Chartmasters' drags IFPI for inaccurate numbers and terrible methodology

I heard they just use the numbers that are reported to them. The principle of least work.

I believe that IFPI sales are reported by international distributors, so there are no other Korean artists even though they sell more

So the Chinese sales were not counted for The Album

what does 'international releases' mean?

what is it for?

the last column

No the numbers were accurate.. they just significantly weighed down Chinese sales.

Quote from wendii

No the numbers were accurate.. they just significantly weighed down Chinese sales.

Its likely Chinese sales were weighed down cause they are cheaper than most singles (we pretty much know they are by IFPI cause Xiao only ended up #7 on the singles chart) and JPN sales weighed up cause they are more expensive than most singles.

This article is a bit on the side of using the data they have available to them (which is pretty much what many of us have access to. They don't actually know what methods IFPI used.

Also the part about BTSs 3 different methodologies that they stated in the article doesn't make sense to me. How exactly does chart masters know that? As everyone knows that to be on the IFPI chart, data has to be sent from labels right? That's a problem I admit IFPI has and is a reason acts like SVT were left out. But as stated... the data is sent from labels right... so why would BH for example send BTS's numbers for their 3 albums in 3 different methods or ways.. like why would they include certain sales for one album and not the other, why would BH willingly do that? So that's why I'm a bit confused by what chartmasters is trying to say there. Chartmasters themselves don't know IFPI's actual method but yet critic it.. its mainly speculation on their part on what is counted for each artist and in my eyes... you can see that IFPI does weigh Chinese sales (main example is Xiao Zhan on the singles chart).

Basically... I just find a bit of the statements in their article odd and a lot of speculation about the numbers presented and where they came from. chartmasters themselves also have only a certain amount of data available to them.

This is stupid. Chinese sales were counted, properly weighted (around 1/4th of unit). Assuming they counted Hanteo numbers + actual sales in other countries + digital downloads + weighted Chinese sales, it makes sense.

Chartmasters also claimed that IFPI divides mini albums sales by half last year and they were proven wrong. They have lost credibility in commenting on it.

Anyway, no matter which methodology you use, BTS ends up on top. Pretty telling.

It was really weird how they didn't add NCT or seventeen on the list

Theyre cancelled

Not that I had even ever heard of them before armies were out there bringing them up all week

Quote from yutazenn

It was really weird how they didn't add NCT or seventeen on the list

Theyre cancelled

Not that I had even ever heard of them before armies were out there bringing them up all week

NCT shouldnt be there based on Hanteo numbers. And we know from last year they use Hanteo numbers.

This makes no sense to me. It’s obvious Chinese sales were counted with how xiao Zhan made the list but obviously the numbers were down weighted as they should be and that makes sense

Quote from quark12395

They sold more than Blackpink based on Hanteo numbers so obviously their number would higher were the additional totals added to their numbers as well.

BP had also digital sales globally + physicals sales in non-Hanteo stores + weighted Chinese digitals.

NCT doesnt sell anything digitally.

Quote from myaza

NCT shouldnt be there based on Hanteo numbers. And we know from last year they use Hanteo numbers.

Idk where u getting that info

Maybe it's just your opinion like the time u called SM pathetic for something they didn't even do so sorry for not trusting Ur words at face value

Quote from yutazenn

Idk where u getting that info

Maybe it's just your opinion like the time u called SM pathetic for something they didn't even do so sorry for not trusting Ur words at face value

You really want to go there? Obviously it was SM mediaplay. Thats how media works.

Hanteo 2020:

BTS’ “Map of the Soul: 7” – 3,839,242 copies sold

BTS’ “BE (Deluxe Edition)” – 2,343,709

Seventeen’s “Heng:garae” – 1,146,465

Seventeen’s “Semicolon” – 974,335

EXO’s Baekhyun’s “Delight” – 926,624

NCT’s “NCT 2020-Resonance, Pt. 1” – 889,810

BLACKPINK”s “The Album” – 758,534

BTS’ “Skool Luv Affair” – 588,799

NCT Dream’s “Reload” – 564,426

NCT’s “NCT 2020-Resonance, Pt. 2” (10th), 562,289

NCT clearly sold below 1 million, which was cutoff for the chart. The only questionable thing is Seventeen not being on the list.

Quote from myaza

This is stupid. Chinese sales were counted, properly weighted (around 1/4th of unit). Assuming they counted Hanteo numbers + actual sales in other countries + digital downloads + weighted Chinese sales, it makes sense.

Chartmasters also claimed that IFPI divides mini albums sales by half last year and they were proven wrong. They have lost credibility in commenting on it.

