Posts by Kreatin

    Relevant for this thread and most work ive seen put into analysing song perfomances on this board in the last year or two



    made by wsoet

    Founded in 2010 by the Korea Music Content Association, the G‍aon Chart (now known as the C‍ircle Music Chart) is the premier source for tracking the digital performance of songs in South Korea. I've always been curious as to the most successful songs of all-time on the chart, but making this determination has always been difficult for a couple of reasons.

    ....

    i've been thinking about doing exactly this, but for melon uls of which we have reliable data since at least 2019 on guysome.


    There are a couple faults i see with this method tho, and i dont see a easy way to take account for it...


    In 2013 the first price hike came for downloads then it started to decline until it basically became void and mostly used by fandoms to help charting around 2018-2019.


    With the way you combine streams and downloads pre 2018 here it falls apart a little, because a download for gaon is worth much more for their scoring system than a stream is and the exact algorithm isnt known (their logic is the score should reflect the revenue of a song, which doesnt really make much sense when they use filtered streams aka uls and not actual unfiltered streams but, alas).


    They have also changed their algorithm for it at least once since they reimplemented it in 2018. They actually had a digital chart with digital point system years before 2018 as well, but it didnt work the same and none used it when streams and ul numbers were still directly available


    Another factor for digital points, that the normalization doesnt really take into account is that songs on average today stay much longer in top 100 then they did years ago and is bascially gone up year by year since 2019. This means news songs (especially if only looking at top 100) will acrue much more digital points over time.


    Looking at the top songs the vast majority are 2019 or later, and it has a couple of big omissions especially from 2015 and earlier when downloads ruled.


    I think there is no easy solution to combine pre 2018 data with post 2018 data. As such think it would be interesting to see one for all songs post 2018 without combining it with data before that that year into it, and maybe do some similiar normalization of average chart time to take that into account as well.


    Similar same could be done for downloads and streams pre 2018 (but probably best to keep them apart)


    But regardless it all makes for an intersting data point and great job!

    Bottom might get some "new" song, for top half i doubt it

    People may crucified me for this but to me iu seem very cunning and strategic (to not call her other words that will get me hate cjfkfk)


    Everything she does it's with a intention, that's why her career has last so long


    She always attached herself to a trend and we u aren't one, she doesn't use u


    She has no loyalty. She used and abandoned Suzy and also Luna of F(x) . She used to be a friend of an earlier member of Girl's Day, but after the latter left she never acknowledged that member, who is now said to be a trot singer. Bang Minah never forgot that and after Girls Day got bigger Minah had as little to do with Lee Jieun as possible and made the members do the same.

    Yes yes, you figured out IU is the most devious snake in korea, what an original idea, i've never heard that before, very clever of you. Now run along and take your mutual * over it to pms or create a separate thread for it.

    She (and the group) will get a lot of P.R. and also lots of hate.


    Nepo baby will be a thing.

    No doubt, but highly unlikely any of the negative makes it to the media/news articles, they will think more than once before they publish anything negative about someone connected like that. Her family tree is basically a bingo card of the most powerful persons in the country.

    Entertainment jobs have always been looked down upon by the rich, but theres been tiers to it (basically actors->artists->mcs->idols)


    With the success of kpop its status is slowly changing i guess.


    And while theres been a few rich or better off idols, theres never actually been someone from an actual real chaebol family, and i still find it hard to believe that first to enter the business will be someone that has direct ties to the most powerful of them all.

    Such a great, feelgood song! Also, it's a really bold move to make an MV like this. I don't think I've ever seen a Kpop artist or any musician release a music video with a 9:16 aspect ratio. Was there any? This feels more like a "performance" MV. After seeing this, I'm 100% sure she's going to release another MV, because this is obviously made for Tiktok and Insta.


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    Only one i can think of and not really kpop as such, but epik high - born hater (2014) music video.

    Not only is she clout chasing with the big artists in korea, now shes even colluding with tweety bird and looney tunes. She doesnt know when to stop it seems


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    pasted-from-clipboard.png

    B-sides historically was a term used for filler tracks and song that werent considered good enough for promotion or radio play. In the west the term b-side is not much used today, and when it is, its often for bonus tracks/material.


