in real life), calling openly fake concepts "female empowerment" is insulting, that's like wearing a vampire makeup and a black Cape for a Halloween party. It doesn't make you a vampire.

Second, what's wrong with being shy, feminine, girly, reserved etc? Why should those qualities be masked to give a sense of power? Why can't a woman be powerful and independent with those qualities? Limiting empowerment to one set of rules is very limiting, hollow and counterproductive.

Not even gonna talk about how convenient it's that this female empowerment imagery coincides strongly with imageries that have been historically pandering to the male gaze.