So, the representation in LISA's Rockstar MV is real or not? [NOT TROLLING!!!]

For clarification, I want to see what other people think, so LISA fans, don't go berserk, this is an honest question! This isn't just about her, she's just the most recent Idol who did this or tried to do this. I've seen this so many times from others as well, and as I mentioned, many times from Hollywood as well!

I just read this so called "article" on the main site, and it made me think about representation in Kpop again.

I honestly don't want to offend anyone, but how is this MV is a trans representation? I mean, sure if you're doing a research, you can find, they're trans people, but the MV itself made it obvious? No! So, it's not a real representation. Real representation is what we've seen in Moonbyul's Shutdown, Wheein's Goodbye, Solar's COLORS MV, Mamamoo's HIP, or Chungha's Stay Tonight for starters, not this. It's only a 3 second clip, and it's only clear if you do some research about them, and why would anyone do that?

This is like when Disney put a 2 second scene in Star Wars with 2 kissing women in the background, basically an easter egg. So, yeah, more like Queer baiting that's happening in Kpop for years.

Also, empty China Town? I thought that's Thailand. Some "journalists" on AKP are really clueless, LOL.💀

And don't forget the "Teach me Japanese" line. She's not even trying. So we could say, she's representing trans people, talking about racism, and representing her Thai people, but is it really true?

I think, no it's not, she didn't do either of these things, except the Thai representation, but honestly, I don't think that was obvious either for someone who doesn't know anything about her.

What do you think?

Quote from someone00

I think you'll always find a problem with anything BP girls release so therapy is needed in your case for still somehow finding BP articles, tweets, etc "accidentally".

Lisa first solo music outside YGE was filmed in her hometown Thailand, she only accepted Thai dancers, chose to show 3 famous Thai trans in the MV and some Thai people that reacted the MV immediately knew who they are aka the representation you are trying to dismiss when the LGBTQIA+ community in Thai felt represented so yeah, nothing was planned, Lisa just shot some random places, random people bc oh please, she can't think neither can she do something good.

Maybe you should forget about the fact that I'm talking about Lisa, because literally said, this isn't just about her, she's the latest one who did this, that's why the thread. And I didn't find this "accidentally", I read AKP daily.

This is why we can't have a decent conversation with people like you, because you think everything is hate.

Like I said, REAL representation is when EVERYONE knows what's happening! Kpop companies do this for years. There are a handful of artists who's doing real representations.

Those trans people only famous in Thailand, and let's be real, people like you only know about them, because you read an article about them, not because the MV made it obvious. That's my point.

So, technically you're the one who need therapy, because you can't stop using your crazy fandom brain and see when someone is trying to start a normal conversation.

STOP ACTING LIKE A 5 YEAR OLD KID! This is why people don't take your fandom seriously, you can't do normal conversations.

Quote from babyspice31

I watched the MV and absolutely loved to see different Thai people with different skin colors. So often only pale white skinned people are represented in Asian media. When I went to Thailand, I only saw the same pale white skinned people on the billboards and TV. Brown skin is so beautiful so i love how so many brown skinned people were featured in the MV.

Also, I was really shocked to see Chinni. She's a Thai trans woman who I follow on Youtube and social media. I never thought I would see a trans person in one of Kpop's most prominent figures' MV. Honestly that really made my day when I realized she and her whole team had a few trans women in the MV Trans people are so underrepresented in mainstream media, so Lisa doing this is really amazing. I gotta give it to her!

Only other time I remember were Mamamoo and SNSD featuring drag queens in their MVs, although i'm not sure if any of them were trans or just cis gay men.

I'm not even a Lisa fan but I admire her for this. Not many Kpop idols would ever dare to do that. And most of them wouldn't ever talk about it and if they do it would be to belittle and mock trans women (aka Siwon from Super Junior for example). So i see this representation in the MV as a win

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Mamamoo's HIP and SNSD's MV (I don't remember which one was) included Drag Queens. In SNSD's MV, they were hidden in the background, so I would say that's real representation.

What you said about the trans women in Lisa's MV, is what I was trying to point out. The Thai representation is obviously real, but the trans, I don't think so, because only people like you know who they are. I only know they're trans because I read the Billboard article.

Sure, let's say, it's a win, but I think the representation could've been more obvious. It's not like she's a Kpop Idol and bound by the Kpop world, now she's more like a Western Idol, so she can do anything she wants. I expect more, especially from someone who has a massive platform like she has.

Quote from DaisyTheGenuine

What Lisa is doing is inclusive and normalizing. You wouldn't know they were trans unless you looked up or knew prior (which a lot of people did because she chose pretty famous influencers) but there's nothing wrong with that. It's also a good thing. Why is there an unwritten rule that if you include a queer person in a work, you must go out of your way to emphasize the fact they're queer?

Explicitly celebrating LGBTQ rights is great. Including queer people and letting them do the normal work they're often excluded out of because people can't see beyond their identity is great

And how tf is it queerbaiting when there's actual queer people involved

Never said what Lisa did is wrong, my point was that I think it should've been more obvious. I mean, doing it more openly can give others more opportunities.