    I know its not the popular view on it, because most in kpop regard anything not marked as title track on an album as a b-side , whiched made more sense 10 years ago when pre-releases was not really a common thing in kpop and one single/title track promotion per album was the norm.


    From my point of view, the classification is entirely down to how labels promote the songs (= how big of an investment they put into it)


    If there at any point is a major investment into a single song, and here we are in most cases talking about hundreds of thousands of dollars just for the mvs alone, (and mvs are defintly promotions by themselves today) its not a b-side.


    In most cases id also consider any song that actually was a b-side at release, but is promoted actively by the label later on to become an a-side, it doesnt matter if it succeeds or not, the investment into it is the deciding factor.


    Exceptions i would make would be for songs that start being performed by demand (live perfomances etc) after they gained popularity, or their rise comes from factors that are not a direct result of the label actively promoting it (viral shorts etc)


    Are there songs that are hard to know how to classify because of it? Yea sure, but the vast majority of them are very easy to determine whetever its an a-side or b-side, especially when looking at the time of their release.

    I am actually confused about what knetz are finding so odd? It it because this group isn't making noise like ggs do when they chart? They aren't trending?Is it the age distribution where ppl in 40ties are listening more than teens? Which ngl is a bit weird. UL increase in weekend?

    AVvXsEjf4oPjxpbAy-6CdWTujb-h2SjzllyP1R-H8TTLRI6hzpWJOvwaEEewn8CKxvNPE_q0kIMiXHvqxMrGosp_QvJ4xPALSjxcc32VH53XeGK4rFk6csNa90ySbiiTWNyU0rtgqUM7_0l_akrrLgNog2Pt75KhlI-nJcvPPcGV_FYul6YDO_KZWFrKs7FumwMO=s16000

    Well their "proof" is that it was the only song that increased among all songs on the top 100 during some hours over the weeknd when everyone was watching the soccer game.


    As for the age distribution, thats a discrepency thats always been there for most idol groups since years back, and its always been assumed to be children/teenagers using their parents accounts which makes sense when its a service that costs money.

    looks like IU only has 1 more week of PAKs, she will lose #1 on YouTube by next Saturday.


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    I doubt it


    These are worldwide numbers and 50% of their views are ads,which are not counted for the charts. LWA has 0% ads.

    Super Lady - (G)I-dle - Music Video Details


    LWA is still #1 on south korea trending and according to kworb last update(sunday) gets around 150k more views per day and the youtube track chart is a combination of mv and audio on youtube music (and other unofficial sources tagged with the song)

    YouTube South Korea Daily Chart

    Speaking of demographics and the down turn in streams and uls over the last years


    Population pyramid of korea (from december 31, 2022)

    pasted-from-clipboard.png

    See that bump at the end of their twenties now. This was the group that was teenager/college students at the end of 2010's when we saw the highest uls/digital points. They are not getting replaced in nearly the same numbers and as they grow older their media consumption are likely going down because of life, work and other responsibilites that comes with it.

    Add on top of that, the new generations have grown up in a completly different landscape, with a much much bigger fragmentation on type of media and how it is consumed.


    Taking look at IUs latest release compared to 2021...


    IU Celebrity demo- first five days from release in 2021

    날짜순위이용자 수변화량남성여성10대20대30대40대50대60대
    202101271704,149-37.7%62.3%13%49%18%11%5%4%
    202101281680,057-24,09239.7%60.3%13%48%19%12%5%3%
    202101291632,174-47,88341%59%13%48%18%12%5%4%
    202101301599,989-32,18542%58%13%48%18%12%5%4%
    202101311636,006+36,01741.3%58.7%13%48%19%12%5%3%

    In 2021, the 20 bracket was the clear dominant group of her listeners followed 30, 40 then the 10s

    IU Love wins all demo- first five days from release 2024


    202401241313,020-35.2%64.8%6%37%30%16%8%3%
    202401251332,278+19,25835.7%64.3%6%35%30%18%8%3%
    202401261309,633-22,64537.2%62.8%6%34%29%19%8%4%
    202401271282,954-26,67938.2%61.8%6%34%29%19%8%4%
    202401281303,970+21,01637.2%62.8%5%34%30%19%8%4%


    Here we can so how everyting basically shifted bracket upwards. Less people in 10s, decreased in 20's, but increaess share in 30s,40s and even 50's.

