What's the end goal for JYPE pushing Twice west?

  • See my post on page one with regards to why I still follow the group. I want to see what their next evolution is as a group or individually.


    Western critical acclaim gets them what exactly though? When they eventually end up back in SK or Japan establishing careers what is that critical acclaim worth from a western website? If we're being matter of fact, for a group like Twice it means nowt. If JYPE put some media play out about it like other companies probably would have done, it would reach the members ears, the publics ears etc and might have some significance. But thats not the case, all it is currently is a number on a website for stans to use in fan wars. That's not worth wasting the twilight of their career as a group. They should have established the members when they had the best chance to.


    I'm sorry but you're overstating the importance of a Monday release. It's not even the start of the tracking week in SK to maximise first week charting. It's not even the day songs tend to maximise UL's. A Friday/weekend release is more difficult as less of the GP tune in on the weekend but every other weekday is no different. IU tends to release on Wednesdays. Brave Girls released on Thursday. Twice released on Wednesday.

    That question applies to every group. As I said before, JYPE's best shot is TWICE, a group nearing contracts renewals, have a huge international fandom to back them up. But that didn't stop them from pushing ITZY in the West as well. Bottom line is JYPE doesn't know how to manage their groups and that's it. They have no idea of what to do with TWICE from 2020 onwards and TWICE losing their stronghold in SK/Japan to newer groups/NiziU didn't help.


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    Momo also talked about this on Bubble. Nayeon also did in her Elle Korea interview. News of this type reaches the members ears by itself. I mean the group is releasing an album on Friday, a first in their career, do you really think they would go ahead with it and give it no second thought? They obviously have a goal in mind when they decide to release on Friday. There was even a video of what Korean think about this achievement and all of them were positive towards this.


    You are now saying they should have established the members individually and I agree with this. But, was this mentioned in the OP or I magically missed it?


    I'm not overstating, it's just the truth. Monday releases do favour Korean charts. You keep bringing up IU when it's clear that TWICE can't be compared to her. BG released on Thursday, yes but then their new song was a Monday release. RV, Aespa, OMG, SKZ, Somi etc like literally every artist releases on Monday. It might not be that important and it wasn't even my main point but it matters.

  • JYPE is seemingly not doing any of that. The song isn't from any western producer, RR is likely not going to push it at all, they wont be getting any playlist again, which is almost entirely instrumental to debuting on BB charts and likely once again no radio play.


    I mean the song already sounds nothing like what people in the west listen too, so far no promo is announced, they already fucked several things up such as the wrong date, leaking part of the song, not paying for the site rental, site already having trouble delivering orders, etc, etc.

    Something is definitely wrong with the marketing part of JYPE. These people on the first look, just do not seem to be able to make the correct decisions for the most part.

    :wellr::wellr::wellr:

  • Something is definitely wrong with the marketing part of JYPE. These people on the first look, just do not seem to be able to make the correct decisions for the most part.

    :wellr::wellr::wellr:

    From what I understand JYPE has lower avg staff numbers than a lot of its competitors, lower pay and more difficult working conditions and even in the division system some staff is shared between the company afaik such as social media managers.


    So JYPE cut cost almost everywhere, at least with Twice they do. Cheaper MVs, limited promotions, inconsistent album packaging, low budget online concerts, etc so I expect that cost saving mentality has seeped into the rest of the company and the people behind these incorrect decisions and the execution if them are likely not the best people for the job. Probably just the best JYPE is willing to pay for.

  • The thing about these sort of criticisms is that hindsight is always 20/20. We judge management based on their results, not necessarily on what they would have known at the time. I often hesitate to comment on management issues, because I don't know what sort of considerations the managers and A&R team were taking into account during these uncertain periods.


    But you know what, let me pose a challenge. Okay, a business strategy and album planning often starts at least six months ahead of the actual release / events (if not more). So, propose to me what you would do with TWICE for the first six months of 2022.


    Let's make it simple and say TWICE have all agreed to renew their contracts for 3 more years until 2025. And you've been given full control of Div 3, with a reasonable budget. Everyone will listen to you, upper management fully supports you, and there's no intra-company politics, nor will employee productivity decline due to the pandemic and work-from-home issues.


    What would you do with TWICE during Jan-Jun 2022, planning six months ahead?

