Posts by samtanvan

Quote from Alex_Murphy

To be honest, they still have a long way to go. A few lyrics credits is a good start but there's nothing groundbreaking. Lots of gg members have some lyrics credits here and there. But composition or production credits? Now that's another story.

Agreed. I love the girls but this isn’t anything big as the OP makes it seem. YG seems to give more freedom to their artists. Whether the girls write or not it shouldn’t matter for the most part because they don’t have to, they’re idols not producers. The issue usually rises when people say Lisa/Jennie are idol rappers not “real rappers”. Of which i agree, nor do I understand why blinks get mad about it because there’s nothing wrong with being an idol rapper.

Quote from leni17

I'm not a child, why would I lie. Okay, let me explain it to you, but know that english isn't my first language, and I'm not super fluent. Here is the thing: all German soliders fought for Germany, which was a nazi state. All of them. Germany has taken full responsibility for what they did, look up Willy Brandt. There is no such thing as no nazi, less of a nazi etc when you work for that state, and fight for their cause. That case is closed, over and done with. Please don't say such things, it's just wrong and rude. This is a sensitive topic for historians, and us europeans. The proces in Nürnberg was done fast, to punish the ones in charge, it's imposible to punish all of them, that never happens. My country was at war in the 90's, hardly anyone was punished for all the evil that was done, that's just how it is, we still live with the same people who tortured us in camps, and killed thousands of civilians.

As for Sowon, or whatever, I don't know her before this, she may just be dumb, I can see that. My issue is with fans treating such a delicate topic like it's nothing, just to shield their fave from backlash. I was to harsh too you, and I would like to apologize for that, I'm just so done with kpopies and this topic.

I completely agree with you in that Germany took full responsibility, because they should. Along with countries like Austria as well (side note: interestingly their ult right party has recently tried to push their evil past and present anti-semitism on Muslims, who at the time were praised for going above and beyond to “rescue” jews and some were also victims of camps, primarily Auschwitz). But it is highly incorrect to say every German should be held responsible for the Holocaust. I doubt their is a single historian that will say all german soldiers were Nazis, simply because that is highly untrue, if that was the case, the death toll would’ve been significantly higher because their would’ve been more manpower. The series of events that took place would also contradict the whole every Soldier= Nazi, because it makes no sense that troops of the Wehrmecht would fight the Nazis alongside American troops.

Also like to point out that, indeed that the Wehrmacht did play a role in the Holocaust but not in the sense that many Americans were incorrectly taught. Approximately 19ish million men served in the German military from 1935-1945, The SS had approximately 800,000 active personal by 1944 of which some weren’t even radicalized or you could say “forced Nazis”. Some were indeed radicalized but many were prisoners of war and came from countries invaded by the Nazis and were forcefully conscripted. Not to excuse them of their actions, they deserve punishment.

Though I am indeed a kpop fan, I really have no idea who Sowon is but the whole calling her a Nazi and proclaiming the mannequin is a Nazi is what took me for a loop.

Quote from jenniesbtch

You realize people are calling it a Nazi Mannequin because of the Nazi symbol on the hat.

Like I’ve said before, Swastika isn’t exclusive to the Nazi. It was a symbol in the German Military before Nazis existed. Typically Nazis, wore the huge swastika on their shoulder. Off topic, but the swastika was originally a symbol of peace from Hinduism/Buddhism, that’s probably where the Germans got it from before Nazis turned it into what most people associate it with now. Its common to see that symbol on Temples in India/Japan. Not that this has anything to do with the hat, this isn’t an excuse for Germans either just a side note.

Quote from yoshiworldhmm

there's a symbol on the hat...............

He is wearing the uniform of the Visor Corps in the German Military. The Swastika was a symbol of peace before the Nazi colonized it, it was on all visor corps hats whether they were Nazis or not. It was worn before the Nazis even became a real group. The hat was also worn by the German soldiers that fought alongside Americans against the Nazis. A nazi would wear a large Swastika on their sleeve.