    Can it be attributed to IU growing older her demographic simply following her along,with teens being less into IU (shes now 30 and havent really been active for the last couple of years with much that would be of an interest to young teens)


    Or is it more a trend of melons userloss mainly being teens and young adults in their 20s, thus naturally the share of the other brackets go up?


    Or does it reflect the population pyramid picture above? likely a combination of all three


    Looking at the data like this, i can see where the drop in listeners comes from. Its been on a steady decline ever since 2020 (and it all cant be explained by youtube taking market shares), and theres no regrowth from younger generations when their population pyramid is inverted as it is.


    The sudden drop in the middle of last year is a bit weird and sudden, but so is the drop in demographics around age 20 on the pyramid.

    Saw the usual sajeagi accusations floating around again on twitter, this time for TWS. Not surprised considering they're not a gg. But it did made me curious about what the actual reasons behind the song's performance are. The song does seem to have quite a few trending tiktok's from Korean students however their youtube vids are especially attracting a lot of attention. The mcountdown debut videos for it have gathered 1m+ views already. There's also a performance video that was released a week ago that already has more views than similar vids from their contemporaries. They're also rising quite a bit on the youtube daily charts. So it seems like another example to me of youtube success directly translation to success on Korean music services. And I imagine the SVT hoobae connection helps a bit as well

    I saw it as well and figured it was the usual drivel about any new act managing to chart in top 100. Funny as we talked about the old sajaegi accustions in this thread just some days ago.


    Their charting do look a bit odd, but its not like its impossible for a dedicated fandom, but having such a strong support from the gate?


    Looking at the demographics for the song on melon its pretty similiar compared to riize. Starts out with a big share in teen age group (alot higher than most "normal" top 10 songs today), and a 70%+ are female listeners, as they go up the chart its starts even out a bit and the % of teens share drops. I assume because they get more gps listeneing because of their higher chart positioning.


    For now, I think it might just be young teenagers who spread and grows it and it happens in circles and channels that none of the boomers posting the accusations even know exists and thats why they say they dont see or understand it becaues therse nothing viral about it according to them.

    Wut? Teddy created BB, 2NE1, and BP pretty much by himself. Also gave #1 hits including national hit Gashina to Sunmi, Lee Hi, and a couple others i cant remember. Made Somi literally the only female soloist in recent times with two top 10 hits in two years besides IU and Taeyeon.


    TBL dont have any other real acts, it's just a bunch of songwriters that perform once in awhile (Zion, Vince, Loren) but they do their own writing.


    Teddy is the greatest hitmaker in all of Kpop and its not that close. Outimpacted most local producers as well.

    Eh, teddy is for sure up there in the top no doubt, but he had nothing to do with creating bigbang.


    His real first involvment with a bigbang hit was with fantastic baby in 2012 and even that was not as the main producer, that wasnt until MADE in 2015. Bigbang was already at the top since 2007 with gdragon as producer for the biggest hits.


    2NE1 and BP was pretty much his from the start tho.

    The disappointing part about all this isnt that she chose Hyein or V for the MV for LWA.


    The disappointing part is that IU has so much clout, wouldnt it have been better for her to use that clout to help an up and coming nugu singer/idol? Like Hyein and V obviously dont need her clout. In fact, you could argue that IU is using them as mediaplay to help boost her sales/charting. It's like the rich are just getting richer, how about helping others climb up instead? :pepe-shrug:

    Im not sure where idea come from that IU have to be this saviour figure for small/indie artists? Why is that her responsibility? Especially when she basically already does more than most for young musicians..

    Like having her private Bunker studio open to use for free


    And Im sure you recognize all these names, since IU only works with the most popular idols:



    Can you guess what these big names that IU have collaborated with all have in common?

    Psy,GD,V,Suga,Zico, oh hyuk, sung si kyung, zion t, Gain ?