Posts by Jirachier
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BWL is also massive (pun not intended), but 2002 is about on the same level as it in terms of 2019 hits.
BWL is massive, top2 songs of 2019 as you said, but Spring Day and Dynamite are just beyond that level of hit. that's what is crazy in my mind. BTS is the only artist who has 2 hits of that level.
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It's BTS.
I think far too often people who don't follow charts just want a quick and easy answer to determine how big a song is so they just look at whether it went n1 or not, the truth of the matter is that neither of those two are the best criteria for that, peak position is relative to what other songs are currently on the chart and plenty of songs can get unlucky. also, ever since BTS has become huge they have been aiming for the global market so they drop their songs on a Friday and that makes it impossible to go n1 on their first week.
It's very difficult to compare songs from different eras, the best we can do is look at each song's Gaon streams/downloads/digital points and compare them to other songs from the same year and the better their position is relative to other songs from that year they bigger they are. And until a song leaves the chart we can't get a full picture of how big it was. This way you can take both peak numbers and longevity into consideration since the songs with high peaks will have an edge early on but it also lets songs with good longevity have a chance to surpass them.
ever since 2016 BTS has been releasing so many huge hits, there hasn't been a year since then without them releasing something that generates huge number on top of their album tracks also doing well. But to me what truly puts them at the top is the fact they've been able to release 2 absolutely gigantic hits in Spring Day and Dynamite, Spring Day was n3 on Gaon's Decade list and right now Dynamite is looking like an incredibly strong contender for top10(probably top5) for this decade, the song is so massive that there isn't even a debate as to whether other songs from 2020 are bigger than it, so for one group to have two songs of that caliber, that is legendary.
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I think BTS current offline touring power is above 4M attendance.
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Yeah the companies want it that way, and the saddest part is kpop fans play right into their hand.
Kpop companies want their brand to be the center of everything, that is the big companies love to pretend they have some sort of philosophy and lifestyle, so they make you interested in them, it's also why companies love to push the whole family agenda which is literally just there to try and convert as many fans of their groups into company stans because families support each other right ?
This is why I never understand it when fans of groups are fighting over which group is the face of a company, or when instead of comparing the stats of individual groups people focus way too much on overall company numbers which creates a certain competitive spirit in the fandom of groups under the companies and make them invested in the entire company.
At the end of the day this is all done to benefit the companies while being completely negative for the artists, the only time an artist benefit from it is when they debut so they get to gain company stans and when they become the senior group now they have to get their fans siphoned from them into whoever is the new rookie.
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bts's japanese physical sales ? of course they are fandom powered.
That is what I'm saying, I don't think physical sales are representative of GP support in japan when it comes to these groups(including BTS). but as I said, if you want to use physicals here I'm totally fine with it, we can compare Snow Man's album from October vs BTS's album in less than two weeks and see how they do.
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I do think the japanese market is more focused on physicals, but they're not always representative of GP appeal, a lot of it has to do with how big your fandom is.
Having said that, if you want to use physicals as the metric I have no problem, just as long the numbers are contextualized.
When I was talking about BTS's music being more popular in japan I'm referring to right now, after they blew up with Dynamite and now Butter.
So we can't use the sales figures of 2019 for Lights/BWL, BTS's first japanese physical release since Dynamite is gonna drop on the 16th and it will be a japanese album(as you know are harder to sell compared to singles). BTS sold 700k with their MOTS Journey album last year and that was before Dynamite.
When the album drops then you can use its numbers, not 2019 ones.
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Nah, Cinderella Girl, the debut song of kinpuri is the most important idol song of the last 10 years in Japan, and that song is not on any streaming platform. In Japan, streaming is something for teenagers, and I say it again, the average age in Japan is over 40, and people over 30 don't stream a song all day
I repeat, Dynamite may be popular, but people don't know who BTS is, and this list proves this, people don't know who is Jin or V.
This list just proves that BTS, and kpop in general, is still niche
You're basically saying the way Hot100 japan is meaningless and that they're just ranking songs based on random metric, same with Oricon.
If you don't think streaming is the metric to use to judge whose music is popular then what is left ? digital downloads ? physicals sales ? as I said BTS wouldn't lose there either. so I'm not really sure how you're getting to this conclusion.
