Posts by perrotusa

Quote from MassiveKpopFan

How is it manipulation if the rules are so easily figured out that multiple prediction accounts exist that are fairly accurate?

Boosting the song to the top by using multiple accounts to buy it even though the numbers in every other category is plumeting is a sort of manipulation, dont try to play dumb pls.

Quote from worldlove27

What is stopping her fans from buying though?

Dua fans did fandom buying for levitating to try to get it to #1 (were unsuccessful cause they didn't know the rules).

Its not like army buying Butter means Olivia's fans can't buy her song.

unlike playlisting and radio which are totally out of listeners control and is determined by the industry.

Whats stopping them from buying her song is the fact that no one does this anymore except fandoms that want to push a song to the top. I hold my point that Billboard should reform its way of counting points and hold less value to sales as they can be easily manipulated and are not used anymore.

Anyways im tired of arguing so i'll stop there

Quote from MassiveKpopFan

BTS doesn't use bundles, which was the cause of the biggest reform that I can remember that BB has done. ARMYs know the rules and play by them, people are mad that we know how to do it effectively.

I mean yeah it works but its kind of unfair but whatever lol, if i were an Olivia stan i'd be mad pissed but im not.

For me, its sort of a chart manipulation even though its by the rules so yeah whatever floats your boat i guess

Quote from atropos

msg already 60M points. No way it's doing below 30M next week.

the first song is holding up good but the 2nd is falling down quickly, will be out of top 5 very soon.

Also im anticipating how Twice ost will do, i wasn't expecting great numbers but with the covid case rising and the show getting their highest ratings+ that one ost being stable in top 10, i think it can do decently.

Quote from itiswhatitisss

https://xn--o39an51b2re.com/gaon/monthlyjisu/2021/06

Isnt the gaon sotm tracking the first 5 weeks?

The gap is very close and BG still has 2 weeks of tracking vs one for Twice so BG will win.

Quote from itiswhatitisss

Alcohol Free: 75,976,973

Chi Mat Ba Ram: 75,577,049

Chi mat Ba ram was released one week later...

Quote from itiswhatitisss

Looks like TWICE are snatching song of the month for June!

What about Brave Girls?

Quote from itiswhatitisss

So.....COVID-19 cases are rising in Korea. There are also new measures being introduced(bars being closed, facilities only open until 10pm, etc). Expect a massive decrease in ULs and points soon, I doubt the #1 song this year will pull 1B points by the end of the year either. /:

Osts will rise and fun songs will fall too

I also saw that Dream was supposed to have a face to face concert in Seoul, not sure if i'll happen

Quote from onlyfacts

I see that you ignored my comment because my reply doesn't fit your narrative and you don't have anything to reply to it.

Let me reiterate it then HOT 100 just like other digital charts around the world in based on amount of money earned and not popularity. It's just that people haven't understood the concept over the years and assumed it represents popularity.

Just so you know non fans do not follow charts. They follow playlists and trending pages. Only active music listeners like us follow charts.

About that Kang Daniel situation, I saw many scrutinise him but I personally didn't do so. Because I felt it was impressive thing done by his fans. I didn't even know his song existed and after that I listened to it. Great fucking strategy. More exposure to him the better.

And that is because I think that a digital point is a digital point. It doesn't matter if it is coming from a fan or non fan. I don't put non fans on pedestal of "GP" like other kpop fans. "GP" are those 40m people in Korea who are not using any digital services. Others are either fans or casual fans or non fans. Simple.

Like I have been saying since the beginning here almost all charts are based the amount of money earned and not popularity. It is not that difficult to comprehend that popularity cannot be measured. It can just be debated. Peace.

PS : I can make G4U look very smaller than Butter. You want to see it.

Butter sales are 10 times that of G4U.

G4U streams are only 3 times that of Butter.

This is the thing about stats. We see what we want to see.

Adding to this I want to tell you not to fall for western fan's narrative that sales are non existent just because they are not selling it. 100k sales are equivalent to 150m streams. You know what is the peak of streams ever 93m for WAP. 2nd highest is around 75m. While there have been multiple instances of 100k sales. Controversial but people from the west always try to brainwash eastern people into thinking what they are doing is wrong. It has been going on since the long time.

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Honestly, i ignored you first reply and this one too cause i dont get what you mean at all. What you're saying makes sense but i dont understand how it should convince me that the fact butter is only at n.1 due to sales wont create a reform. Also english isnt my first language and there's a lot of words you use that i dont understand like 'scrutinize"

Quote from MassiveKpopFan

What matters is the money the song makes; you can complain that the more popular song isn't #1, but people putting money where their mouth is and spending it on an artist was the original way of supporting them.

Streaming dominates, but Billboard is the organization that puts more weight on paid downloads and physical copies of the song. That's final, cause if you're not a Billboard analyst, your opinion has no bearing.

You dont have to be a Billboard analyst to be allowed to express your opinion and using that as an excuse to try and deny my point is kind of low...

At the end of the day, yes Butter is still #1, but I still think that the mass buying leading it to be at the top is a form of chart manipulation that shouldnt be allowed, the same way that people complaing about trot or bg fans mass downloading on gaon, which is why i think a reform on both platforms should be good and make the charting more accurate.

Quote from itiswhatitisss

Keep it civil y'all, we don't want this thread getting closed too.

I think we're keeping it civil honestly, we're not insulting each other and just talking about the numbers without using mean terms etc.

The only times this thread gets derailled is when me or other onces argue with ill pray 4 u but it seems like he left

Quote from MassiveKpopFan

South Korea has a population 1/6th the size of the US, that makes a huge difference.