Anyway, no matter which methodology you use, BTS ends up on top. Pretty telling.

THis part is true. Chartmasters SPECULATED that Persona's sales weren't counted in full cause of it being an EP but Kpop Herald revealed it was likely cause BH only submitted hanteo sales.

"Confusion led to a few scenarios including one in which “Map of the Soul: Persona” was considered an EP and its sales might have been slashed by half, which the IFPI says is not true.



“Only album downloads and physical album sales were used in the bestselling albums chart,” said Linzi Goldthorpe, senior communications executive at the IFPI, in an emailed statement.



“For the purposes of the chart, albums are defined as being five tracks long or 25 minutes in running time.”



She added the rankings are “based on self-certified submissions” from their member record labels. For BTS, the sales figures were submitted by Big Hit Entertainment.



And asked about the huge discrepancy, Big Hit confirmed that data from Hanteo Chart, which is based on the sales volume in South Korea, was submitted to the IFPI, leaving a large number of overseas sales of the EP uncounted.



“IFPI asked us for sales data and we submitted that of Hanteo Chart, which is based on the album sales at home,” a Big Hit public relations official told The Korea Herald.

It has statements from BOTH Bighit and IFPI.

So we can see how much speculation of chartmasters was really not accurate at all. So again the chartmasters article from today is much like what happened last year... they don't know IFPI's methodology

Quote from myaza

You really want to go there? Obviously it was SM mediaplay. Thats how media works.

Hanteo 2020:

BTS’ “Map of the Soul: 7” – 3,839,242 copies sold

BTS’ “BE (Deluxe Edition)” – 2,343,709

Seventeen’s “Heng:garae” – 1,146,465

Seventeen’s “Semicolon” – 974,335

EXO’s Baekhyun’s “Delight” – 926,624

NCT’s “NCT 2020-Resonance, Pt. 1” – 889,810

BLACKPINK”s “The Album” – 758,534

BTS’ “Skool Luv Affair” – 588,799

NCT Dream’s “Reload” – 564,426

NCT’s “NCT 2020-Resonance, Pt. 2” (10th), 562,289

NCT clearly sold below 1 million, which was cutoff for the chart. The only questionable thing is Seventeen not being on the list.

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Oh does the hanteo list prove Ur narrative? Good for u

It doesn't actually clarify how the ipfi reached their numbers

Quote from worldlove27

THis part is true. Chartmasters SPECULATED that Persona's sales weren't counted in full cause of it being an EP but Kpop Herald revealed it was likely cause BH only submitted hanteo sales.

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In this article it states

"Confusion led to a few scenarios including one in which “Map of the Soul: Persona” was considered an EP and its sales might have been slashed by half, which the IFPI says is not true.



“Only album downloads and physical album sales were used in the bestselling albums chart,” said Linzi Goldthorpe, senior communications executive at the IFPI, in an emailed statement.



“For the purposes of the chart, albums are defined as being five tracks long or 25 minutes in running time.”



She added the rankings are “based on self-certified submissions” from their member record labels. For BTS, the sales figures were submitted by Big Hit Entertainment.



And asked about the huge discrepancy, Big Hit confirmed that data from Hanteo Chart, which is based on the sales volume in South Korea, was submitted to the IFPI, leaving a large number of overseas sales of the EP uncounted.



“IFPI asked us for sales data and we submitted that of Hanteo Chart, which is based on the album sales at home,” a Big Hit public relations official told The Korea Herald.

It has statements from BOTH Bighit and IFPI.

So we can see how much speculation of chartmasters was really not accurate at all. So again the chartmasters article from today is much like what happened last year... they don't know IFPI's methodology

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And that actually indicates that IFPI wanted Hanteo data, since Hanteo is sales data. Gaon is shipments data. So in theory labels should send all sales data they know of (Hanteo + sales in non-Hanteo stores + digital sales + Chinese digital sales, which would be downweighted as we know based on Xiao Zhan numbers). And that adds up mostly.

this is interesting.

it's also intersting that even in the revised chart bts is consistent.

Quote from myaza

And that actually indicates that IFPI wanted Hanteo data, since Hanteo is sales data. Gaon is shipments data. So in theory labels should send all sales data they know of (Hanteo + sales in non-Hanteo stores + digital sales + Chinese digital sales, which would be downweighted as we know based on Xiao Zhan numbers). And that adds up mostly.

