Debunking Western propaganda on Xinjiang thread

Quote from arin

Fuck this explanation. If calling whatever is the Chinese government doing in there to those people genocide, will help raise awareness of the horrible things that is happening there, then so be it. At the end of the day, these are just semantics that means absolutely nothing especially when there is a group of people suffering simply based on their race/religion.

Never been the case. China started to be harsh on Uyghur due to violence separatist movement, i.e, terrorism/treason. My country has experienced a collateral damage. In 2015, 2 Uyghur men were arrested in Thailand and confessed for planting a TNT bomb at Ratchaprasong, a famous tourist destination of Bangkok, and killed 20 persons. They had prepared yet another bomb but that bomb did not work. This was a revenge attack. Previously, Thailand arrested a group of Uyghur persons fleeing from Xinjiang for illegal immigration and deported them to China.

Quote from zuzuhhaa

but they are being killed..? young girls are forced to marry random men because their families will be killed if they don't.. children are being ripped away from their families...

And, you got this info from Adrian Zenz or CIA funded Uyghur congress?

Quote from bzzz

Never been the case. China started to be harsh on Uyghur due to violence separatist movement, i.e, terrorism/treason. My country has experienced a collateral damage. In 2015, 2 Uyghur men were arrested in Thailand and confessed for planting a TNT bomb at Ratchaprasong, a famous tourist destination of Bangkok, and killed 20 persons. They had prepared yet another bomb but that bomb did not work. This was a revenge attack. Previously, Thailand arrested a group of Uyghur persons fleeing from Xinjiang for illegal immigration and deported them to China.

And, you got this info from Adrian Zenz or CIA funded Uyghur congress?

So Uyghur people, or some of them, are actually some terroristic group in South-east Asia?

But USA showed fighting against them as "China killing innocent people bc of religion"?

Sadly this sounds very familiar. My country was there and suffered very badly bc of the same allegations which werent true...

Edit: We werent powerfull. So we got bombed by NATO even though UN didnt agree with it. Ofc, there is no consequences for it towards anyone...

I still hope that they don't do something monstrous to them.

oh wow..

Its still definitely Systemic and institutionalized racism.

That being said there are manipulative actors from both sides doing atrocious things like china attempting to force assimilate everyone into the Han culture but also on the flip side you had inaccurate and racially charged children's textbooks being published for 10+ years.

I suggest everyone watch this video. It's a 90 minute that explains in detail how we are being lied to about what is happening in Xinjiang China. The claims of genocide is a lie coming from the Trump Administration.

American DEBUNKS All Major Western Propaganda on Uyghurs and Xinjiang!

https://youtu.be/8yURIS7S9zg

Quote from arin

Fuck this explanation. If calling whatever is the Chinese government doing in there to those people genocide, will help raise awareness of the horrible things that is happening there, then so be it. At the end of the day, these are just semantics that means absolutely nothing especially when there is a group of people suffering simply based on their race/religion.

In 2009, 2011 and 2014, attacks were led by a few Uighurs in Xinjiang, aka “separatist movement,” k*lling residents indiscriminately with bombs and other weapons. The 2009 Urumqi riot is known to be instigated by Rebiya Kadeer, pres of Uighur American Association. The smaller 2014 incident had two perpetrators who set off a bomb, k*lling 3 (incl. the 2 bombers) and injuring 79 in XJ. A few more incidents here and there. Whether they were trying to cause trouble, free people or become dictators is up for you to deicide. Some of these “Muslims’” beliefs included making women stay at home, get married early and didn’t allow school, which happens to be compulsory in China. When some girls were prevented from going to school, the police found out and put them in “education centers”aka “camps” in the west. Both the adult and the kid. When violence occurred, the police stepped in and arrested all of them during attacks. Western media simply called it a "protest squashed by the gov.” It’s a handful of extremists out of a population of 20+ million in XJ, like 0.0001% so it’s even common. The majority live in peace and have basic human rights. The gov kept attackers alive. They are in jail right now and the younger ones who were teens back then are being rehabilitated aka de-radicalized in the "camps/reeducation centers." Again the information on these camps is really limited, so its hard to find info in English. Basically, there's 2 stances. China claims these policies as de-radicalization of terrorism and poverty alleviation while mainstream media calls it ethnic genocide and crimes against humanity. idk how de-radicalization means "suffering" in your eyes tho. should the gov let the handful of "innocent" terrorists run free? so they can kill the other 20 mil ppl? and oppress women? and fix your grammar, i can barely understand what you're saying....