The Hot 100 stopped being reliable once bundles took over a few years back, and now with the recurrence rules, it's even less transparent now. ARMYs are not buying with VPNs; we US ARMYs discouraged that since BTS started promoting here.

And you didn't refute my point about the song being "inorganic", that word has no real meaning. It's just a lame drag to make fans feel bad about supporting a song.

Also, no ARMY is claiming Butter is more "popular" than good4u, which is subjective anyway (I doubt most Americans have heard either song, and if they did, can remember enough to sing a part). I have not seen that, so don't make claims you can't back up.

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Proportions exist, even if South Korea is 1/6th smaller than the U.S, the proportion of people who are ready to mass buy/download remains the same.

Also I'm pretty sure bundles aren't counted since around October or so.

Also i never said that armys were using vpn, im just saying that the gap between their sales and their streams is too big for it not to be mass buying. Usually, when you buy a song, its in order to listen to it, right?

However, the gap between their sales and streams is so big that it can only mean that a person buys the song with multiple accounts and cant stream it at the same time with all their accounts.

I called Butter "inorganic" because the term, even tho its only used as a drag, applies for this situation. In an era where streaming dominates and no one really buys song anymore, a song being able to top a chart for 6 weeks solely due to buying and not streaming is called an inorganic perfomance, and thats final.

Quote from jenniesbtch

So much anger in the other thread and for what, is it really that deep?

We should be looking at numbers for fun, not to have a fit if someone gets something wrong.

which thread?

Quote from MassiveKpopFan

Literally nothing is "organic" unless a song goes viral, something like Harlem Shake or Gangnam Style.

Top acts are signed to huge labels which means that they'll have radio promo/payola, award show performances, feature collabs (some in other languages), streaming service playlisting, etc.

Some acts (like BTS, Taylor, Gaga, etc.) have huge fandoms which also put in the necessary legwork.

"Organic" doesn't mean shit, it just means that YOU aren't listening to it. The entire population of a given country is not listening to songs on the main singles chart, only a very small proportion.

Take the US Spotify chart, where good4u is #1 and has 1.8 streams. Out of a population of 331M+, that's .545% (slightly more than 1/200th) of the US population. That's not popular by any stretch of the imagination.

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The hot 100 is a chart that is supposed to represent what song is the most popular in the country of the chart right now.

A non fan would assume that Butter is the most popular song in the US right now as it topped the chart for 6 consecutive weeks, however, the song is not even on the top 30 of streaming. Meaning that the only reason its at the top is because their fans buy the song with multiple accounts.

I dont get why you guys are so stubborn to admit it, you all say the same thing about Kang Daniel or BG's topping Gaon or getting high numbers due to downloads except its the exact same case here.

Butter topping the chart for 6 weeks is no different than Lim young-woon or Kang Daniel topping Gaon cause of high downloads, except you guys dont want to admit it.

Quote from thirstaer

western stans and kpoppies alike still pressed. lol.

i don't mind it if it changes. bb hot 100 is sales(phys+digital)+streaming+radio anyways so a change is also interesting.

Quote from onlyfacts

Nope. See Billboard singles charts just like GAON digital charts show which song earned the most money for the said week. GAON themselves admitted that. Idk if Billboard have or not.

Billboard chart is already not something to trust for having radio as one of the parameters which can be easily manipulated. Also not a good parameter to use becauae they take into account all of its total impressions for each week rather than the impressions got during the said week. If a song has only gained 7m impressions this week and has 70m total they will take 70m into consideration for the Billboard weekly singles chart. Then if it gets 6m for the next week then they will not take 6m but 76m. How is that fair?

Billboard know that their chart is not right and can be easily manipulated. Removing sales will be dumb because they earn the most money. You earn as much money from 100k digital sales that you do for 150m streams. 100k sales are easier than 150m streams.

You make sense but at the same time sales are easily manipulated too, we all know armys use multiple accounts to buy Butter, otherwise the gap between sales and streaming would be way smaller.

The point still holds that Butter is a inorganic n.1 and is definitely not popular in the US as its not even in the top 30 of streaming

Quote from smileflowers

guess onces will be happy lol

i don't have any thoughts about this breakup but i did like jihyo and daniel as a couple so i was a little bummed about that one.

seems like onces on tw don't want any of them to date at all though and if they do it HAS to be another female.

Heechul was used quite a lot to drag Momo so yea

Quote from Tic_tac_toe

Wait isn’t this old news

But do I feel like I’ve heard it before

Nop its not old

Tho i've heard some rumours saying heechul is the gayest straight guy ever and its an inside joke in the fandom that Momo is gay asf so there was a theory that it was an arranged couple to hide their gayness. Made me laugh not gonna lie

Ahhh cant say im not happy

Quote from thirstaer

western stans and kpoppies alike still pressed. lol.

i don't mind it if it changes. bb hot 100 is sales(phys+digital)+streaming+radio anyways so a change is also interesting.

Now trust me i am anything but pressed, i just find it funny that by mass buying Butter in order for it to be n.1 on the hot 100, armies may be shooting themselves in the foot and create a reform that will make it way harder for BTS to stay atop of the hot 100 for 3+ weeks.

And dont hit me with the "but their radio number is low", the streaming numbers show that no one is listening to it, hence why no one wants it to play on the radio.

I dont think so honestly, I dont enjoy performing so being a kpop idol definetly isnt for me.

Tho i can rap pretty well and seeing these kpop "raps" make my heart ache sometimes... kpop definetly needs better rappers and needs to stop calling speaking faster than the usual rythm of the song "raps".

This could possibly create a reform, especially if the same happens for PTD