RE MUSIC SHOW : Album sales are as much a metric of success as digital performance

    I keep seeing this narrative that all music shows should award the most streamed song or it’s bogus which I find such a weird thing.


    Album sales is direct money and far more valuable monetarily than streams no two ways about it.


    Why shouldn’t music shows measure the value of a group. Or it’s fandom strength?


    Sure digitals are important and some music shows value it more than others. But the shows that place value on fandom support are equally valuable.


    Music show is not a the Gaon digital. No said it was going to be a digital chart battle. In fact that would be quite silly.


    If I was group I would 100% want a supportive fanbase and be acknowledged for having a supportive fanbase.


    Music shows don’t just measure how many streams a song has but also measure how powerful or valuable a group promoting is via voting and album sales.


    A group that is holistically successful WILL have both digitals, physicals and win in voting and only that group deserves to win ALL the music shows and that seems fair to me.

  • Tic_tac_toe

    Changed the title of the thread from “Album sales are as much a metric of success as digital performance” to “RE MUSIC SHOW : Album sales are as much a metric of success as digital performance”.

    music show awards the most popular song of the week, not most popupar artist.


    Physical sales dont indicate song popularity as it is buying a number of songs. I think it is quite clear why digital continues to have the biggest weigtage

    Quote from gerrard174

    music show awards the most popular song of the week, not most popupar artist.


    Physical sales dont indicate song popularity as it is buying a number of songs. I think it is quite clear why digital continues to have the biggest weigtage

    No one said that you assumed that. Lol why should your assumption be given any weight.


    Music shows should very much measure wholistic success of a comeback. That includes sales.

    Quote from Tic_tac_toe

    No one said that you assumed that. Lol why should your assumption be given any weight.


    Music shows should very much measure wholistic success of a comeback. That includes sales.

    It is the aim of the music show award, i didnt make them up *face palm*


    Maybe u read what the awards are about first?

    They give award to the most popular song, not most popular comeback or popular artist.


    Else there is no way they nominate song instead od artist or album. Logic


    If talking about most successful comeback, why would music show even nominate more than 1 song from 1 album/comeback?? Example Butter/PTD, DDDD/FY, Gone/OTG

    No it’s your assumption lol what


    For me a music show represents a success of a comeback. I never thought it was a popularity contest. In fact it never was a popularity contest. Lol what a silly notion.


    Your last point is just schematics. They’re performing the song and it wins that’s all. It doesn’t mean the award was not meant for the comeback.

    Quote from Tic_tac_toe

    No it’s your assumption lol what


    For me a music show represents a success of a comeback. I never thought it was a popularity contest. In fact it never was a popularity contest. Lol what a silly notion.

    Well u can hold on to your opinion, but I do not just assume things. It comes with logic.


    U just said, FOR U it represents success of comeback. But the objective has always been to award the most popular song against all metrics

    I always find it weird how people get so hung up on album sales being figured in and not say the fan voting part which seems to be the least relevant metric. But then it's really less about album sales and more about what kinds of groups do well in album sales.

    Quote from quark12395

    I always find it weird how people get so hung up on album sales being figured in and not say the fan voting part which seems to be the least relevant metric. But then it's really less about album sales and more about what kinds of groups do well in album sales.

    Music shows need to give leeways for boygroups which have bigger fanbase. So they strike a balance between digitals (streams/SNS) and fanbase support (physical/voting)



    Edit: even more weird are the broadcast points of judge points. Those are even more biased from the program point of view.

    Quote from quark12395

    I always find it weird how people get so hung up on album sales being figured in and not say the fan voting part which seems to be the least relevant metric. But then it's really less about album sales and more about what kinds of groups do well in album sales.

    Even voting is valid for me. The success of a comeback is everything. You have to be good at everyhting to win all music shows.

    Shows like inkigayo have YouTube/digital focused

    Music bank is physical biased

    Etc etc

    And if you want to win all of them you have to be good at everything. Basically common sense.

    Boring ppl want every single show to hand out awards based on Gaon digital chart. Bro here is an idea : just look at the Gaon digital chart instead.

    Quote from gerrard174

    Music shows need to give leeways for boygroups which have bigger fanbase. So they strike a balance between digitals (streams/SNS) and fanbase support (physical/voting)

    This is a disservice to GGs who are able to sell well.


    Musics shows need to give leeway and exposure to groups with casual listeners and no fandom support in hopes they can get a fandom with their performances. So maybe it’s that.

    Measuring the "popularity" of a song is pretty much impossible to do entirely accurately. Sales are just as much a metric of success as streaming is.

    Quote from Tic_tac_toe

    This is a disservice to GGs who are able to sell well.


    Musics shows need to give leeway and exposure to groups with casual listeners and no fandom support in hopes they can get a fandom with their performances. So maybe it’s that.

    And like u said, there are shows catered for this

    Inkigayo - Digital

    Mubank - Physical

    Music core - voting

    Mcountdown - balanced

    The show - attendance award

    Show champion - used to be random, now is balanced


    And the objective of attending music shows have always been to promote the song. Companies literally paid to promote on music shows. Awards are just secondary.

    Quote from kpopace26

    I think music show criterias are still balanced imo.


