Do you think ive is the most successful group non big4?

  • they did that

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  • The first tweet just confirms my conspiracy theory that "4th generation" was created by stans of new Girl groups, to not have to compare their faves vs Black Pink or Twice.

  • again this begets the question of what is success?

    metrics? criteria? blah blah blah

    can we even compare metrics that maybe didn't exist in earlier generations?

  • currently yes and not only between the big 4 but also the 4th gen overall

    name other group who has the physical sales, digital sales, spotify + am, cfs and an it girl?

    IVE is the only group who don't have a flop era.


    NWJNS just debuted and I won't count them here because they lack in spotify, am and of course needs a comeback to see their growth


    NONE other group has been more stable overall as IVE like it or not :pepe-use-head:

  • again this begets the question of what is success?

    metrics? criteria? blah blah blah

    can we even compare metrics that maybe didn't exist in earlier generations?

    even if there are metrics that could be compared to, the economic growth and boom sales is playing factor in 4th gen huge number.
    This still can be solved tho by using normalization but, yeah too lazy to do that ^^

  • even if there are metrics that could be compared to, the economic growth and boom sales is playing factor in 4th gen huge number.
    This still can be solved tho by using normalization but, yeah too lazy to do that ^^

    what's normalisation? inflation?

  • emm, in a simple word is flattening the numbers so they hold the same ratio

    interesting I've never heard that term before...

    how does it work like for example let me give you two numbers


    let's say group A sold 100K in 2010

    group B sold 200K in 2020


    how does normalization work?

  • well, after giving it some thought, I was wrong and it don't even needed, since this number is the same type of number and we should use another thing, conversion.


    So we just need to search maybe 2 things:
    1. the ratio of ₩ value in 2010 : 2020
    2. the number of buying power increasement(?)

    searching the first is kinda easy, but here is the interesting thing..
    ₩ 1 in 2010 are equivalent to ₩ 1.16 in 2020
    which means in 2010, won value is a little bit higher than in 2020, and that means the value of won is decreasing over time.
    It makes sense since there are inflation.

    so that 100K sales when converted to 2020 would be 116K (increased)

    or that 200K would be 172K in 2010 (decreased)

    and that means the playing factor is the buying power.
    idk how to find that number, but my assumption is buying power is impacted positively by economic growth (increasement in economic growth = increasement in buying power). And economic growth is impacted positively by GDP growth. So, I assume that I can find a rough estimation of the buying power by searching GDP growth...

    Anddd here is the interesting thing. The GDP in SK are actually decreasing from 2010 to 2020

    pasted-from-clipboard.png


    and I find it funny since what I read in this forum is "the newer era had sales increment because the buying power is also increased".

    So I guess maybe this wasn't the case? Or maybe there is something wrong in my method of thinking, or maybe the site that I used is flawed.
    Or maybe there are other factor like, international sales (china and japan)...


    And, it doesn't stop only at that,
    if we take it a little further, actually there is indeed an increment!
    and it's happening on 2020 to 2021

    pasted-from-clipboard.png


    The decrement that happened in 2019 to 2020 might be caused of covid.


    and from 2020 to 2021 there is a huge GDP growth increment from -0.85% to 4.02%

    pasted-from-clipboard.png         pasted-from-clipboard.png


    That means, the sales affected by "increased buying power" is only happening after 2020.

  • I would look at how much all Kpop artists sold overall.

    If all artists sold 5mil albums in 2010 but 40 mil in 2022. Those 100k in 2010 are similar to 800k today. 🤔

  • you've done your research my friend

    interesting

  • I would look at how much all Kpop artists sold overall.

    If all artists sold 5mil albums in 2010 but 40 mil in 2022. Those 100k in 2010 are similar to 800k today. 🤔

    that's another very interesting take

    one would look at albums sold compared to kpop as a whole and use that %


    what would be your rationale for such a position?

  • that's another very interesting take

    one would look at albums sold compared to kpop as a whole and use that %


    what would be your rationale for such a position?

    I like this aproach. its simple and relative accurate .

    If you compair 4th to 2nd Gen, it would not be fair. Since 4th gen would profit from several criterias like a massive grow of fanbases mainly generated by 3rd Gen groups. So of course they will allways have higher numbers.

    So only looking at how much % of the marked they own at the time they are active seems the fairest without counting thousands of different criterias.

  • I like this aproach. its simple and relative accurate .

    If you compair 4th to 2nd Gen, it would not be fair. Since 4th gen would profit from several criterias like a massive grow of fanbases mainly generated by 3rd Gen groups. So of course they will allways have higher numbers.

    So only looking at how much % of the marked they own at the time they are active seems the fairest without counting thousands of different criterias.

    well do we go overall or if a new group has just debuted (aka NJ) vs a group that's had 2 cb (ie. IVE) vs a group that's been around since 2019 (Itzy) all of them are 4th gen but obviously the group that debuted earlier will have more sales (generally speaking) so how does one account for that (or should one account for it at all?)

  • Kars had those dome concerts and their sales were great for their time

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  • well do we go overall or if a new group has just debuted (aka NJ) vs a group that's had 2 cb (ie. IVE) vs a group that's been around since 2019 (Itzy) all of them are 4th gen but obviously the group that debuted earlier will have more sales (generally speaking) so how does one account for that (or should one account for it at all?)

    You can do overall (Check the groups total) and recently (only the year or month)

    We also have twice and bp. You cant blame twice for bp making much less comebacks. Or itzy for nj debute later. But you can make a different rating only counting this recent year.

  • You can do overall (Check the groups total) and recently (only the year or month)

    We also have twice and bp. You cant blame twice for bp making much less comebacks. Or itzy for nj debute later. But you can make a different rating only counting this recent year.

    everything you've said makes sense...

    so we should do it year by year?

    and look at in any one year group's albums sold as a % of total overall kpop albums sold

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