Posts by stan12345

Quote from ISaidISaid

We are not talking about the same things. For a musical act when talking about popularity only concert numbers matter for me. Or rather matter for me more than digitals. Digitals are also important to certain degree but only if there are concerts numbers to back it up.

This whole speculation about whether someone is in it for the music or not is not something anyone can confirm. For a music act the most important “chart’ or “metric” is concert that’s all. I don’t care why that fan is there in that concert hall that’s not even what the discussion is about.

This sentence just proves how warped and inane your argument has been over this thread.

As soon as I used your logic against you you're now saying you're only talking about EXO and don't care about other groups. No-one with half a brain cell would say that NCT were bigger in South Korea in their first 7 years then IU was her first 7 years and there's no way you don't know that.

Quote from ISaidISaid

Nope I can see your argument for what it is and I immediately disregard people who separate out fandom. We are at an impasse because the premise of your argument itself is something I consider to be both problematic and wrong.

Yes IU is more relevant and impressive now that she’s done a big tour than when she only had digital hits. No matter how times I share my stance you keep asking the same silly questions. Yes till before that her digitals hits meant nothing for me. BOL4, IU, Paul Kim these were just coffee house music whom I didn’t consider as anything important. IU broke that mould and showed her dominance. If she quit before she had done a big tour YES INDEED I would not consider her to be as relevant as she is now. Now for the last time stop asking me the same silly question over and over again.

It's not problematic, girl groups also have fandoms impacted heavily by factors other than music. I used to follow Twice a lot and half the fandom are more interested in Twice variety then they are their music hence why they had awful b-side streams yet very high levels of engagement overall. Hence why JYPE focuses on putting out so much variety content for them whilst b-sides get paid no attention by the company.

The last paragraph confirms to me what I need to anyhow.

Quote from ISaidISaid

You’re just speaking based on speculation we can never know the answer to this. GG’s only get TT track streams because they look cute and adorable in their TTs and don’t get b side streams because their music was never good. Anyone can speculate anything.

Also why give an example like survival show even then it can still be for the music maybe people have confidence in the music released by produce groups after seeing IOI W1 etc.

There is no nuance because It’s all random speculation. Usually speculation comes at the cost of misogyny. “People are only into GG TTs because they need sexy/cute videos or no one cares about them” “BG streams and concert goers are hormonal teenage girls that’s why they’re not there for the music”

Please don’t mince words with me when in kpop “Nuance” just means how do I put down women today.

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You're parroting that fandom size and ergo touring = how much people like their music when there's a lot more at play than that in South Korea, or this incredibly large discrepancy in female and male touring would not exist in South Korea. If that doesn't show how much your argument lacks nuance I don't know what to tell you.

It's not random speculation. IU took 10 years of dominance with hit album after hit album to play at something bigger than KSPO Dome.

Think about it, if she retired 3 years ago your logic would dictate acts that have played in stadiums in South Korea are more musically relevant with larger legacies than her in South Korea.

Quote from ISaidISaid

Yes touring numbers is the only way to know if an artist is loved. Everything else is meaningless. Otherwise you were just background music.

You can be proud of such numbers that’s up to you idc what you think. For me it’s meaningless. People who don’t care enough to see your perform do not add to your legacy. I listen to so many artists like that and there’s so much music to consume. You’re music should be good enough to convince people to see you in con.

I don’t get why you keep asking me the same thing when I already told you digimons not just GGs are less impressive because they don’t tour as big. How many times do you want me to repeat it.

I’ll say it one more time : if you can’t tour you don’t impress me. I don’t care how many certification you have. Do I believe this is because of better music? I don’t blv GGs have better music because they get more single hits and I don’t blv BGs have better music because they have concert. My opinion on music is dictated by my taste. But the question here what is more impressive: a concert is ALWAYS more impressive.

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From the bold you're clearly missing the point that fandom size is not dictated purely by music. Lim young Woong clearly has one of the biggest fandoms in South Korea around but you think if he got ugly and married to someone his fans don't rate they'd continue streaming his music like mad? I even gave you the example of X1 performing in a venue bigger than any female artist in South Korea other than IU with no music out.