For the record, this is why I made this thread, because I want to hear other people's opinion, not shading Lisa or others.

Saying, it's queer baiting maybe wasn't the best word to describe it, but that's why I mentioned the Star Wars movie with the 2 women kissing scene. Inclusion is not always happening because the creator (not just a musician) cares about them. A LOT of times people doing this for more views, more positive PR etc.

I mean, that's why I made a poll to see how many people think it's real or not.

Maybe I expect too much, and not only from Lisa.

Quote from someone00

Talking about using brain when you always use your ass to anything related to BP.

This isn't bc she was the lastest, it's bc it was something from BP that you obsess so much.

Your "kid" insults don't work here, David, you act like a petty adult.

Talking about fandom mentality when you are the perfect example of toxic kpop stan

You still didn't write a single argument. The ONE and ONLY thing you can do is calling me a hater.

I think people, like you, should be the last one who calls me a "toxic kpop stan". At least, I have a real opinion, unlike you. I never called you or anyone a hater just because they have a different opinion. You're just a typical newborn Kpop stan who can't write a single comment without insulting others. That's why I call you "kid", because you're acting like one.

Also, this topic isn't about Blackpink, this is about representation in Kpop and maybe about Lisa, but she's not Blackpink. Learn the difference.

If you can't argue like a normal person, just ignore my posts and comments, it's not that hard. I don't think I tagged you to come her, but here you are talking nonsense. So, who's the toxic here, and who's obsessed?🤔

Grow up, and learn to accept different opinions.

Quote from someone00

In my first post I answered your question and the poll answers are a even more clear answer. I'm a kpop stan since 2014, I just don't see a reason to act so rational in a thread made by a known BP hater bc you are even though you always deny like a coward. And you don't call me a hater bc you don't see me camping on others threads and always criticizing one group like you do to BP.

Don't try to act like you are so rational when you are full of biasness.

"And this topic isn't about BP or Lisa" when this thread is about Lisa and her "queer baiting" by your logic, are you dumb?

Grow up and stop obsessing over people you obviously dislike.

Why should I say I hate BP, when I don't hate anyone? I have a different opinion, hon, that's not hate!

And this topic is about representation, like I said.

I didn't criticize in this thread anyone, and even when I do criticize something or someone, I'm fair, even with my faves. Just read my Red Velvet, Kiss of Life etc comments. You can see I'm not biased. Criticizing is not hate.

You're not camping on others threads? Why are you here, then?

Quote from DaisyTheGenuine

But how would she make it more obvious without resorting to using stereotypes, which is one of the things that representation pushes against? All three of those women presented in the video the same way are in real life, the only way you'd know is by hearing them speak

To make it more obvious, you'd be asking them not to be themselves but to be more "trans" which creates the issue of making their sexual or gender identity their main attribute.

Like I said, it's more inclusive than an outright celebration of trans people. It's a celebration of modern Thai culture, which includes their queer scene.

For example? Writing a better lyric, that actually dwells into this topic.

I mean, she tried it with this: "Teach me Japanese, Hai, Hai." part. I don't think people would hate her if she writes a lyric about racism for real, not just include one line that 90% of people would never notice anyway.

The same could've been done with the LGBTQ+ representation. I'm a writer, I wrote many songs, but I'm sure you know this as well that you don't need to push hard to do something right. I mentioned a couple of songs in my first post with lyrics that has this topic.

But watch Mamamoo's HIP, that song was about haters, the Kpop industry, strong women, you can see scenes with protesting about Global Warming etc. I'm 1000% Lisa could've done that too, but she chose to make another "hit" rather than something important!

This is why I said, Lisa's MV, FOR ME at least, is not real representation, inclusion, sure, but not representation.

Honestly, Lisa is technically a rapper, no? For rappers this is so much easier to write lyrics about these things, than a vocalist, but her MV was all bout being cool and the lyrics were about money and fame.

Quote from someone00

David, you are so dumb. Maybe I'm here bc i saw Lisa's name in the title, but I must be seeing things and I actually answered seriously your question in my first post

In your first comment, you called me a hater, basically!

I can't take your opinion seriously if you start it with that. My comment was an overall opinion about representation, I just used Lisa as an example because her MV is the latest one that FOR ME it's not obviously a real representation, more like INCLUSION!

Quote from someone00

I'm sorry for calling you what you are.

You can't take it bc it's not what you want to read. Who agreed with you here in the posts? Nobody. That's your answer.

Thai people felt represented! Lisa's LGBTQIA+ fans felt represented, who are you to dismiss it bc you think otherwise? Yeah, nobody.

See? This is the problem with you. I didn't create this thread, because I want to see people agreeing with me. I'm not a dumb kid.

You have zero arguments, simple as that. You can call me a hater all day, even in your dream, I don't care. It just makes your whole comment ridiculous.