Posts by Beesknees

    Lsfm and I’ve!

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    Christ it really has been a slow year for kpop groups. :pepe-cross:

    So you are being deliberately obtuse.

    BLACKPINK had nothing to do with K-Pop acts going to festivals.


    I should know.


    I saw K-Pop acts at festivals before BLACKPINK ever attended one. Yes, it was a natural progression. If BP never existed, we would've seen groups attending bigger and bigger festivals.

    Are you being deliberately obtuse at this point :pepe-cross:


    I also saw kpop idols on variety before SNSD. I saw girl group concepts.


    Natural progression if it’s BP but innovative/popularising if it’s SNSD :pepe-joy:

    Hybe acts would have done it anyways.


    But kpop would not have fancams if it wasn’t for SNSD right? You wouldn’t have girl groups on variety even though idols were hugely successful on them before SNSD? You wouldn’t have girl group concepts? Girl groups wouldn’t have photo cards either right? You wouldn’t have the kpop training system that SM came up with in the first gen? Funny how that works.


    None of these are things anyone would have thought of before SNSD for girl groups. But festivals? Obviously a natural progression. :pepe-cringe:


    BP are not original. They take parts from prior successful YG groups.

    I’ve made my intentions in the thread very clear. I can see the other user that was proclaiming SNSD as the most impactful GG in Japan has already disappeared as well.


    Way too many bad takes in this thread for it to go unchecked.


    In our last few back and forths you haven’t been able to stick to any of your arguments when challenged, and keep jumping to another one. Have you noticed that?


    But yes, keep thinking I’m some mad blink if that makes you feel superior in some way. I know that’s something you get off on :pepe-joy:

    So you’ve already gone from the absurd opinion that the kpop recruitment and training process of girl groups is down to SNSD to another point already.


    Labels have the most successful groups on their drawing board as inspiration? Colour me shocked.


    YG went with a 2NE1 replica instead of SNSD and ended up with a more successful girl group. Worked well I guess.

    Comments like this are the only reason I responded in the first place. I think you even surely know you’re conflating innovations SM bought to kpop during the 1st gen here with SNSD specific points. Recruitment? Training?


    If you want to talk about things naturally progressing and iterating as time goes on, SM using something that worked so well with their BG’s on their GG is one of the most obvious examples. Everyone knows SM pioneered the training and recruitment process in gen 1 and was heavily influenced by Jpop.

    It’s really not. The fact that EXO were seen as reviving the physicals market not so soon after says it all. The removal of TVXQ left a significant gap in the physicals market until EXO pulled through.


    Think what you want my guy. I look forward to your reply about how SNSD’s blueprint is a large part of Twice and their success.

    I’ve barely made mention of Blackpink in my points because I don’t really care about people’s thoughts on them. As much as you keep labelling a Blackpink fan I’m not. It’s the absurd points made in relation to SNSD that is making me post.


    It’s not about whether they ascend or not with no TVXQ. It’s about them selling as much as the biggest boy group which is a commonly used argument. TVXQ, the group with the biggest fandom and sales in kpop at the time, was essentially removed from the equation just after they released their biggest song. People would not have cared as much about the fight between SNSD and SuJu fans back then if it wasn’t for the number one spot being vacated. The argument that SNSD sell as much as the biggest boy group is only a thing because of an incredibly anomalous event.


    I also haven’t mentioned how much SM picked up and ran with from Jpop

    Pray tell, how is the model the same? Look at the critical success factors for SNSD versus Twice and tell me how similar they are.


    You’d think no one in South Korea ever liked or listened to girl groups before SNSD. Never bought albums. Never saw them on variety.


    SNSD might have one of the first fancams but they were popularised by Hani. Even with video content more broadly Wonder Girls with Tell Me had a bigger impact.


    Add some context behind building a loyal fandom because on its own it means nothing. There are so many girl groups after SNSD that had no success building a fandom despite having a blueprint. SM couldn’t even do it well for some of their own gg’s despite having that supposed blueprint. The only reason SNSD were even competing with the top boy group of that era is because TVXQ essentially died a death after Mirotic was released with the court case. So the 2nd gen lost their biggest boy group fandom.


    Photo cards is already something SM were doing with their BGs. Same with variety. Half of your argument essentially hinges on something SM were already doing and as the biggest label at the time with the biggest connections they could also do it with their girl group.


    For someone that seems to reiterate doing it first for girl groups isn’t what’s most important it’s funny how most of your arguments tend to hinge on that.

    So outside of the number of members, what similarity is there between the two? What is the blueprint that JYPE followed? Twice are an anomaly on their own due to various factors, from JYPE’s positioning when they had their debut to the western market opening just as they had lost any momentum in South Korea. Outside of 9 members, what would be different?


    The most successful current girl groups do not closely follow the Twice or SNSD footprint.

    Anecdotal evidence and charts that show Kepler as the most popular girl group. Right.


    If they had opened the market up as you’re claiming, Twice just a few years later wouldn’t have had to reinvigorate it. That’s what I’m referring to when I say impact, not SNSD/Kara success in isolation

    There is no Twice conundrum.


    The main similarity between Twice and SNSD is nine members, and even then, there were plenty of large groups that failed before them. Twice reinvigorated the Japanese market because SNSD/Kara did not have a longer term impact on the market for girl groups. Twice sustained their success there with Japanese members which is again not a SNSD facet. Twice had success of the back of cute music which was bought back to the fore by Apink/Gfriend and again, its success is not something SNSD pioneered. Twice had nearly the opposite promo strategy when it came to promoting members and solo endeavours versus SNSD and that is again one of their main success factors as it allowed them to pump out lots of content in a short amount of time.


    The thing with Twice is nothing in terms of their identity other than Japanese members is common in successful subsequent girl groups. Large girl groups have largely been dead for years. Cute music has not been in for years. Every company now rushes to bring their idols brand deals and promote more individuality, the opposite to Twice. Groups are rarely looking to pump out 3/4 minis every year.

    You didn’t guess correctly

    Streaming means less if you can’t back it up with huge tours, but BTS and BP both do.


    You don’t think the eyes they brings on kpop helps other groups? The engagement they drive is huge. Reactions for example, which is now a pretty big thing with people with millions of subscribers, nearly always starts with BTS or BP when it comes to kpop because it drives views. That then pulls them into the genre more generally.