But clearly you don't feel there's much room for nuance in this discussion so I'll leave you to it.

Quote from ISaidISaid

I actually don’t know nct’s tour numbers so I won’t speak for them but yes that’s exactly what I’m saying not just GG’s, solo artists and digimon who can’t fill up big tours are indeed irrelevant. It’s not hard to understand tbh. And anywhere else it would be an obvious statement.

Anyway “Irrelevance” etc are such harsh words. I’ll say “less impressive” it doesn’t mean anything to me that digimon songs(GG or otherwise) are playing more in coffee houses and streamed casually while as groups and musical acts they’re completely forgotten and no one cares to see them in con.

People who don’t blv concert is the most important metric for a musical act confuse me so honestly I can’t understand why you would even ask such an obvious question.

NCT 127 and Dream can do stadiums in South Korea, so your logic would dictate they are a more impressive act in South Korea then any female act ever outside of IU.

But for me this is the nuance aspect about aligning touring numbers to musical legacy/strength/relevance in SK specifically (which is what this thread is about) as I don't believe that's what primarily drives fandoms. This is why I asked the question earlier about whether you believe male artists just make much better music in South Korea than female artist hence the disparity in touring.

You're correlating touring numbers to an artists discography being widely loved by on average a larger group of people but I don't think that holds within South Korea as the extreme fandom culture/parasocial relationship aspect makes it a unique case. It's not abnormal for example for groups to have large akgae fandoms that will stop supporting as and when they please.

Quote from ISaidISaid

Tbh same can be said about digitals for BGs as well many of these companies work with the same producers for BGs and GGs and even if they release the same song GG will be successful and BG won’t for their singles.

For me GGs are irrelevant in Korea. People just listen and watch their fun music videos without actually caring about their music. Yes it can be because of prejudice same as how BGs can’t chart because of prejudice.

You are not more popular or relevant unless you can tour bigger and that’s the hill I’ll die on. Kek. So everyone who has toured less than EXO in Korea are less relevant than them.

Boy groups have done well though over the years digitally, very well actually, but only one female artist has ever toured anything bigger than KSPO Dome. Logically speaking just looking at the numbers, it definitely is harder to tour big as a girl group/female artist than it is to chart as a boy group/male artist.

You can definitely expand this conversation out to male and female artists in South Korea and going by your logic, NCT Dream and NCT 127 are more popular and relevant than every female artist outside of IU in South Korea.

Quote from ISaidISaid

Yes EXO’s b sides are better. They’re better than the GGs and also many of the BGs and that’s why they do better. Indeed.

The post you're quoting is about more than just EXO and your title insinuates you think digitally relevant albums is why bg's can tour in stadiums in SK and female artists outside of IU can't. Do you actually agree with that?

It's actually an interesting topic as no girl group has even done the Sky Dome before whilst X1 were having their debut fanmeeting there. Touring in South Korea clearly goes beyond having digitally relevant albums.

There's clearly a lot more nuance to touring in South Korea with IU being the only female artist to hold a stadium concert.

I feel like the question is more - if you were to follow the logic in the OP, why do female artists outside of IU in South Korea have "digitally irrelevant" albums that therefore means they can't hold stadium concerts there?

Do the dozen odd bg's/male artists that have toured in stadiums in South Korea over the last 10/15 years just have better b-sides whilst female Korean artists aren't delivering?

Quote from uwuwu-99

Love Dive might return to the top 10 weekly chart this week, surpassing Shut down. If Shut down resists BP would tie 2NE1's record for most weeks in the weekly top 10 for a gg, if LD returns it would increase its record for the longest charting gg song in the top 10, it's an interesting fight. I think LD will make it considering how these last weekends it used to be above Shut down and how small the gap is right now.

Does anyone know when SMTM is going to start releasing the songs digitally? I'm not following the show but I thought it was going to be this saturday or the next one, so the charts should start being messy soon.

That added to the crazy project group posted a couple of posts above, Cho yong pil, RV, Itzy, Christmas songs rising...

Ive with 3 songs and one year in must nearly be halfway to the gg record for weeks in the top 10 already? Longevity game has completely changed.