I am glad u have that solid proof theory of urs to prove Ur points . I am also glad u apparently knew from last year this chart was innacurate and based on label submissions but still hyping it up this year cause your faves were taking numbers one and two.kudos

Quote from myaza

And that actually indicates that IFPI wanted Hanteo data, since Hanteo is sales data. Gaon is shipments data. So in theory labels should send all sales data they know of (Hanteo + sales in non-Hanteo stores + digital sales + Chinese digital sales, which would be downweighted as we know based on Xiao Zhan numbers). And that adds up mostly.

IFPI counts shipments

Quote from itiswhatitisss

https://chartmasters.org/2021/…-bit-of-ifpi-annual-list/

TL;DR: They touch on how many releases from Asian artists are excluded on the list, such as Lit by Lay(sold 2.65M units in China), New World by Hua Chenyu(sold 2M in China), Resonance by NCT(sold 2.6M combined), Neo Zone by NCT, Heng:garae and Semicolon by SVT, and Delight by Baekhyun

They also touch on how Chinese sales were obviously counted for some artists(such as Justin Bieber for Changes), but not reported for others (like BTS BE, Taylor Swift's folklore/evermore, BLACKPINK's The Album and Eminem's 'Murdered To The Music')

They also mention how IFPI clearly used different methodology for all three BTS albums. Only counted Gaon sales for BE, added Chinese downloads for MOTS: The Journey, and something else entirely for MOTS7.

Here's what they think the actual list should look like:

Dying at the fact that Justin, AC/DC and Taylor are the only Western artists in the top 15 djjmbjgxd

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There are many layers here: digital sale in china weighted down and also stream number of The album is unreasonable. IFPI weighted down a lot , including stream on YouTube and from China. They definitely incuded the china sales, but the method is different.

Quote from yutazenn

I am glad u have that solid proof theory of urs to prove Ur points . I am also glad u apparently knew from last year this chart was innacurate and based on label submissions but still hyping it up this year cause your faves were taking numbers one and two.kudos

Last year problem is solved. I Read the thread and BH submitted the Hanteo instead of Gaon. I think IFPI is still a good source

This account lost all credibility by posting this article.

Not armys still running with the hanteo numbers things lol

IFPI obviously posts whatever the labels send them

THE ALBUM only had Gaon data + Global digital sales excluding Chinese digitals

I'll never understand how svt didn't make it with 1M hanteo sales in the physical sales chart. They easily passed the mark even if they only considered hanteo.

is chartmasters credible (5k twitter following) over ifpi? hmmmmm.

lol, either way both my faves are in the original and chartmasters list so idc.

The armies in this thread all using the same singular brain cell it seems. Lmao

Chartmasters seems more reliable as far as showing their work. Things don’t add up entirely for IFPI.

wow. This is pure comedy lol

I mean I get certain dandam believing only information from twitter accounts and not the accounts which are actually considered by the industry.

Chinese sales are counted and weighted less, simply cause they cost quite less compared to other country sales.

Seventeen didn't make it cause pledis didn't send the numbers, they are supposed to make it last year too but didn't cause of same reason.

Chart masters is a twitter account with some insider info and they speculate things based on that information.

If u guess want to believe only that account, it fine cause kpop fans believing random accounts and making up numbers is not new.

Some users here are explaining the way it counts, yet others close their eyes and run with the narrative that makes up numbers.

These is like saying bb sold 100 million records when they never did.

what does downweighted mean?

Quote from Ruqi_Deen

what does downweighted mean?

Filtered. Chinese sales have different prices and are heavily inflated.

Xiao zhan song sold over 40 mil in China (more than any other song in the world) but IFPI only counted 1/4th (or something) of them.

And "IFPI is irrelevant because I have never heard of it"

Typical frog in a well behaviour

Quote from anonymous-man66

Filtered. Chinese sales have different prices and are heavily inflated.

Xiao zhan song sold over 40 mil in China (more than any other song in the world) but IFPI only counted 1/4th (or something) of them.

Do you have any idea why exactly 1/4th?

Quote from chounim

Do you have any idea why exactly 1/4th?

Probably because of the pricing and inflation. China doesn't have any verified compilation source, so the sales aren't verified and data can be manipulated i guess.

Quote from anonymous-man66

Probably because of the pricing and inflation. China doesn't have any verified compilation source, so the sales aren't verified and data can be manipulated i guess.

Yeah I know about the general sentiment toward Chinese sales, I was just wondering why they chose 1/4th exactly (in a mathematical sense)

Thank you anyway.

I dunno, so them

Quote from babyjinx1221

this is interesting.

it's also intersting that even in the revised chart bts is consistent.

Legendary Kings

Quote from Flowercrew

I dunno, so them

Legendary Kings

Glad we don't have to resort to have what IFs or combine repackages for our fave to top.