Regarding news about atrocities happening to Uighurs, has anyone seen a real ACTUAL clip of Uighurs being rap*d, t*rtured, or k*lled? Any camera footage of the CCP committing this? Witnesses can be bought off. Words can be fake. Crying in a video. A viral video claimed to have been the CCP torturing a Uighur for reading a Quran was found to be Indonesian police beating a local thief. Many detention camp pictures were found to have come from protests in Turkey. So many examples of evidence being debunked. However, they never get reported in mainstream media. People are easily sucked into something called atrocity theory and end up feeling strongly about the topic despite only seeing few “testimonials” because it evokes sympathy, and you feel like helping. People like me who do research on it get labelled as deniers or ccp shill. whatev.

Something I found interesting is why the media targeted only Uighurs instead of 54 other ethnic minorities in China. For 10+ years. Xinjiang is full of fossil fuels, rich farmland, and a strategic location for trans-continental trade (all my fellow americans, yall mustve heard what happened in afghanistan recently, right? and coincidentally its right next to XJ, hmmm…) Uighurs happen to all live there. From my research, ethnic minorities in China are entitled to privileges like farming or housing subsidies, extra points on college exams, full scholarships, 80% subsidized healthcare, treatment before paying, etc. Policy-wise, China treats its minorities well and better than Han Chinese. BBC paints the region in a bad light (literally) using grey filters of whatever footage they have from Xinjiang, satellite images, edited versions of interviews w random Uighurs. Most ppl reporting this, AHEM John Oliver, have never even travelled there nor met the people and culture.

Regarding genocide, if you look at demographics, there are current 12.8 mil Uighurs in China and all concentrated in Xinjiang (this is a universally accepted figure), up from 9.9 mil in 2010, and their population DOUBLED in the last 4 decades. Now go look at the UCLA paper from 2011 on Uyghurs called “Migration and Inequality in Xinjiang” (Howell and Fan). It states Xinjiang total pop was 3.6 mil in 1945 (end of page 122) and on the next page, Table 1, Xinjiang demographics in 1945, Uyghurs were 82.7% of the total pop. Calculate that and u get 2.977 mil of Uighurs in 1945 in XJ, now compare that to 12.8 million in 2020, Over 4 times the pop. How did genocide cause the population to increase by 330%? Simply put, it never happened because the 1 child policy didn’t apply to them or other ethnic minorities, it only applied to the Han Chinese ethnicity in China. I would’ve used the plentiful Chinese .cn or .gov articles and statistics floating around online but no one would believe me. And someone tried to deny it by telling me that UCLA, a public university in the US, was funded by the CCP, can u believe it?? I mean my cousin is a prof at UCSF and I’m a student at a public research university. I know how funding and sh*t works. I found several other peer reviewed articles on demographics, but the idiot wouldn’t believe me.

About the camps, too lazy to write. Watch a british guy called Jason Living in China on YT. He gives a great explanation about satellite images and camps. With regard to figures, like 1 million, ppl quoted this from an NGO called CERD, which employed at the time ONE employee. Gave no evidence to back up their estimate.

Uighurs are an Eurasian “ethnic group” not a religious group. Not all Uighurs are Muslims. Historically they were not Muslim, they were Buddhist or atheists or some other spiritual beliefs. Islam gradually spread there when Turks moved there (circa 11-15th century AD, since historically there was a lot of fighting over territory). That’s why the XJ region is so complex. It's been a melting pot of cultures since the Silk Road several thousand years ago, serving as a midway point for China and Persia. Almost a whole millennia before Islam was even born, the Silk Road opened in 130 B.C.E. Currently a large portion of Uighurs practice Islam but it's different from how it looks in the Middle East or Africa. Some women wear headscarves or hair wraps but only covering the hair or a veil down to the neck (mostly elderly). Some wear the ethnic Uighur (doppa) cap or keep their hair loose. Men CAN grow beards and wear the doppa as well. Foreign media reports these differences as evidence of ethnic cleansing.🙄 They pray at mosques too. China spent billions building mosques for them in recent decades. they are actually so beautiful. 24,000 mosques in just XJ. look up some travel vlogs to Xinjiang on YT if u don’t believe me. Most positive info on XJ is usually not promoted on YT and don’t show up in searches unless searched for VERY specifically. Not gonna point names but a lot of websites/social media have automated algorithms that suppress certain videos or block/delete comments or video links when I try to comment, like a PARTICULAR recent 9 mil view video where a guy with an annoying British accent talked about China. Talk about free speech. 🙄

Please watch some interviews or some of the self-made videos of real Uyghur voices.

