Is it safe to say aespa, IVE and NewJeans are officially 4th gens big 3?

yes

aespa and nj are definite ones but not sure for ıve and ı think we should wait a litt bit for ıve.

obviously

yes

I'm not sure, because G-idle is also very big.

I'm not following all 4th gen groups and their achievements though, it's just from what I've seen.

I think so although I want to wait a couple of years to solidify their position. G-idle has stood the test of time and scandal so let's see if these groups can sustain the same way.

Nothing is safe.

Quote from echo-sage

aespa and nj are definite ones but not sure for ıve and ı think we should wait a litt bit for ıve.

That's disrespectful to IVE

If not for the sudden debut of NewJeans, it's IVE who would have every meaningful girl group record in 4th generation.

aespa has never had a flop comeback, but they did go 3 years without a massive hit song between Next Level and Supernova.

It makes no sense to include them but say we need to wait for IVE, when IVE have had sseveral national hit songs in that timeframe, winning daesangs and ranking only behind NewJeans on Gallup surveys.

But yes, NewJeans, IVE and aespa are clearly the top girl groups of this generation. The next closest would be GIDLE.

LE SSERAFIM had a chance, but it'll never happen after their 2024.

Nah.

AESPA and NewJeans, yes. But IVE?? I don't think so especially after "Supernova Love"

Quote from Yama-Chan

That's disrespectful to IVE

If not for the sudden debut of NewJeans, it's IVE who would have every meaningful girl group record in 4th generation.

aespa has never had a flop comeback, but they did go 3 years without a massive hit song between Next Level and Supernova.

It makes no sense to include them but say we need to wait for IVE, when IVE have had sseveral national hit songs in that timeframe, winning daesangs and ranking only behind NewJeans on Gallup surveys.

But yes, NewJeans, IVE and aespa are clearly the top girl groups of this generation. The next closest would be GIDLE.

LE SSERAFIM had a chance, but it'll never happen after their 2024.

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Honestly, I don’t believe there will ever be a consensus on this topic. I don’t disagree with what you said, but when sharing my opinion, I focused on something specific: while I see the potential for aespa and NJ to maintain their momentum, I don’t see the same for IVE. In fact, I foresee a decline for them.

When forming my opinion, I paid attention to whether past successes have translated into sustained relevance in the current landscape. As I mentioned, these are just my own criteria and thoughts. For now, I can’t include IVE in this category.

Quote from echo-sage

Honestly, I don’t believe there will ever be a consensus on this topic. I don’t disagree with what you said, but when sharing my opinion, I focused on something specific: while I see the potential for aespa and NJ to maintain their momentum, I don’t see the same for IVE. In fact, I foresee a decline for them.

When forming my opinion, I paid attention to whether past successes have translated into sustained relevance in the current landscape. As I mentioned, these are just my own criteria and thoughts. For now, I can’t include IVE in this category.

Who has more hit songs? Who has more all kills? Who has sold the most albums? Who has the better cumulative stats? Who has more streams?

The answer for all of this is IVE, when compared to aespa.

You can now make the argument IVE isn't top TWO, but there is actually zero argument for IVE not being top THREE, if you look at literally any data or objective, empirical criteria.

I won't dispute this any further with you, since it's clear you refuse to change your mind, but the numbers show that IVE is absolutely a top three group of this era.

Remove NewJeans, and who do you think would be considered the biggest girl group of this era?

It wouldn't be aespa

Quote from Yama-Chan

Who has more hit songs? Who has more all kills? Who has sold the most albums? Who has the better cumulative stats? Who has more streams?

The answer for all of this is IVE, when compared to aespa.

You can now make the argument IVE isn't top TWO, but there is actually zero argument for IVE not being top THREE, if you look at literally any data or objective, empirical criteria.

I won't dispute this any further with you, since it's clear you refuse to change your mind, but the numbers show that IVE is absolutely a top three group of this era.

Remove NewJeans, and who do you think would be considered the biggest girl group of this era?

It wouldn't be aespa

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reaching definitive conclusions or making 100% objective decisions isn’t really my style. I respect your opinion, but as I mentioned, my criteria tend to differ from yours. I’m sure there are others who think like you, just as there are people who might see things differently. Still, perhaps a final consensus will only emerge in the shared memory after years have passed.

It was always them. Idk why anyone else would think otherwise

Quote from CaraFIMIE

Nah.