Quote from bartkun

geez please take a read, really just go and read multiple things...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waffen-SS

okw.jpg

What are you trying to say? That every German soldier was convicted at Nuremburg? I’ve stated before that some members of the Wehrmacht were indeed Nazis while some weren’t. Have you ever actually read about Nuremburg? Or are you gonna keep linking Wikipedia? I’m not here to defend Wehrmacht/Nazis/Sowon, this is simply me educating people on a common misconception that is usually held by westerners (specifically Americans from my experience). Our education system is very flawed here in America, not sure where you are from.

Quote from leni17

Thanks for enlightening us, I will now proceed to burn my history masters degree, can't belive I wasted five years of my life on it, all I had to do is to wait for some idol to mess up and log into stan twitter/forums. Do yourself a favor, and close this thread, you are way out of your depth here

Anyone can claim to have a degree on anything on the internet. I’ve respectfully stated my opinion on this issue. I’m not minimizing the Holocaust nor am I necessarily defending Sowon either. This is just an educational post for people who believe German Soldier = Nazi. You can take what you want from it but stating “I have a masters in history” and not coming with an actual argument is very childish for someone with a “masters in history”. 😶

Quote from bartkun

read about the trials in Nurnberg... all Wehrmacht officers, higher ups etc. were found guilty for crimes against humanity etc.

The one that only tried around 200 of the Nazi German officials?

Are you in the clouds?

Quote from NaomiBlue

The disconnect! between the reasonably stated comment and the clickbait title

😭😭 I’m not sure what I was thinking with the title, I’ve changed it now. My apologies, my head was elsewhere before I actually thought up the post.

Quote from melma

This is just semantics, Wehrmacht soldiers are still directly associated with nazi imagery even if they weren’t ss themselves. And once again you can and should talk about other issues but do it in a separate conversation and not just in reaction to Holocaust

Yet again many weren’t, Wehrmacht≠Nazi. This issue is too severe to claim Wehrmecht were Nazis. Some of their members were and many weren’t.

Before I start, I just wanna say that yes I did start this account because as a self-proclaimed history geek this was just too hard to watch. I just wanna say that in no way shape or form do I support the cruel genocide of the Jews that took place during WW2 conducted by the Nazis. I believe everyone should be aware of the Holocaust just as they should be aware of their own history.

BUT.... the issue regarding Sowon is a bit puzzling for me. Many claim that the soldier is a Nazi, but he is wearing a Wehrmacht uniform. That is the general uniform of the German military during WW2. German soldier ≠ Nazi, actually as an American I was never taught the difference in school not in my AP World History, American History, or European History classes so I understand that many westerners believe that SS(Nazis) = Wehrmacht (German Military) but nonetheless it’s simply not true. Many Wehrmecht were indeed Nazis but many weren’t.

Actually, there were dozens of attempts to assassinate Hitler of which nearly all came from the Wehrmecht, they also actually fought alongside Americans in France in 1945 against the Nazis to free French prisoners.

While that doesn’t mean the mannequin wasn’t a Nazi, it doesn’t mean he was a Nazi either. Especially with the severity of the controversy I think we should all try to educate each other and not be sheep running with everything we hear. People should verify what they hear especially if it’s this severe.

Quote from raizcharms

Lmao I kept telling people they wouldn’t care. People keep going off about “ nazis were siding with Japan in WWll!!!” So? That doesn’t mean they know anything about them beyond that lmao. They clearly do not and have no reason to. I wouldn’t know Jack shit about nazi Germany if the American school system didn’t teach it more than slavery as if it happened in our country.

I have to say, Im Somali, and we were colonized by the Italians who sided with the Nazis just as long as Japan did, and most Somalis probably have heard of the Holocaust but would have no idea what a damn swatzika is. I mean in America we’ve never been taught about the Congoloese Genocide were 15 million Congolese were either murdered or cannabilized by a damn white king (Leopold of Belgium).

Not to mention these dumb westerners don’t even know that the soldier in Sowon’s photo isn’t actually a Nazi, he was just a generic soldier, the uniform of the SS (Nazi part of the german military) was ALWAYS different. Therefore, it isn’t automatically a Nazi replica. These westerners are literally talking out of their a-hole.

Especially those who claim to be from a former nazi country, like shouldn’t you know the difference between the general uniform and the nazi one? Members if the general german military even planned to assassinate him but were caught and executed. They also fought alongside the Americans in WW2, so it’s quite disappointing.

EDIT: yes i did make an account for this because as a history geek this was hard to watch.