    But I do think nominating songs (instead of artists) with weighing album sales is a loophole.


    :pepeflushed:

    I think it’s just schematics. They perform their song on the music show so that somg gets nominated.


    In the end it’s how successful the comeback was. Not just album sales or digitals of the song but also voting and sns engagement and what not

    Quote from Tic_tac_toe

    Exactly.


    And if you’re a group who is truly amazing in all metrics. You’ll win all of them. Which seems fair to me.

    And so far i dont see many are really complaining about physicals ?


    As we all know, only MuBank matters a lot when comes to physical due to their market % computation. And even that, if there's competition on physicals, you will lose all advantage (example, Super Junior didnt win on Mubank despite high sales due to Rosé diluted the sales score). So, only physical sales also cant guarantee wins. Which is fair to me.


    But formula seems weird, for basing on how big the pie u have for the week. Maybe they should consider Inkigayo's way of computing digital by relative ranking and score them accrodingly.

    Quote from gerrard174

    And so far i dont see many are really complaining about physicals ?


    As we all know, only MuBank matters a lot when comes to physical due to their market % computation. And even that, if there's competition on physicals, you will lose all advantage (example, Super Junior didnt win on Mubank despite high sales due to Rosé diluted the sales score). So, only physical sales also cant guarantee wins. Which is fair to me. But formula seems weird, for basing on how big the pie u have for the week

    I already saw so many posts Kek. And the anon thread is filled with rubbish. People are so obtuse.

    Quote from Tic_tac_toe

    I already saw so many posts Kek. And the anon thread is filled with rubbish. People are so obtuse.

    It's just that small group of people. Afterall, the music shows still have this criteria to only allow songs to be nominated if they are at least top150 on digital chart. This is to prevent a song winning purely on physical while the song is nowhere to be found. So there is already a backstopper

    Quote from gerrard174

    And so far i dont see many are really complaining about physicals ?


    As we all know, only MuBank matters a lot when comes to physical due to their market % computation. And even that, if there's competition on physicals, you will lose all advantage (example, Super Junior didnt win on Mubank despite high sales due to Rosé diluted the sales score). So, only physical sales also cant guarantee wins. Which is fair to me. But formula seems weird, for basing on how big the pie u have for the week

    Imo MuBank is also hard to win such as Inki and MuCore (tho they're in a different league) because of that physical market share thingy. It's very tricky at times especially with many groups selling well at the same week.


    Our boys could have won during debut if only other artists didn't sell more over the weekends. :pepe-sad:


    20210811_122727.jpg

    Oh I agree that voting is valid. I was a teenager when TRL was at it's prime and spent many a day voting for songs. Just in terms of the actual comeback I'd put it at the bottom of the list since it's the least connected to the actual comeback itself instead of the group.

    Quote from Tic_tac_toe

    I already saw so many posts Kek. And the anon thread is filled with rubbish. People are so obtuse.

    ooh is it from today? lmao people get so salty whenever Astro wins. Folks got mad as hell when they beat Oh My Girl in April and now I guess they're beating Somi. I saw a bunch of Arohas celebrating the fact that we're finally considered a big fandom. :pepe-hehe:

    Quote from gerrard174

    It's just that small group of people. Afterall, the music shows still have this criteria to only allow songs to be nominated if they are at least top150 on digital chart. This is to prevent a song winning purely on physical while the song is nowhere to be found. So there is already a backstopper

    Ofc this a small forum so their voice is amplified and I’m forced to school them. It’s good fun

    It's weird to me that people get more pressed about album sales than voting. If your argument is that it should be driven by specific measurable metrics, album sales are just that. It's the fan voting that is not.


    I personally don't care either way but it's weird that people are hung up on there being a spot at the table for people who buy songs rather than streaming it for free.

    ..............................................................................................................perfume

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    Oh you're talking about music shows. Do people really say album sales shouldn't be taken into account?? That's one of the most relevant metrics though.


    What should be discounted or reviewed, in my opinion, is YouTube views instead. They count ad views too which can easily be bought by companies with money. It's Korea's own version of payola :ragec:

  • AllKill VIP

    The current formula is flawed.


    Digitals is only South Korea. Voting is only South Korea. Physicals is worldwide (Hanteo counts international shipping and some foreign stores). SNS (YouTube) is worldwide.


    They have first to decide if they want to award the most popular song in South Korea or worldwide. Currently it's neither.


    After they decide, they can combine physicals, downloads and streaming into equivalent units

    I see YouTube as “international” digitals. It is after all the biggest international platform. And most used for music. :pepepizza:


    It’s manipulated by ads yeah but that’s a separate discussion.


    So currently it’s a combination of both international and Korean and I don’t particularly mind.

  • AllKill VIP

    If it's music show then in first place it should be more about the performance in this music show itself... lol

    not giving anyone wins just because they have sales or chart well :)

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  • AllKill VIP
    Quote from Tic_tac_toe

    It’s not a dance or singing competition that would require experts not empirical data :eyes:

    but there should be something to also boost those who are performing

    because it's not radio music show...

    so you shouldn't be able to win with just releasing MV... or song in streaming sites

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