AESPA and NewJeans, yes. But IVE?? I don't think so especially after "Supernova Love"

Supernova Love wasn't a real comeback, but more like a sideproject. It was a song they performed on their tour and then filmed a quick video for it (also during the tour) and released it on digital platforms. All groups mentioned have better and worse songs, IVE isn't the only one.

Quote from Isastar

Supernova Love wasn't a real comeback, but more like a sideproject. It was a song they performed on their tour and then filmed a quick video for it (also during the tour) and released it on digital platforms. All groups mentioned have better and worse songs, IVE isn't the only one.

I know but overall a lot of people were disappointed with it for various reason.

Quote from CaraFIMIE

Nah.

AESPA and NewJeans, yes. But IVE?? I don't think so especially after "Supernova Love"

Quote from echo-sage

aespa and nj are definite ones but not sure for ıve and ı think we should wait a litt bit for ıve.

They are the best selling gg this year with individual release for both Korean (switch sold 1.7m) and japanese (crush sold 200k+ in japan). They have the biggest world tour for 4th gen gg with 440k of attendance. 5 consecutive #1 songs and several are still charting on melon. Sang in lollapallooza this year and are already booked for coachella next. Name any gg that did better than them in this area and then it will be debatable lol

Quote from CaraFIMIE

I know but overall a lot of people were disappointed with it for various reason.

I agree, it's also not my favourite song from them. But try looking at it objectively - I also see a lot of people disliked aespa's Hot Mess (their Japanese debut), does it mean they're suddenly not one of the biggest 4th gen groups? No, because then they go and release another song that everyone loves. That's why I think it happened to all groups, that some songs are received better and some not so well.

With IVE, it might also have been a complete lack of promotion from Starship for Supernova Love, which is understandable since again, it's not a comeback. A lot of fans only found out about it after the release and that disappointed them. It doesn't mean that they won't have a successful comeback, once they do come back with another album and promote it in a normal way.

Quote from catzi

They are the best selling gg this year with individual release for both Korean (switch sold 1.7m) and japanese (crush sold 200k+ in japan). They have the biggest world tour for 4th gen gg with 440k of attendance. 5 consecutive #1 songs and several are still charting on melon. Sang in lollapallooza this year and are already booked for coachella next. Name any gg that did better than them in this area and then it will be debatable lol

the thing is, I can’t disregard (G)I-DLE. The achievements you listed make IVE a very strong contender for the third spot, but I still can’t definitively decide on the third group.ı want to see more from ıve and gıdle that's all.

btw, since the title uses the word 'officially,' I’m struggling to decide on the third spot. If it were just a casual list of the most popular or successful groups, I probably wouldn’t be this indecisive. But the word 'officially' feels like it carries a stronger judgment.

Quote from Isastar

I agree, it's also not my favourite song from them. But try looking at it objectively - I also see a lot of people disliked aespa's Hot Mess (their Japanese debut), does it mean they're suddenly not one of the biggest 4th gen groups? No, because then they go and release another song that everyone loves. That's why I think it happened to all groups, that some songs are received better and some not so well.

With IVE, it might also have been a complete lack of promotion from Starship for Supernova Love, which is understandable since again, it's not a comeback. A lot of fans only found out about it after the release and that disappointed them. It doesn't mean that they won't have a successful comeback, once they do come back with another album and promote it in a normal way.

I agree with all you said.

But Starship did screw up big time. I don't know whether they were expecting the song to do well without any promotion simply because it features David Guetta but they were wrong either way lmao.

IVE is great. I just wouldn't think its exactly "safe" to consider them part of 4th gens big 3. Things can change overnight so truly nothing is safe lol.

Quote from catzi

They are the best selling gg this year with individual release for both Korean (switch sold 1.7m) and japanese (crush sold 200k+ in japan). They have the biggest world tour for 4th gen gg with 440k of attendance. 5 consecutive #1 songs and several are still charting on melon. Sang in lollapallooza this year and are already booked for coachella next. Name any gg that did better than them in this area and then it will be debatable lol

NewJeans

Yes

Quote from CaraFIMIE

I agree with all you said.

But Starship did screw up big time. I don't know whether they were expecting the song to do well without any promotion simply because it features David Guetta but they were wrong either way lmao.

IVE is great. I just wouldn't think its exactly "safe" to consider them part of 4th gens big 3. Things can change overnight so truly nothing is safe lol.

Yeah, I think they should have done more, definitely. The songs also doesn't have as big impact as their leading tracks, so it may not be everyone's cup of tea. It's more subdued and repetitive.