    • What sort of music should TWICE release, given what you understand of the current music trends in Korea, Japan and the U.S. / global market?
      • What genre should it be in? What kind of songwriters are you going to get for them? What concept will the music video be about?
      • What format and languages should this next album / EP / single be released in?
      • How many releases will you do in the first six months of 2022, and where?
      • Who will you use as a distributor, and what sort of channels for distribution would you set up? How much initial stock will you produce, and what is your policy on restocking? In what amounts?
    • What are you going to do about Jeongyeon?
    • What sort of promotional efforts will you engage in for TWICE:
      • During album comeback promotions?
      • "Off-season" between comebacks?
      • Which members should be involved?
      • What shows / magazines / CF brands should they aim towards, in order to build their personal brand or group brand, or sub-unit brand?
      • How will you use their social media channels?

    EDIT: Bonus marks: How would you change your strategy if the CoVid pandemic restrictions change in the countr(ies) you're planning to promote in?

  • Twice are not every group so no, it's not the same question. Other groups have next to no luck in countries like SK and Japan so have to look elsewhere.


    I'm not talking about BIllboard, I'm talking about the critical acclaim you keep quoting.


    That's the opportunity cost point. By wasting time promoting and pushing in the west what have they missed out? What benefit will this English single bring the group and girls in the long run against multiple other avenues they could be chasing as a group/individuals? Outside of benefiting the company and bringing them more connections I see next to none.


    It's really not the truth - it takes a while for songs to peak in the new system. In the old chart (pre-24 hits) it mattered.

    It's not hindsight when fans have been calling for individual/sub activities for years, Twice being an anomaly in how they've approached it. It has never made sense to have 9 girls who all excel in different things to constantly do the same things. It's not hindsight when people could have told you 5 years ago Twice have no long term potential in the west. You can throw all these statistics about Billboard and critical acclaim but at the end of the day that's not doing anything for their careers in SK/Japan, which is where they will all end up having to have their long term careers. The members or the group aren't built to benefit from that.


    They'd do what has always made sense - start solo/sub-unit work. Members that need a break can have it without feeling obliged to come back for token appearances, something which both Mina and Jeongyeon did to their detriment as the company have made an obsessive nine or nothing culture which fans also parrot.


    Twice as a group spent too long being over-exposed. It has had a negative impact on the members and the longevity of the group with the public. In an ideal world they'd have two sub-unit comebacks in the year ending with a group one.


    Japanese fans don't buy their music anymore and their Korean tracks always do better digitally in Japan so they have become next to pointless.


    I'm sorry mate but some of these questions are just so inane - who would you use as a distributor? How much stock would you produce? Companies have teams dedicated to demand and supply chain analysis. If JYPE's are incompetent and can't do it right I'd fire them and get people that can. Just like they'd do CF's in sectors they're in demand for (if it is still the case anyore), something we'll probably never know.


    Korean TV has still been going on despite COVID.

  • Sorry, but I can't help but notice that you didn't answer a single question or put forth any plan except "start solo / sub-unit work" (without saying exactly which members should be doing solo / sub-unit work and what kind of music they should release), "fire people who are incompetent" (without any clear standard for what is considered competent or incompetent work - such as whether they have overstocked, understocked, or used the wrong distribution channels), and "do CFs in sectors they're in demand for" (without actually stating what possible sectors those are).


    This reminds me of Opposition party politicians who go all out to criticise incumbent Governments without actually putting forth an alternate vision of their own. It's not very helpful when all you do is mudsling the people who are actually doing the job without actually having any sort of workable plan to offer as an alternative.


    At the very least, given your dedication to TWICE's music quality, can you suggest where they should go in terms of musical style for their next comeback? Or if you want to propose solo promotions, then what sort of musical style would suit the member that you are proposing to go solo first?

  • How would you know that? You said you don't care about any other group, what would you know about how they fare in SK/Japan?


    Western acclaim doesn't get them anything. It's actually more of a result. Their promotions in the West make them seem much more as 'artists' than whatever they were doing in SK for the first few years of their career and their music has evolved and reaching new audience which matter much more than success in SK. TWICE has enough of that. Even in 2016-2018, they didn't have a single decently charting bside. That should give you an idea of how the Korean GP views them.


    You choose one. You're angry over JYPE not prioritising the members' careers or just them venturing into the Western market. If it's the former, I think you need to change the title of your thread and the OP as well because you primarily talked about the defects of TWICE promoting in the West (which is the main point of your thread and I have already given my answer regarding that).