@ tinyurl.com/REALUYGHURS

People need to stop acting like experts on Uighurs. None of us have even visited. It makes no sense to condone a whole ethnic group to accusations that you have not witnessed personally nor understand fully. Or listen to silly little political commentators on this. Or people like Udo Ulfkotte and Adrian Zenz. He’s a freakin Christian, why is he even researching Muslims???

I would love to see real evidence or testimonial of someone who was allegedly forced to pick cotton. Not just two blurred faces standing next to a ginormous pile of machine picked cotton on a BBC article. Find me legit evidence.

Just because Uighurs don’t actively share their lives with outsiders doesn’t mean they’re oppressed or unhappy. Why do they have to prove anything to strangers? Why should farmers need to prove that they’re farming on their own land?

Also I’m sure all those Chinese kpop idols prolly know more about xinjiang than any us us since they were born in China and it’s a popular tourist location for Chinese ppl. If you don’t like an idol’s political views, its fine, don’t support them. They’re just posting their views based on their personal life experiences. We can’t just assume they’re being used for political purposes if we don’t know what’s going on in their minds.

References:

(mostly for cherry-picking statistics cuz its all pretty one sided)

Howell and Fan (Migration) https://geog.ucla.edu/sites/default/files/users/fan/403.pdf

Toops (East Turkestan/XJ) https://www.jstor.org/stable/23615555?seq=1

Remi Castes (Malaise) https://journals.openedition.org/chinaperspectives/648

Testimonials https://www.youtube.com/watch?…LnLIvgADPbOOad5qi&index=2

Travel/Street Food Vlogs (mostly 2015-2017)

https://tinyurl.com/XJtravelvlogs (playlist)

XJ Cotton Farming/Anni Guli

tinyurl.com/XJfarmers (playlist)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0xbnXINy6_8 recorded oct 2018, uploaded 2019

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sHWcqGtjP2U reuploaded with eng subs just now

The Lovely BBC article that started it all

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/ext…6v8c/china-tainted-cotton

also btw John Sudworth just fled china after being sued by Xinjiang residents and local businesses for defamation, lmao. he didn’t even tell the foreign correspondent office or whatev procedures u gotta do, just left lol. technically he’s protected by international law so if he’s innocent he doesn’t hafta worry, but… lol

I have been lurking for a long time but I created this thread just to say how happy I am to see something like this here. The Western Sinophobia that they disguise with conspiracy theory after conspiracy theory has gone on for far too long, and is the biggest contributor of Anti-Asian rhetoric today.

It's time we stop letting the US fabricate atrocities in countries it doesn't like (Incubator Babies in Kuwait, WMDs in Iraq), just as an excuse to further fund the Worlds most violent military.

The answer is to dyor instead of lifting and believing everything in the news

It's hard to believe the media coming out of China due to the continuous falsified, exaggerated, and usually debunked "news", or propaganda, that they push. They're probably second only to North Korea (or maybe third with Russia included in some instances) for most unreliable/false news worldwide; however, I don't doubt that the news from outside of China about what's going on in China isn't one-hundred percent accurate either. Still, China (the government) is committing atrocities, and that can't be denied or ignored.

There's a reason Uighur people are fleeing China in large numbers to bordering countries such as Kazakhstan... That should be signal enough.

Quote from momo5001

In 2009, 2011 and 2014, attacks were led by a few Uighurs in Xinjiang, aka “separatist movement,” k*lling residents indiscriminately with bombs and other weapons. The 2009 Urumqi riot is known to be instigated by Rebiya Kadeer, pres of Uighur American Association. The smaller 2014 incident had two perpetrators who set off a bomb, k*lling 3 (incl. the 2 bombers) and injuring 79 in XJ. A few more incidents here and there. Whether they were trying to cause trouble, free people or become dictators is up for you to deicide. Some of these “Muslims’” beliefs included making women stay at home, get married early and didn’t allow school, which happens to be compulsory in China.

Islamic cultures tend to encourage inequity between genders and the millennial even believes religion is stupid and should be gone for good. Yet, once China decides to suppress Islamic culture, Islam suddenly is a precious heritage and religion is quintessential for life.