How are NCT DREAM outperforming NCT 127?

Quote from Slow-Cooked Parsnip & Pear Yak (312)

I just think your analysis is bad and you have no idea what your talking about. You really think, NCT 2020 finally breaking 1 million for NCT, then next year both units see CRAZY increase in sales, right after a 2 part comeback with an huge increase in sales, and you think it has nothing to do with NCT 2020?

I’m not discrediting 127 or Dreams work by themselves, but it’s pretty obvious to see they gained a lot of fans from NCT 2020, and normal groups don’t go from 600k to 2mil without anything in between. There sales growth makes more sense when you factor in that sold 1.4mil and 1.1mil with NCT 2020, then increased to 2 mil by themselves. Same with 127 going from 800k to 2mil. These are not normal increases and only make sense WITH CONTEXT OF NCT 2020 happening

Trying to divorce 127 or Dreams success from NCT 2020

And that's your prerogative. No, I do not think that RESO had a huge impact on NCT DREAM specifically. You're overlooking that HOT SAUCE was a anticipated release and that increased sales. NCT DREAM bars also bought the most albums. Deja vu was the best performing b-side on K charts too.

If RESO had that big of an impact on NCT then WAYV would've seen a bigger increase in sales too. Their 2021 album should've at-least hit 600k if RESO really had that big of an impact. But maybe it did? We don't know the number of their Chinese Version sales.

RESO and it's impact is over-exaggerated.

Quote from Slow-Cooked Parsnip & Pear Yak (312)

You really think, NCT 2020 finally breaking 1 million for NCT

I thought NCT 127 were the first to break 1 million for NCT?

Quote from Breaded Honey Turkey (827)

I don't think its a dreamzen lol

They arent this obsessed with 127 supposedly needing to do better, probably 2nd fandom

I find it insulting that you think i'm trying to start something, instead of having a discussion. If you aren't going to participate, while bring your fandom forum drama over here-- leave. And don't come back. Thank you

Quote from OP

I find it insulting that you think i'm trying to start something, instead of having a discussion. If you aren't going to participate, while bring your fandom forum drama over here-- leave. And don't come back. Thank you

Why are you coping so hard?? 😂

Without the impact of nct 2020 dream would have struggled to sell 1 million on hanteo for hot sauce lol

Dream has always been more popular in korea so idk how the b-side charting is even an argument. Taeyong bar contributed the most to resonance sales btw. And that era boosted the album sales for all units

Quote from OP

I find it insulting that you think i'm trying to start something, instead of having a discussion. If you aren't going to participate, while bring your fandom forum drama over here-- leave. And don't come back. Thank you

You decided to choose the shadiest section on AKP to have a discussion. That says something about intentions and purposes. Do you not see people trashing groups left and right here? Not saying that's your intention, but you can't blame people for thinking you might have an agenda.

You could have come to the NCT guild. We're very chill and pretty much aware of their numbers. You seem to know a lot about their numbers, but honestly you're missing A LOT of context and circumstances that we could have explained them to you, info you won't find on gaon or hanteo.

Quote from Breaded Honey Turkey (827)

Why are you coping so hard?? 😂

Without the impact of nct 2020 dream would have struggled to sell 1 million on hanteo for hot sauce lol

Dream has always been more popular in korea so idk how the b-side charting is even an argument. Taeyong bar contributed the most to resonance sales btw. And that era boosted the album sales for all units

I'd rather you don't project onto me.

If a b-side were to out chart a title track for a album as impactful as RESO i'd say that's something worthy to bring up. Are you a NCTZEN? Why are you downgrading the achievements of a group you're a fan of?

I didn't bring up Taeyong bar because I was talking about NCT DREAM.

Quote from Smoked Fennel & Lime Mutton (730)

You decided to choose the shadiest section on AKP to have a discussion. That says something about intentions and purposes. Do you not see people trashing groups left and right here? Not saying that's your intention, but you can't blame people for thinking you might have an agenda.

You could have come to the NCT guild. We're very chill and pretty much aware of their numbers. You seem to know a lot about their numbers, but honestly you're missing A LOT of context and circumstances that we could have explained them to you, info you won't find on gaon or hanteo.

This section is no different from the threads on the rest of the forum from what I can see. I haven't engaged with those posts, but I also haven't come across them. I see why that would put people off my post. I could post this off ANON and get the same responses I got here, or they would be even more dismissive and i'd be written off as a troll.

Quote from Breaded Honey Turkey (827)

I don't think its a dreamzen lol

They arent this obsessed with 127 supposedly needing to do better, probably 2nd fandom

This is a long-running argument on twt between Dreamzens and 127zens about who's performing better and who gets more attention, promotion and hype from SM. It's quite toxic and frustrating because NCT gets plenty of hate outside the fandom, so it doesn't need this inside of it.