And I agree things can really change overnight, for any group. But there's still a big chance they will do well in the next comeback. I guess we'll see next year.

Quote from Isastar

Yeah, I think they should have done more, definitely. The songs also doesn't have as big impact as their leading tracks, so it may not be everyone's cup of tea. It's more subdued and repetitive.

And I agree things can really change overnight, for any group. But there's still a big chance they will do well in the next comeback. I guess we'll see next year.

I am hoping they release another hit next year because I will gladly eat it up.

Quote from CaraFIMIE

NewJeans

Newjeans doesn't have a world tour to compare and their albums didn't sell 1.7 each this year. Their japanese release also didn't sell as much as Ive's in Japan. Either way, they are already mentioned as the big 3 and my response was only because you questioned Ive so it doesn't make sense to mention nj when they're already included. If Ive isn't one of the big 3 then it has to be any other gg that isn't nj or aespa.

What truly baffles me is how Ive clearly dominate in physical and touring and how quick y'all are to dismiss them to give place to other gg that may be doing well, but aren't dominating in anything.

Quote from SooYoung

I would have consider IVE locked in the past too

But their recent performance chart wise is very similar to G-idle

The double standards from users like you in particular are crazy to me.

IVE still peaked at #2 on MelOn Daily, just like aespa will do with Whiplash, and their other numbers were extremely solid.

I don't know why you're dinging them for their "recent performance", when the timeframe between Next Level and Supernova was MUCH longer, and no aespa song was nearly as big as either of those 2 songs during the gap in between.

You lost your shit when people downplayed aespa in 2023, when nobody would dare rank them above IVE, and now you're so eager to kick IVE out of the top 3, even though their "struggle" was hitting #2, and the comeback before that was a PAK...

Make it make sense.

Quote from SooYoung

Also i would like to add that hearing the cheering during the announcement for the nominees for best performance gg at MAMA

Gidle, aespa and NJ had a very big cheer

While the public was very quiet for illit

And very low cheer for lsrf and ive

So it does made me think that ive have been on a downward trend these months

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Stop stealing my advanced metrics

If you keep Gidle out of the 4th gen, then sure, it's safe to say.

If not, then just make it a square and be done with it.

Quote from SooYoung

Also i would like to add that hearing the cheering during the announcement for the nominees for best performance gg at MAMA

Gidle, aespa and NJ had a very big cheer

While the public was very quiet for illit

And very low cheer for lsrf and ive

So it does made me think that ive have been on a downward trend these months

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That's such a silly logic

Ive had 440k people who went to see them at their world tour and had 1.7m sales with a single album, yet it's the reaction from a crowd with kpop fans of all groups that tells if they aren't popular or not?

If that's the case then snsd must have been so unpopular when they got a black ocean.

Quote from Yama-Chan

The double standards from users like you in particular are crazy to me.

IVE still peaked at #2 on MelOn Daily, just like aespa will do with Whiplash, and their other numbers were extremely solid.

I don't know why you're dinging them for their "recent performance", when the timeframe between Next Level and Supernova was MUCH longer, and no aespa song was nearly as big as either of those 2 songs during the gap in between.

You lost your shit when people downplayed aespa in 2023, when nobody would dare rank them above IVE, and now you're so eager to kick IVE out of the top 3, even though their "struggle" was hitting #2, and the comeback before that was a PAK...

Make it make sense.

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Yama defending Ive, that's what I call character development, love to see it

aespa's and IVE's stuff are so much more disposable than NewJeans', so don't even put the other two in the same sentence with NewJeans.

what kind of safety are we talking about?

Quote from catzi

What truly baffles me is how Ive clearly dominate in physical and touring

I want to point out IVE's touring in attendance per show is not better then Gidle, just that they did far more stops on their world tour.

They basically did 1.5 of a world tour, as they went to many places back and forth again. Like did a Japan and Seoul, went outside there, then did Asia again on the same world tour.

If I combined half the stops of previous Idle's world tour to their current one I'd get near IVE's result too. Idle can't also tour a very popular country for them (China).

They've (Idle) also had 4 consecutive PAKS including the only one with 4 different comebacks, still on Melon also etc, which you listed earlier.

I don't mind if you personally want to rank IVE ahead, but making it some sort of declarative thing is far from a done deal like you try to make out.

Idle conclusively had a far better performing 2024 too then IVE. Look at the end of year - Idle are basically 2nd for the Daesangs behind Aespa, IVE aren't even in the top 10 this year on MMA.