    If it's the latter, then I have no idea. Same as everyone. But as a fan, I would rather support them than keep questioning their management and talk about what they could have done/could be doing because it's futile.

  • Sorry, but I can't help but notice that you didn't answer a single question or put forth any plan except "start solo / sub-unit work" (without saying exactly which members should be doing solo / sub-unit work and what kind of music they should release), "fire people who are incompetent" (without any clear standard for what is considered competent or incompetent work - such as whether they have overstocked, understocked, or used the wrong distribution channels), and "do CFs in sectors they're in demand for" (without actually stating what possible sectors those are).


    This reminds me of Opposition party politicians who go all out to criticise incumbent Governments without actually putting forth an alternate vision of their own. It's not very helpful when all you do is mudsling the people who are actually doing the job without actually having any sort of workable plan to offer as an alternative.


    At the very least, given your dedication to TWICE's music quality, can you suggest where they should go in terms of musical style for their next comeback? Or if you want to propose solo promotions, then what sort of musical style would suit the member that you are proposing to go solo first?

    How did it not answer a single question? I gave you an outline of basically everything that can be answered. Japanese releases are near pointless, I clearly think English releases are pointless, so Korean releases. Sub-unit and individual activities to give the group some breathing space.


    I wouldn't allocate I'd ask and base my decisions of that.


    Have you ever worked in a business? How is anyone meant to answer half those questions with any sincerity if I have none of the data? We don't know what demand there is for specific members from specific sectors with CF's as they barely do any. How am I meant to decide on distribution channels and stock levels when I know nothing about the demand they see on their side or if they're routinely under or over stocking? Or how much it costs them to hold stock? or what the marginal cost of production is?


    I'm sorry but what? Do you think one person decides all this? You have specialists in each area and if they're routinely costing me money and not improving performance then yes, I'd surely question their competence.


    The best thing about solo's/sub-units is you can showcase different sides to the group and members, which Twice don't often get a chance to do as they don't promote b-sides either. You'd have the bright summer concept with less emphasis on vocals and more on choreo during the summer and the more vocal heavy ballad/RnB style in Autumn.

  • I would give TWICE another album in November as a follow-up to The Feels. 6 songs, one solo song for Jihyo and 4 bsdies. And start giving other members magazine shoots and CFs and finally open their own IG accounts.


    Minimum award show appearances. Preferably only attending MAMA.


    Give them the entire January 2022 off. Nayeon solo debut with a digital single in March. Pre-release for TWICE's third studio album in May, full English. Then another in Korean in July, and finally the album release in September with another English single as the lead single.


    Chaeyoung's solo debut in November. Assuming touring is resumed, stadium tour in Japan from Dec 2022 to Febraury 2023. Jihyo's solo debut in April 2023 with a mini album. JP album in July 2023. Another Korean EP in August. Second World Tour from October 2023 to May 2024.


    Individual YT accounts and twitter accounts for each member who make a solo debut.


    Nayeon, Jihyo and Chaeyoung are the only ones I see having potential solo debuts. If interested, I would give Mina, Tzuyu, Jeongyeon and Dahyun acting debuts. Sana also acting or variety/MC-ing along with Dahyun. Momo as a dance mentor on some shows or cast as a regular member on variety show or promote in Japan.

    Edited 2 times, last by vzal ().

  • I'm sorry but there's no correlation in that. Stanning one group doesn't mean I'm going to be unaware of the wider industry.


    They put out pop tracks, didn't do much to show off their talents and lacked variety early on in their careers. They didn't have the YG tag BP had who have always been known and liked for their artistry since Big Bang, whilst also not showing their talents off the way RV/Mamamoo did with performances/concepts.


    No it's not either clearly. That's the whole point around opportunity cost. I have a whole paragraph in the OP comparing them to BP's individual activities and even end it asking about the longevity of the members and the group.

  • I'm sorry but there's no correlation in that. Stanning one group doesn't mean I'm going to be unaware of the wider industry.


    They put out pop tracks, didn't do much to show off their talents and lacked variety early on in their careers. They didn't have the YG tag BP had who have always been known and liked for their artistry since Big Bang, whilst also not showing their talents off the way RV/Mamamoo did with performances/concepts.


    No it's not either clearly. That's the whole point around opportunity cost. I have a whole paragraph in the OP comparing them to BP's individual activities and even end it asking about the longevity of the members and the group.

    ....whatever. I am not getting your point and you're not getting mine and frankly, I am tired. Let's just agree to disagree.

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