And again, I have never said people knew BTS members or that BTS overall as entertainers are more known than these jpop groups. I'm only talking about the music side of things. if BTS drops music more japanese people will check it out compared to if the jpop groups drop a song. that is my only point.
They might know the jpop groups more from tv shows or other places, but they don't listen to their music(and I'm only talking about present day, not whether these idols used to have hits a long time ago).
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Unfortunately, things cannot be separated, since an idol is not just a singer (at least in Japan, the country where the term was born)
But the BTS thing is because of the fandom, no GP, also people may know a song of them, but they don't know who is the group. Also BTS music has no more recognition than Kinpuri, Kanjani or Snow Man, think that the music of these groups is not even on streaming platform, and even so they manage to exist, Kinpuri debut single has been in the oricon top 100 for 3 years ...
My argument is this, if someone asks you who are the most well known kpop groups right now you'll probably name BTS, BP, TWICE right ? and when you were thinking about the answer you were basing it on how well they perform on music platforms.
And while you are right that in Japan being an idol goes beyond just doing music, a lot of people in this thread might not think of that and just view these results as determining the groups whose music the GP likes the most. So I'm just trying to tell people to not read this survey and try to use it that way.
You mentioned that they don't have their songs on streaming platforms which goes further to prove that people are not listening to their music if it's not even available.
And BTS music is definitely popular with the GP, just look at their numbers on streaming platforms ever since Dynamite and also digital downloads, Butter even doubled the previous record of most streams in a week.
And BTS isn't losing in physical sales.
Again, my point is this survey does not tell you anything about who are the most popular MUSIC groups, it's just about who people might know as entertainers overall.
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but if they are super popular, remember that in Japan idols are not just musicians, they are also actors, news presenters, sports reporters, acrobats, etc etc, all that influences, being an idol in Japan is an entertainment package. It's different from kpop, where it's practically just about music
obviously there are still "niche" acts on the list, like Kpop groups, JO1 and even SixTONES. But at least I think there are no great discussions within the top 10
Kpop fans are not necessarily aware of the things you just described, and will assume this list is representative of who are the biggest groups in japan musically, not as entertainers.
That is what I'm trying to argue here, the jpop groups do have higher public recognition as people in the entertainment business but out of the BGs on that list BTS is the one with the highest public interest in MUSIC(yes I know, the other groups are more known by face/name overall).
This would be like if BTS decided to go into acting in Korea, and then you polled korean on the actors with the highest public recognition and interest and they picked BTS as their n1. It would be misleading for people who don't have context and will think BTS are actually the most popular actors in Korea when in reality people are picking BTS as their n1 based on BTS's work in a completely different field.
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remember this is about "GP", not fandom, the gp includes from 12 year old boys, to 50/60 year old men, and in Japan the average age is over 40 years. The list makes sense to me
But that's my point, it is about GP.
and if someone reads through the survey they might get the misconception that these groups are CURRENTLY super popular with the GP of Japan with their music, since they are music groups. And I'm trying to point out that is not the case.
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remember that popularity in Japan is not just about hits in the charts. The best example is TOKIO, their last release was 4 years ago, and despite that they are still very relevant within the GP
But that's what people are gonna take from this survey when they look at the numbers.
So I had to explain that people should not take these numbers at face value if we're talking about popularity as artists right now.
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This survey isn't a good measure of what is currently popular.It's one thing if people were answering just who they recognize, but when you also ask them if they're interested in these groups right now and you see how the responses are all around 70% it clearly shows this doesn't measure the true popularity of groups right now.
All of these jpop groups are relying on their fandom to sustain themselves right now, without any hits on the charts since forever, so maybe people are just misunderstanding the second question, I don't know.
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That's too broad of a question.
Companies are supposed to promote their artists, that's why they signed to them after all.
But it depends on how you go about it, don't manufacture news about them, don't make statements where you're intentionally leaving out certain information/context to lead people to believe something you know isn't true.
As for getting spots on variety shows, YE performances, etc take what you should be getting at your current level instead of using industry connection to get more than even established acts who might have less backing.
I would also say that fans of groups who have more had an easier start thanks to their company should not be getting mad when people point out the advantages they've had because it's just the truth. Imagine you had person A and person B doing a 1 kilometer run, but person B gets a 500m headstart, and they both arrived finished the race at the same time. Should we praise them equally ? Is it fair to person A to not bring up the fact person B had a huge headstart ?
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lower downloads = lower revenue = lower points
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