Both groups have been promoted appropriate to the group: Dream, a super cute teenage group meant to target kids and teens in Korea, also had tie-ins with the FIFA Under 20 tournament, Pinkfong and the Boy Scouts International. 127, a group built to target the West with three fluent English speakers, had substantial Western promotions, including the European MTV awards, U.S. talk shows and a tie-in with Apple.

Now that Dream are adults and Resonance has provided that larger international attention boost, which was then boosted by Hot Sauce and Hello Future, I would think they will change the promotional strategy, especially with English speaker Mark back in the group.

Quote from OP

What's up with the assumptions? Nobody is saying the other group is a flop or whatever it is you're assuming. If you think that, you're really naive. Having both groups release a full album this year will result with them going head to head, and opens the door to comparisons whether you like it or not.

This is again a pretty standard argument from Dreamzens. Non-NCTzens tend to take the perspective of wondering how Dream could have grown so much from Reload to Hot Sauce and similarly how 127 could have grown so much on Neo Zone or on Sticker. You have to know about the group to understand how passionate and engaged Dreamzens are, particularly during the HS/HF push, and how this contributed to sales.

Both groups have a similar trajectory - they have both worked very hard to build a loyal fanbase and each group has shown ongoing growth over each subsequent release (127 saw a slowdown on the Korean boycotted We Are Superhuman in Korea, but jumped tremendously within the US with the combination of touring + smart media promotions). Resonance provided excitement that resulted in all units receiving an increase in attention and sales boosts. Dream had the added boost of a fanbase that was really excited and motivated for a full album.

Which is what I said in a simpler way in my original reply:

Quote from Broasted Confit of Mammoth (275)

Their sales growth for Hot Sauce was a combination of post-Resonance lift, which again all sub-units have seen, and a strong fanbase in Korea, built from previous releases who want a full album.

You chose to interpret that as:

Quote from OP

It's not but attributing everything they've achieved to RESONANCE is so weird too.

When my statement clearly said it was a combination (underlined and bolded in my quote it was unclear), which seems to indicate a bias here on your part.

Quote from OP

You took two of my points and put them together to make a completely different argument. Commenter 1 said NCT 127 had better physicals, which they do not, as per the data I posted. Better physicals would mean significantly better physicals, but they were pretty much on par with each other.

They are doing great, but one should be doing significantly better.

NCT 127 does have better physicals overall - you are cherrypicking the data to prove your point here. You specifically included We Are Superhuman (which was subject to a Korean boycott), but did not include Neo Zone or Reload to prove your point. (I'm assuming you intentionally left off the two 127 repackages to try and draw as much as an apples to apples comparison as possible, but that adds a further 900K to their overall total). You specifically included a limited section of releases between 2018-2019 rather than looking at the entire landscape of the group's sales. You also completely ignored NCT 127's three Japanese releases and Dream's one release to further try and make your argument. If your original post had said "Dream has better or comparable physicals from 2018-19 on a limited selection of albums," this would be a different conversation.

(Which is a shame, because I think there is potentially a really interesting discussion that could be had about how Dream seems to have seen the largest back catalog boost out of Resonance - that growth is tremendous post-Resonance compared to the other units. It seems to imply that Resonance got a large number of people interested in Dream's older music.)

Quote from OP

NCT 127 gets promoted in 2 of the biggest music markets in the world, but NCT DREAM are doing good if not better, in terms of sales and charting, without any global promotion. NCT 127 should be doing 3 times better, but they aren't. Is it time to send NCT DREAM out into the global market?

Only honest responses that are open for discussion please.

You don't seem very open for discussion with honest responses, since every time someone posts a response that disagrees with your original opinion, you accuse the responder of assuming or being dismissive.

127 has better physicals - no matter how much you move the needle to only look at a specific time period or argue for significantly better, 3x better or whatever arbitrary amount you are defining as better.

NCT 127 also performs better globally on Spotify. 127 was in the top 10 groups globally for Spotify for 2020, while Dream was not. NCT 127 also performs better on multiple U.S. Billboard charts and in Japan. It is clear that the strategy to target 127 towards the West helped them grow there: they've gone from #86 in the Billboard 200 to #3 and became the 4th kpop group to crack the top 10. Again, this is what they were designed to do, while Dream was designed to dominate in the Korean market, which is reflected by the way they perform better in Korean digital and on Korean charts and won the first music show wins in NCT.

Again, this is what they were both designed to do - target specific markets and they are both doing great not only in that market but others.

Quote from OP

If RESO had that big of an impact on NCT then WAYV would've seen a bigger increase in sales too. Their 2021 album should've at-least hit 600k if RESO really had that big of an impact. But maybe it did? We don't know the number of their Chinese Version sales.

