Does Your First World Country Have This Problems?

    • Best Answer

    The terms 1st world and 3rd world country lost their original meaning after cold war. It's just pejoratives at this point. I get what people mean when they use them, but we should stop using them.


    Developed x developing would be better. USSR was second world. However, after the fall, Russia would fit developing better IMO. Still developed x developing aren't quite right as there are degrees inside it as well. Some unique problems are very hard to classify.


    All problems listed are present in some developed countries. USA, UK, SK, Japan all face homelessness problem. Inequality may be worse in some of developed countries than some developing countries. Corruption is the norm in most places developed or not. The lack of strong institutions to counterbalance corruption is more of a problem.


    Each of the problems listed may be different if we make comparison between developed x developing.


    Homelessness: in USA cities are getting crowded by tent and trailer cities. In Nigeria it would be shanty towns with hundreds of thousands to millions and even in these conditions there are people who can't even afford living in there.


    Usually "unique" problems "3rd world" countries face:

    - Weak public institutions to total absence of them, so they offer very basic services poorly if at all

    - Internal conflict that can range from criminal organizations having more power in some areas to civil war

    - Lack of basic infrastructure like roads, sanitation, and electricity

    - Poor education. Some just don't have enough university/post secondary education output while others have complete lack of primary schools


    Comparing USA, Brazil, and Burkina Faso in terms of institutions for instance:

    All these countries are corrupt as fuck, I can't even ranking them (and I don't like the corruption index way of ranking) as they sux in so many different ways. However, at least Americans have stable institutions. As much they don't trust their government, they'd use their justice system to solve problems if they have the resources. In Brazil, institutions aren't as stable and trustworthy. Some regions may bypass them completely and use alternatives. Burkina Faso has a proper government only recently, before that was anything goes there.


    While rich nations like USA face many challenges like listed in OP, they have the tools to fix them. Countries like Brazil need to improve their tools first. Countries like Burkina Faso have no tools to even try to fix their problems yet (hopefully their government is stable enough to get there).

    Quote from minigee

    Is not just about tools, is about the people's mentality too, and I bet that in the next century(is) or so, sadly, nothing will really change

    I think for Brazil in specific it's more than just mentality as well. Not sure what is really needed to make Brazil move forward past the "Land of Future". Reasons for why are plenty, but real solutions are very little.


    Still sharpening its institutions is a necessary path no nation can skip whether a change of mentality is needed or something else is needed.

    Quote from sleeplessnights

    Still sharpening its institutions is a necessary path no nation can skip whether a change of mentality is needed or something else is needed.

    Hm, you don't get the point, but ok, you're prob from other country.


    Like, most of our society is messed, with inefficient laws and institutions, laziness is something considered "acceptable" (kind of hard to explain), outsmarting someone (even if you f that person up) to get any kind of advantage is also "acceptable", we think of ourselves first rather than our peers, etc.


    So its not just about better institutions, its been 500 years like this, unless we all die and are reborn again with a different culture, we will never change.

    Quote from minigee

    Hm, you don't get the point, but ok, you're prob from other country.


    Like, most of our society is messed, with inefficient laws and institutions, laziness is something considered "acceptable" (kind of hard to explain), outsmarting someone (even if you f that person up) to get any kind of advantage is also "acceptable", we think of ourselves first rather than our peers, etc.


    So its not just about better institutions, its been 500 years like this, unless we all die and are reborn again with a different culture, we will never change.

    I understand I can't get 100% of it although outsiders can give a different prospective. I do have relatives there although I may only relatively know about Sao Paulo than the whole Brazil. One can still make a basic analysis of geopolitical situations with basics instead of such specificity.


    I do know about Brazilian "cordiality" culture and the view of Brazil being the "land of future", but never getting there because how corrupt and prone to "malandro" acts the core of the Brazilian identity is. From bribing police officers with beer or whatever small amount to look the other way, to buying off licenses and inspectors, from the "flanelinhas" to the president. To the lack of safety to even wear something remotely with brand name. Basically the "Brazil cost" to do anything relevant.


