I'd never debut in a non big 4 company

No matter how hard u work or how good your music is you're never going to succeed in an industry like kpop. Cases like bts are rare that happen once in a blue moon.

i agree just look at ateez . they would be a top group if the debuted in big 4

What is “success” to you? Plenty outside big four make tons

Quote from Creamy Corn Covered DooDoo (152)

i agree just look at ateez . they would be a top group if the debuted in big 4

They were making so much noise and were actually contenders of 4th gen leaders.

Quote from Creamy Corn Covered DooDoo (152)

i agree just look at ateez . they would be a top group if the debuted in big 4

I don’t think so

What? 2nd gen was full of successful nonbig3 acts infinite, kara, t-ara, etc and lets remember bigbang is the group that made yg be part of big3

3rd gen also had successful nonbig4 like bts and seventeen, ggs just happened to be weaker in comparison to big3 ggs but 4th gen ggs are currently compesating the past gens, people are literally saying now that starship is big5 because they ive's massive success lol (ofc is bs but this was repeated many times in this forum)

I dont think you know what you're talking about. Kpop history is full of exceptions.

What do you mean by success? chartings? rankings? sales? all 3?

It's true that non-big3 takes alot longer to achieve those, or maybe even half. There are more failures than successful cases.