But they did. Kick Back did 3x the sales of their last release and became their first Platinum release - this is more notable because this is an album that is almost entirely in Mandarin. It's unrealistic to expect an album in Mandarin to do 6x the sales in Korea - but 3x is still a really impressive growth. Hell, that total of 356K is higher than NCT 127 and Dream's first and second releases in Korean. And that is definitely more evidence of a post-Resonance boost.

Quote from OP

If a b-side were to out chart a title track for a album as impactful as RESO i'd say that's something worthy to bring up. Are you a NCTZEN? Why are you downgrading the achievements of a group you're a fan of?

A b-side didn't outchart the title track. The four promoted songs out charted Deja Vu, as they should.

Resonance songs on the Gaon charts

(bolded are the singles, italics are songs that were promoted with track videos or TV promotions. Deja Vu was promoted with a performance in the NCT World 2.0 series)

Make A Wish - #14

90s Love - #84

From Home - #92

Work It - #123

Deja Vu - #123

Misfit - #130

Volcano - #168

Music, Dance - #181

Faded in My Last song - #186

Dancing in the Rain - #188

On the U.S. Billboard World Digital Songs Chart, only:

Make A Wish - #11

90s Love - #15

Work It - #23

On Billboard Global 200, only Make A Wish at 128.

Are you talking about on Flo or Bugs? I'm not as familiar with Resonance singles performance on those charts.

OP is definitely a bitter Dreamzen. Both NCT Dream and NCT 127 are part of NCT and believe it or not, both groups and WayV all use each other to become more successful because they all build the NCT brand. All of the units are doing incredible and we should be celebrating ALL of their success instead of trying to play them against each other.

Quote from Breaded Honey Turkey (827)

I don't think its a dreamzen lol

They arent this obsessed with 127 supposedly needing to do better, probably 2nd fandom

this isnt bob.

also NCT 127 outperformed with this comeback in terms of sales.

Quote from Broasted Confit of Mammoth (275)

NCT 127 does have better physicals overall - you are cherrypicking the data to prove your point here. You specifically included We Are Superhuman (which was subject to a Korean boycott), but did not include Neo Zone or Reload to prove your point. (I'm assuming you intentionally left off the two 127 repackages to try and draw as much as an apples to apples comparison as possible, but that adds a further 900K to their overall total). You specifically included a limited section of releases between 2018-2019 rather than looking at the entire landscape of the group's sales. You also completely ignored NCT 127's three Japanese releases and Dream's one release to further try and make your argument. If your original post had said "Dream has better or comparable physicals from 2018-19 on a limited selection of albums," this would be a different conversation.

127 has better physicals - no matter how much you move the needle to only look at a specific time period or argue for significantly better, 3x better or whatever arbitrary amount you are defining as better.

I didn't included certain albums like NEOZONE because I had a certain time period in mind when I originally made this post. I ignored those 3 releases because there are no official Japanese releases for NCT DREAM. I could've worded my original post better.

Quote from Broasted Confit of Mammoth (275)

(Which is a shame, because I think there is potentially a really interesting discussion that could be had about how Dream seems to have seen the largest back catalog boost out of Resonance - that growth is tremendous post-Resonance compared to the other units. It seems to imply that Resonance got a large number of people interested in Dream's older music.)

You don't seem very open for discussion with honest responses, since every time someone posts a response that disagrees with your original opinion, you accuse the responder of assuming or being dismissive.

That would be a really interesting discussion. I am very much open for discussion with honest responses, but not ones that directly has nothing to do with my initial post. Thank you for your responses.

Quote from Smoked Fennel & Lime Mutton (730)

You decided to choose the shadiest section on AKP to have a discussion. That says something about intentions and purposes. Do you not see people trashing groups left and right here? Not saying that's your intention, but you can't blame people for thinking you might have an agenda.

You could have come to the NCT guild. We're very chill and pretty much aware of their numbers. You seem to know a lot about their numbers, but honestly you're missing A LOT of context and circumstances that we could have explained them to you, info you won't find on gaon or hanteo.

Quote from OP

This section is no different from the threads on the rest of the forum from what I can see. I haven't engaged with those posts, but I also haven't come across them. I see why that would put people off my post. I could post this off ANON and get the same responses I got here, or they would be even more dismissive and i'd be written off as a troll.

What?

Quote from Broasted Confit of Mammoth (275)

A b-side didn't outchart the title track. The four promoted songs out charted Deja Vu, as they should.

Quote from OP

If a b-side were to out chart a title track

I specified K charts

Quote from OP

Deja vu was the best performing b-side on K charts too.

Make A Wish - #14

90s Love - #84

From Home - #92

Work It - #123

Deja Vu - #123

Misfit - #130

Volcano - #168

Music, Dance - #181

Faded in My Last song - #186

Dancing in the Rain - #188

shinee did better than nct dream this year.

Quote from Deep-Fried Red Whine Bear (856)

number 2 boy group in korean digitals