    I'd not go as far as saying Brazilians need to reborn in a different culture. In different times in Brazilian history they had decent times (at least in comparison to other nations at the time) and some opportunities could have arise from these moments. Now you can fault your own culture from not capitalizing on these moments.


    However, what I mean by not skipping having strong institutions wasn't saying it as a solution. I meant as something a nation aspiring to get better cannot skip no matter their previous situations and challenges they need to face. Whatever Brazil or any nation need to do to improve their standings, they need strong institutions.


    We can argue very specificity and idiosyncrasies of each nation are in their own situations. Still what we are arguing here is about very generalist terms of "1st" x "3rd". One of the basic differences between the two is strong institutions. I'm not discussing why some got it or not or even how to get there. Obviously each case is unique even if you can group some together (like Asian tigers, Southeast Asia, Chile and Uruguay, and so on). I'm only saying a nation needs strong institutions independent of their particular situations. In a simplistic manner, Brazil needs to improve their institutional tools. They have a basic tool kit compared to Burkina Faso. How to get to improve it and if it's possible are another wall of text.

    Quote from sleeplessnights

    I do know about Brazilian "cordiality" culture and the view of Brazil being the "land of future", but never getting there because how corrupt and prone to "malandro" acts the core of the Brazilian identity is. From bribing police officers with beer or whatever small amount to look the other way, to buying off licenses and inspectors, from the "flanelinhas" to the president. To the lack of safety to even wear something remotely with brand name. Basically the "Brazil cost" to do anything relevant.

    Ok, you do have alot of faith in us (for some reason), but as you said you didn't lived here, so you don't understand that we are in a point of no return, even if you try to put on a super simplistic look that we need "strong institutions", you are partially correct, we could have de strongest and best institutions in the world, but, if the people that are running them, are the same ones that you just described in this paragraph, would the whole country change just because of said institutions? Or it would be the same thing, but now sugar coated?

    Quote from minigee

    Ok, you do have alot of faith in us (for some reason), but as you said you didn't lived here, so you don't understand that we are in a point of no return, even if you try to put on a super simplistic look that we need "strong institutions", you are partially correct, we could have de strongest and best institutions in the world, but, if the people that are running them, are the same ones that you just described in this paragraph, would the whole country change just because of said institutions? Or it would be the same thing, but now sugar coated?

    Dunno why are you saying I'm sugarcoating it. It's no small task to get to strong institutions. There is no formula for that. Obviously Brazil didn't find its way to get to strong institutions and like you said a total cultural change may be the only way if at all. Making the elite who controls the show to change is obviously a challenge anywhere in the world.


    Still we are talking about generalized terms. It's not sugarcoating. Sugarcoating would be saying anyone can do it when obviously not. Some nations may never get there. I just listed the most basic reasons why poor countries are poor. The basics of strong nations would be the reverse:

    - Strong institutions

    - Strong education

    - Decent infrastructure

    - Minimal or no internal conflicts


    I don't think a nation can skip of any of these completely.

    No, I didn't said you were sugarcoating, what I meant was that our country would still be same, but now, if we do got better institutions, we would be under a different banner, but things would still be the same as before, is like painting a white egg with blue, its still an egg, even tho its blue on the outside

    Quote from minigee

    No, I didn't said you were sugarcoating, what I meant was that our country would still be same, but now, if we do got better institutions, we would be under a different banner, but things would still be the same as before, is like painting a white egg with blue, its still an egg, even tho its blue on the outside

    Oh Ok. I agree just strong institutions aren't enough as I only used it as an instance. At very basic a nation needs these 4 factors at decent level to be considered developed. I'm being very simplistic for brevity's sake as well. There are other factors with different level of importance, but I think these 4 are the very basic. Lack of any of these four, I'd challenge the status of developed nation. Brazil sadly has only one factor at decent level (minimal internal conflict). Pretty hard to get the other three with the current situation in Brazil.


    Still I try to be positive. Africa always get shit on, but there are nations like Rwanda It's not all flowers there, but considering their past situation, I think it is a remarkable turn around. And Rwanda isn't alone there.

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