Cho Yong Pil is having a comeback? Wasn't on my bingo card for this year. Bounce was everywhere last time he released

Looks like Younha is having another song rise as well - Oort Cloud

Quote from ISaidISaid

Why would you think this is some big serve of a statement. You can even say BTS or IU or bigbang or whomever and EXO is still comparable in Korea. Do y’all know anything about EXO’s success in Korea? Their tour numbers? Their overall ULs?

I really think everyone knows nothing about stats and numbers and come on here to downplay EXO.

You can compare them but the answer is still the same.

Quote from huRRicane8

it's pretty equal imo.

I think people don't know how huge exo was in 2013-2016. Their engagement to gp was also big this period. And their songs did really well. Same goes for twice in 2015-2018. For bigger song yes cu is definitely leader, but exo was the first million seller group in a while so yes equal imo

So I'm going to assume you think EXO were also as big as BP in South Korea

The invitation of two rookie kpop groups makes this event feel a lot less prestigious then it used to be

Quote from Rainbowlicious

LMAOOO don't become like the blinks!!

Oh yeah, I have a feeling for sure that we're getting MISAMO. But always take these investment reports with a grain of salt. Their not official and they're made by investors with predictions for the year/quarter/half. So these have little to no weight for us as just fans (maybe if you were an investor in this company yourself).

But I think that the trademark for the name is definitely solid evidence. Though we'll never know the actual time because I don't think trademarks expire. So they actually could've just trademarked it this year and are possibly going to be holding it for a while. Just think about YGNGG. They trademarked Baemon/Baby Monsters maybe in 2020 or so yet there has been no news or actual official plans for this debut yet.

The fact that we don't actually know when is actually kind of scary to me

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I think you're getting confused about the source.

This isn't a report by an investment bank where they say x,y and z may happen therefore you should buy/sell shares, it's a report by JYPE for their investors as part of their investor relations to keep them updated.

Quote from BunnyLipChickpoo

I don't think so, they are a JYPE group after all

JYP isn't going to waste ITZY's potential

Do you know how JYPE roll

I feel like you're massively overestimating the size of Twice's fandom.

Quote from OnceMidzy4ever

My guess is Misamo feels more comfortable with a japanese release.

The safe route which is a Japanese debut would line up with recent decisions but I still don't agree with it. At this point it doesn't even matter I guess, the route the group is heading/wants to head is becoming more obvious in recent times.

But they most likely won't even get to perform it on tour outside of Japan, unless they release an English or Korean version anyhow.

I don't get the decision around a Japanese release for their first sub-unit

You've pretty much killed off half the hype, potential and content off the bat.

One of LYWs new songs in London Boy actually sounds pretty catchy. Basically sounds like a pop song.

I can't imagine he's too far away from a genuinely big hit

Will we get another Lim Young-woong or Kim Ho-Joong

I wonder if it can beat the ratings of the first one which is the highest rated cable show ever

Quote from monsterlife

1. I kind of agree with your point. It's why I'm confused why twitter stans tend to bash what they think as lower end brand deals. It's important to build solo brand image. But still Div 3 should up their cf getting game. I feel like with some members they are waiting for a big international brand to get them. Nayeon who got a hit song only have 3 cfs and the rest are sponsors.

JYPE is a good starting point to venture out of a group career. They had the resources and clout to give the girls big roles or push them in magazines. It's where Suzy, Taecyeon & Junho started their solo careers. JYPE used to be good in choosing roles for their teenage idols. Dream High catapult a lot of careers.

I don't think the demand is high as people think, popular kpop stars are a dime and dozen with new ones being churned out every year. This year alone has probably produced 5/6 more with the breakout of a bunch of groups

It's pointless you referring to artists that started their career over a decade ago as indicative of what JYPE can provide now. Since then JYPE have got rid of basically all of their soloists and their acting division. The company now is not what it was then. They have decided to specialise on group activities which is why they pump out more new groups than any other label. The division system itself now lends itself to efficiently pumping out group content whilst keeping their high margins which is why JYPE groups are good at building a fandom for their groups.